#1745 Icky Sticky
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Diagnosed at three, Shane discusses growing up with T1D, navigating the college party scene, and his transition to adulthood. He covers alcohol, mental health, dating, and improving his A1C.
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Scott Benner (0:00) Welcome back, friends, to another episode of the Juice Box podcast.
Shane (0:14) Hello. (0:15) I'm Shane. (0:16) I'm 26 years old, and I've been living with type one diabetes for over twenty three years now.
Scott Benner (0:25) If you're new to type one diabetes, begin with the bold beginnings series from the podcast. (0:30) Don't take my word for it. (0:31) Listen to what reviewers have said. (0:33) Bold beginnings is the best first step. (0:36) I learned more in those episodes than anywhere else.
Scott Benner (0:39) This is when everything finally clicked. (0:41) People say it takes the stress out of the early days and replaces it with clarity. (0:45) They tell me this should come with the diagnosis packet that I got at the hospital. (0:49) And after they listen, they recommend it to everyone who's struggling. (0:53) It's straightforward, practical, and easy to listen to.
Scott Benner (0:56) Bold Beginnings gives you the basics in a way that actually makes sense. (1:02) If you've ever heard a diabetes term and thought, okay, but what does that actually mean? (1:06) You need the defining diabetes series from the Juice Box podcast. (1:10) Defining diabetes takes all those phrases and terms that you don't understand and makes them clear. (1:15) Quick and easy episodes.
Scott Benner (1:17) Find out what bolus means, basal, insulin sensitivity, and all of the rest. (1:22) There has to be over 60 episodes of Defining Diabetes. (1:25) Check it out now in your audio player or go to juiceboxpodcast.com and go up into the menu. (1:32) Today's episode is brought to you by Omnipod. (1:35) We talk a lot about ways to lower your a one c on this podcast.
Scott Benner (1:39) Did you know that the Omnipod five was shown to lower a one c? (1:42) That's right. (1:43) Omnipod five is a tube free automated insulin delivery system, and it was shown to significantly improve a one c and time and range for people with type one diabetes when they switched from daily injections. (1:55) My daughter is about to turn 21 years old, and she has been wearing an Omnipod every day since she was four. (2:01) It has been a friend to our family, and I think it could be a friend to yours.
Scott Benner (2:05) If you're ready to try Omnipod five for yourself or your family, use my link now to get started. (2:12) Omnipod.com/juicebox. (2:15) Get that free Omnipod five starter kit today. (2:18) Terms and conditions apply. (2:19) Eligibility may vary.
Scott Benner (2:21) Full terms and conditions can be found at omnipod.com/juicebox. (2:26) This episode of the Juice Box podcast is sponsored by the Dexcom g seven, the same CGM that my daughter wears. (2:33) Check it out now at dexcom.com/juicebox.
Shane (2:38) Hello. (2:38) I'm Shane. (2:39) I'm 26 years old, and I've been living with type one diabetes for over twenty three years now.
Scott Benner (2:46) Shane diagnosed when you were three, two and a half, something like that?
Shane (2:50) Yep. (2:50) Three years old.
Scott Benner (2:51) Wow. (2:52) It
Shane (2:52) was June 2002.
Scott Benner (2:55) How was the weather that June? (2:56) Do you remember?
Shane (2:57) I don't remember. (2:58) You don't remember?
Scott Benner (2:59) But do you I think it
Shane (3:00) was nice, though.
Scott Benner (3:01) What do you remember about that? (3:03) Nothing. (3:03) Right?
Shane (3:04) I have, like, one very vague memory of being in the hospital and, like, seeing a doctor from, like, a three year old's perspective.
Scott Benner (3:15) Mhmm.
Shane (3:16) I was saying, like, a little, like, car toy thing. (3:20) But besides that, I don't I don't even know. (3:22) Sure. (3:23) That was, like, from that time.
Scott Benner (3:26) Are there are there photos of your diagnosis time?
Shane (3:33) There probably is. (3:35) You know, my mother, like, she she keeps photos of everything. (3:40) So I'm I know it was a really hard time for her then.
Scott Benner (3:44) Yeah. (3:44) I was just wondering because I I'm starting to learn as I get older that, like, some of my older memories, they're not really memories. (3:50) They're they're photos that I remember. (3:53) Does that make sense? (3:54) Oh.
Scott Benner (3:54) Like like yeah. (3:55) Like, I wouldn't be surprised if some there there's a picture of a car and you in a hospital, like, and you've seen it. (4:01) Like, that's what I that's what I was wondering about. (4:03) I mean, I could also be a 100% wrong. (4:05) What do you mean it was hard for your mom?
Scott Benner (4:06) How do you know that? (4:07) Is that are those stories that have been shared over the years?
Shane (4:11) Yeah. (4:11) Just, like, throughout time, just from, like, hearing, like, from, like, other family members just like, oh, like, you know, we had no idea what was going on back then. (4:23) You know? (4:24) Like, it was in 2002, so that was a different, you know, time frame. (4:29) And and no one in my family at the time had type one diabetes.
Shane (4:35) So
Scott Benner (4:37) Do they now?
Shane (4:39) I'm the only one that has type one diabetes in my, like, you know, my mom or dad's side of the family.
Scott Benner (4:46) Mhmm.
Shane (4:47) So I guess there is some type two Yeah. (4:52) That goes.
Scott Benner (4:53) I think we all we all know somebody with type two diabetes, I think. (4:56) Right. (4:57) Yeah. (4:58) So Yeah. (4:59) Stories from your other family members.
Scott Benner (5:00) Like, stories like, hey. (5:01) Your mom was struggling back then, or they weren't telling you that when you were a kid. (5:05) Right?
Shane (5:05) No. (5:06) No. (5:06) This was just, like, as I got older, it was just like, oh, yeah. (5:09) Like, you know, like, they just didn't know what was going on. (5:15) This is something that was completely new, and then it's like your your child's sick.
Scott Benner (5:20) Lot of confusion.
Shane (5:21) For for five days.
Scott Benner (5:22) Yeah. (5:23) Like, lot of a lot of confusion, you think, throughout the fam like, through the extended family too.
Shane (5:29) Yeah. (5:29) Yeah. (5:29) Definitely. (5:30) I mean, there was definitely support there, which was great from, you know, what I picked up on over time.
Scott Benner (5:38) Mhmm.
Shane (5:38) So
Scott Benner (5:39) Your your parents married still?
Shane (5:42) Mhmm.
Scott Benner (5:42) Okay. (5:43) Do you remember growing up with somebody more in charge of you than the other, or was it a pretty equal distribution of responsibility?
Shane (5:50) It was very e so, you know, growing up, I was not very confident in, like, checking my blood sugar until I was about, like, nine.
Scott Benner (6:03) Mhmm.
Shane (6:03) I didn't like pricking my finger. (6:07) Definitely did not, like, do my own psyches. (6:10) I didn't like the you know, it can be painful, you you know, sometimes, like, pointing your stomach, your leg, your butt, your arm, whatever. (6:21) Shane, confident. (6:22) Dad would help me do the Yeah.
Shane (6:24) I'm sorry. (6:25) Help change my sights.
Scott Benner (6:26) Yeah. (6:26) Yeah. (6:26) You weren't confident or you weren't or you weren't or or it hurt and you didn't wanna do it?
Shane (6:33) I think it was because of I it it hurt.
Scott Benner (6:35) Okay.
Shane (6:36) So I didn't wanna do it.
Scott Benner (6:37) Yeah. (6:37) So having your dad help you was valuable?
Shane (6:40) Very valuable.
Scott Benner (6:41) Yeah.
Shane (6:41) Yeah. (6:42) And then my mom would take me to the doctor. (6:44) She would do all, like, the, like, the insurance paperwork. (6:50) You know? (6:51) Right.
Shane (6:51) I I two I got two other siblings in my family too. (6:58) So Mhmm. (6:59) She also did that for them, but they didn't they're very healthy. (7:03) They don't have any Assholes. (7:06) Underlying condition.
Scott Benner (7:07) Yeah. (7:07) Yeah. (7:08) Yeah. (7:08) Press. (7:09) Running around all healthy.
Scott Benner (7:11) Yep. (7:12) Are they older older or younger?
Shane (7:14) They're both older.
Scott Benner (7:15) Both older. (7:16) Oh, you're the youngest?
Shane (7:17) Yes.
Scott Benner (7:18) Okay. (7:19) Do you have any other autoimmune stuff? (7:22) Nope. (7:23) No. (7:23) That's
Shane (7:24) type one diabetic.
Scott Benner (7:25) How about your mom? (7:26) Your mom got thyroid?
Shane (7:29) No.
Scott Benner (7:29) No. (7:30) Okay. (7:31) No. (7:31) You don't see any celiac in the family, extended family, celiac, thyroid, vitiligo, any other RA maybe, any other autoimmune issues?
Shane (7:41) Not that I'm aware of
Scott Benner (7:44) Okay.
Shane (7:44) Honestly.
Scott Benner (7:45) No. (7:45) That that's that's fine. (7:47) And you're 26 now. (7:48) How long you've been out of college?
Shane (7:50) Yeah. (7:51) So I graduated five years ago. (7:54) Well, 2021. (7:56) So 2021.
Scott Benner (7:59) Yeah. (8:00) Yeah. (8:00) Yeah. (8:00) So You and my son are the same just about the same age. (8:03) You're a little older than he is.
Scott Benner (8:05) Okay. (8:06) Yeah. (8:06) Yeah.
Shane (8:06) Yeah. (8:07) I I really loved college. (8:10) It was definitely a time period where, like, you know yeah. (8:18) Like, I oh, like, you
Scott Benner (8:20) Wait. (8:20) Shane, you started you started laughing, but only you knew what you were laughing at. (8:24) What what was let me ask you a couple questions, and I'll get you to college. (8:28) Okay? (8:28) So you you you're not too comfortable taking care of yourself till you're, like, nine or so with your sites and everything.
Scott Benner (8:34) That I imagine gets a little easier as you get older. (8:37) You're making decisions about insulin on your own at one age.
Shane (8:42) Yeah. (8:42) So that was instilled into me to start counting carbs at a very early age and, like, not lying about, like, what you're eating
Scott Benner (8:50) Okay.
Shane (8:51) And, like, sneaking food. (8:53) That was instilled into me, I would say, from both my parents, like, hey. (8:59) Like, you have something. (9:01) You can do it, but let us know. (9:04) And how and then you need to know how to count this.
Scott Benner (9:08) Right. (9:08) So they So very honest and direct. (9:11) Empowered. (9:12) Yeah. (9:13) Yeah.
Scott Benner (9:13) Yeah. (9:13) And did you ever have trouble with lying about, like, what you were eating?
Shane (9:17) No. (9:18) But I knew other people throughout time growing up that, you know, my parents would work with or through, like, sports
Scott Benner (9:28) Mhmm.
Shane (9:29) It would be like, oh, like, you know, I have the same endocrinologist as some of these people. (9:34) And we would just I would just hear that, oh, like, your eight wins these 10. (9:42) Or and then, like, mine's, like, eight. (9:45) It wasn't that much better. (9:48) But
Scott Benner (9:49) Sure thing.
Shane (9:49) I'm not
Scott Benner (9:50) I'm not bragging because I had an eight, but they had a 10. (9:52) So, they were definitely doing something. (9:55) But, like, the so did you grow up with any, weird feelings about food, or your parents were able to keep that from happening by the way they talked to you about it?
Shane (10:06) No. (10:07) I I never had any, like, weird feelings about food. (10:12) I mean, more more in the sense of, like, I knew the sensations of, like, having low and high blood sugar without testing. (10:18) Mhmm. (10:19) So I was very much, like, in tune with my body because, like, CGM synagogues exist back then.
Scott Benner (10:28) Okay.
Shane (10:28) And it's like, you know, I was just going based off gut feeling. (10:35) And, you know, if I if I didn't feel right, I would say something.
Scott Benner (10:39) Dude, this vibe with it. (10:40) But I'm saying, like, you didn't have, like, any eating disorder stuff. (10:43) You didn't, like, avoid food, so you didn't have the bolus or or eat and lie about it and hide food or anything. (10:49) Nothing like that was happening for you.
Shane (10:51) No. (10:52) No. (10:52) I mean, there's definitely been days where I'm like, like, ugh. (10:57) Like, there's nothing I can do. (10:59) Right?
Scott Benner (10:59) Yeah. (10:59) Yeah. (11:00) Yeah. (11:00) Yeah. (11:00) Maybe maybe today, I just, this isn't gonna go well.
Scott Benner (11:03) I hear you. (11:04) When did you get a CGM? (11:05) At what age?
Shane (11:08) Yeah. (11:08) So I got it, right around COVID, honestly.
Scott Benner (11:14) Okay.
Shane (11:14) It was like
Scott Benner (11:14) About five years ago? (11:16) Yeah. (11:17) Which one do you use?
Shane (11:19) The Dexcom g seven current currently, but I use the the g six to set off.
Scott Benner (11:25) Okay. (11:25) Are you excited about the the g seven going to fifteen days?
Shane (11:30) Yeah. (11:30) I actually wait. (11:31) Fifteen days?
Scott Benner (11:32) Yeah. (11:32) I think so. (11:33) Right? (11:33) Now what's gonna happen?
Shane (11:35) I didn't see that. (11:36) I I know it's ten days right now.
Scott Benner (11:38) Oh, no. (11:38) No. (11:38) No.
Shane (11:38) I like the grace period.
Scott Benner (11:39) Dexcom. (11:40) Fifteen days. (11:44) Dexcom yeah. (11:45) It's gonna be fifteen days. (11:46) It's coming really soon.
Scott Benner (11:48) I I think, like, now it it's gonna start rolling out. (11:53) Yeah. (11:53) It oh. (11:54) Sweet. (11:54) Yeah.
Scott Benner (11:54) Dexcom g seven fifteen day has earned FDA clearance coming December 1. (11:59) Today is December 1.
Shane (12:02) Oh, okay. (12:03) I guess I gotta use the rest of my supplies.
Scott Benner (12:04) Yeah. (12:05) Get going, man. (12:05) It's for 18 and up. (12:07) It's not for peds for some reason. (12:09) But yeah.
Scott Benner (12:11) I mean, that's it. (12:11) Hopefully, you'll get five more days out of it.
Shane (12:15) Nice.
Scott Benner (12:15) Yeah. (12:16) Awesome. (12:16) Yeah.
Shane (12:17) Does get a little gross sometimes with the tape around it.
Scott Benner (12:20) You think the sticky might get a little icky? (12:23) Yeah. (12:24) So Hey. (12:25) If I say icky sticky, are you gonna tell me that you smoked weed in college and that we can bring this all full circle?
Shane (12:31) Yeah. (12:31) Yeah. (12:31) I definitely did.
Scott Benner (12:33) Awesome. (12:33) Thanks, Shane. (12:34) I appreciate it. (12:35) Sometimes people fight the titles, and that makes me upset. (12:38) I was talking to somebody the other day, and I was like, what was what was it about?
Scott Benner (12:43) Her name was Cecilia. (12:44) And I was like, if you could have just said something crappy, I could have called this Cecilia. (12:48) You're breaking my heart after the song. (12:50) And and she just was such a lovely person. (12:53) I couldn't do it, but you are gonna help me out here.
Scott Benner (12:56) We might call this one icky sticky. (12:57) Depends on how much weed you smoked. (13:00) Dexcom Dexcom's like awesome. (13:01) Pivot right from me to weed. (13:05) Great.
Scott Benner (13:05) Anyway, dexcom dot com slash juice box. (13:08) Get yours now. (13:10) Not planned. (13:11) Not an advertisement. (13:12) Well, it's an advertisement.
Scott Benner (13:13) So she so Shane, so you're taking care of yourself. (13:15) You're counting your carbs. (13:17) You're better with your devices as you get older. (13:19) Five years ago, in college, you get a CGM. (13:22) So you left you're telling me you went through high school without a CGM, and you started college without one.
Shane (13:27) I did not like the idea of having another sight on me.
Scott Benner (13:31) Oh, this I wanna hear I wanna hear against Yeah. (13:35) Yeah. (13:35) Give me a half a second, Shane. (13:36) Like, there's a open window that shouldn't be. (13:38) I'm gonna walk away for half a second.
Shane (13:40) Okay.
Scott Benner (13:45) The Dexcom g seven is sponsoring this episode of the juice box podcast, and it features a lightning fast thirty minute warm up time. (13:52) That's right. (13:53) From the time you put on the Dexcom g seven till the time you're getting readings, thirty minutes. (13:58) That's pretty great. (14:00) It also has a twelve hour grace period, so you can swap your sensor when it's convenient for you.
Scott Benner (14:06) All that on top of it being small, accurate, incredibly wearable, and light, these things, in my opinion, make the Dexcom g seven a no brainer. (14:15) The Dexcom g seven comes with way more than just this. (14:19) Up to 10 people can follow you. (14:20) You can use it with type one, type two, or gestational diabetes. (14:23) It's covered by all sorts of insurances.
Scott Benner (14:26) And, this might be the best part. (14:29) It might be the best part. (14:31) Alerts and alarms that are customizable so that you can be alerted at the levels that make sense to you. (14:37) Dexcom.com/juicebox. (14:40) Links in the show notes, links at juiceboxpodcast.com to Dexcom and all the sponsors.
Scott Benner (14:46) When you use my links, you're supporting the production of the podcast and helping to keep it free and plentiful. (14:52) Today's episode is brought to you by Omnipod. (14:55) We talk a lot about ways to lower your a one c on this podcast. (14:59) Did you know that the Omnipod five was shown to lower a one c? (15:02) That's right.
Scott Benner (15:03) Omnipod five is a tube free automated insulin delivery system, and it was shown to significantly improve a one c and time and range for people with type one diabetes when they switched from daily injections. (15:15) My daughter is about to turn 21 years old, and she has been wearing an Omnipod every day since she was four. (15:22) It has been a friend to our family, and I think it could be a friend to yours. (15:26) If you're ready to try Omnipod five for yourself or your family, use my link now to get started. (15:32) Omnipod.com/juicebox.
Scott Benner (15:35) Get that free Omnipod five starter kit today. (15:38) Terms and conditions apply. (15:39) Eligibility may vary. (15:41) Full terms and conditions can be found at omnipod.com/juicebox. (15:55) Sorry.
Scott Benner (15:56) Silly me trying to live with fresh air. (15:58) Let's start here. (15:58) You had a pump at what age? (16:00) Four. (16:01) Four.
Scott Benner (16:01) Oh, you've had a pump for a long ass time. (16:03) What what pump did you start with?
Shane (16:05) Medtronic. (16:07) The Silhouette was the the site Mhmm. (16:10) I used. (16:12) Well, it was like a manual. (16:13) It wasn't even, like, how, like, they are now where, like, you just click it and it shoots into your skin.
Scott Benner (16:19) Yeah. (16:19) You don't push it in. (16:20) Right?
Shane (16:21) Right. (16:21) Yeah. (16:21) You used to manually do it. (16:23) So, like, I think that kinda stems to, like, why I wasn't comfortable doing it because, like, I was, like, watching, like, needle going to my stomach slowly, and then, you know, it's
Scott Benner (16:36) a bar. (16:37) Like
Shane (16:38) Awesome. (16:39) To do this by myself?
Scott Benner (16:40) Also, I've been to a phlebotomist. (16:42) They're not great at it sometimes. (16:43) I don't know what I'm doing. (16:44) I'm nine. (16:45) Like Yeah.
Shane (16:46) I'm not I'm four.
Scott Benner (16:47) Yeah. (16:48) Four. (16:48) Well, yeah. (16:49) Of course. (16:49) Oh, that makes more sense.
Scott Benner (16:50) So you were using are you using a Medtronic pump with an with a manual inserted cannula?
Shane (16:57) Yeah. (16:57) Like silhouette.
Scott Benner (16:58) Called the silhouette. (16:59) You you do that. (17:00) When do you do you stay with Medtronic pumps throughout your childhood?
Shane (17:04) Yeah. (17:05) All the way up until college.
Scott Benner (17:07) Okay. (17:07) And so Nine
Shane (17:08) one two tandem.
Scott Benner (17:10) And in high school, you're you're are you rocking that eight a one c pretty much through high school or did it
Shane (17:17) I was pretty good, actually. (17:19) Like, I asked my because my mom, she would write them down every time. (17:24) So I would fluctuate. (17:26) Like, CGM overall, I was I should've used them earlier because my a one c has been consistently below seven. (17:36) It's in the sixes now
Scott Benner (17:37) Good for you.
Shane (17:38) Since I've been using them.
Scott Benner (17:40) That's awesome.
Shane (17:41) Yeah. (17:41) So it's definitely opened my eyes to, like, wow. (17:46) Like like, the these actually do help.
Scott Benner (17:51) Oh my god. (17:52) It's a friend of a friend. (17:54) I don't wanna say anybody's name. (17:55) A friend of
Shane (17:55) a
Scott Benner (17:56) friend, just got a CGM. (17:59) And I've been I said to them, I was talking on the phone with them, and and and and I said, you know, when I met you and I realized you didn't have a CGM, I said, I've been worried about you since then. (18:11) And, and I'm just so thrilled that you got one. (18:14) And already, they're seeing, like, yeah. (18:16) Like, there's a lot here I didn't realize.
Scott Benner (18:18) So, like, what did you notice first? (18:19) Putting on a CGM, like, first time when you started looking at those graphs, what was your what were your takeaways in the beginning?
Shane (18:28) Just how drastic over a twenty four hour period. (18:33) Like, when you eat, it doesn't look that bad whether than the first hour or through well, then you look at it for twenty four hours. (18:43) Like, if, you know, if you're not pre bowl of zinc twenty minutes before, and this is where the carb counting is so important, but to get deeper into the things, you know, like, if you're constantly on the go and you're out and about and you don't know where you're at, you go to, like, some restaurant and then you get, like, a quesadilla, but, like, who knows what they put on the chicken. (19:03) It's like Mhmm. (19:04) You know what I mean?
Shane (19:05) Like, there's so many unknown factors, and, like, it's like, go. (19:09) Go. (19:09) Go. (19:10) So I sometimes forget the, like, pre bolus. (19:15) So then, like, that's where I see those, like, sharp increases, and it's just a good reminder to, like, slow down.
Shane (19:22) Yeah. (19:22) Think about what you're eating.
Scott Benner (19:23) You almost said what I what I think is maybe one of the more valuable parts about a CGM is, like, if you're just looking at something, like, close-up right up on your nose, like, you're just like, oh, I'm a 180 or I'm a 160. (19:34) But if you step back twenty four hours, I can see the whole thing in one picture, you go, oh, I don't do I'm not good at this. (19:42) And and right? (19:44) And then it starts making you think about what? (19:45) Like, how do I how do I get rid of these spikes?
Scott Benner (19:48) How do I get rid of the lows? (19:49) If you start putting, what, a little more focused attention on it, like, how does it help you?
Shane (19:55) Yeah. (19:55) Definitely. (19:58) You know, like, there's just, like, certain little things too that I've noticed that, like, when I first wake up in the morning, I don't even eat anything sometimes, and my blood sugar will still rise up. (20:10) Yeah. (20:10) And then that's just a natural I don't know.
Shane (20:13) I forgot what the term's called, but that happens where your body releases a little bit
Scott Benner (20:19) on the floor?
Shane (20:21) Yeah.
Scott Benner (20:21) Yeah. (20:22) Like, you're you get up and are you an anxious person?
Shane (20:28) Yeah. (20:28) I guess so. (20:29) Like, I mean, I I think I think everyone is.
Scott Benner (20:31) You think everyone is?
Shane (20:34) Yeah. (20:34) I mean, maybe you're not. (20:35) I don't know what's I I don't know.
Scott Benner (20:37) I've been trying to figure that out myself. (20:39) I
Shane (20:39) am, I guess.
Scott Benner (20:39) Yeah. (20:40) Yeah. (20:40) Yeah. (20:40) But you say you have some level of anxiety. (20:42) So when you start what what happens?
Scott Benner (20:43) You wake up, the day presents itself, you start your adrenaline goes up a little bit, you
Shane (20:49) Yeah. (20:49) I mean, definitely on my way to work. (20:52) Like, I but it's a commute.
Scott Benner (20:54) So Yeah. (20:56) Well, you drive in or you take a train or how do you get to work?
Shane (20:59) I drive in.
Scott Benner (20:59) You drive. (21:00) And no one by the way, when you're going to college, it all sounded fun, didn't it? (21:03) Like, I'll get a job. (21:04) I'll get money. (21:04) This is gonna be awesome.
Scott Benner (21:05) And now you're like, oh, every day? (21:07) You know?
Shane (21:07) Yeah. (21:08) It's like, I can't walk to work?
Scott Benner (21:11) Every day I gotta go?
Shane (21:13) Yeah. (21:14) Rethink how we plan out city design.
Scott Benner (21:19) Don't know. (21:19) It's like, I thought this makes sense exactly. (21:22) I mean, the money is not as what I was thought it was gonna be, and, every day, I gotta get up. (21:27) I gotta you know what I you know what I as a person who doesn't leave the house to go to work, I am I I don't realize, like, little things. (21:34) I mean, I realize them because I used to have, like, a, like, a real job.
Scott Benner (21:38) But even little stuff about having to plan, like, when to use the bathroom during the day. (21:43) That's not a thing that happens to me. (21:45) Do you know what I mean? (21:45) Like, I go to the bathroom when I wanna go to the bathroom. (21:47) Like but Yeah.
Scott Benner (21:48) If you get up at seven and you gotta be out the door at 07:30, and it's 07:45, you're like, ah, I gotta go. (21:54) But it's too late now. (21:55) You're in the car. (21:56) It don't matter.
Shane (21:57) Yeah. (21:57) Yeah. (21:57) Yeah. (21:58) You gotta wait till you get to Yeah. (21:59) Where you're going.
Shane (22:00) And then
Scott Benner (22:00) you go to work and you're that guy that shits at work. (22:02) You know what I mean? (22:03) It ain't great. (22:04) It ain't great shit.
Shane (22:06) Then then you're waiting in line. (22:07) Yeah. (22:08) There's only one.
Scott Benner (22:09) You and the coffee boys are in the bathroom together. (22:11) You know what I mean? (22:12) Like, it's not fun. (22:14) It's
Shane (22:15) Every day. (22:15) 10AM.
Scott Benner (22:16) Hey. (22:16) What's up, guys? (22:20) Uh-huh. (22:20) Yeah. (22:20) But, like, little stuff that you don't you know, commuting, like, I don't get caught in traffic.
Scott Benner (22:24) I don't like, you know what mean? (22:26) Stuff like that. (22:26) You you saw my biggest work problem is I left the window ajar, and I could hear a leaf blower up the street. (22:31) I was like, ugh. (22:31) Let me fix that.
Scott Benner (22:33) Have you ever gotten to like, but you started working out of college, like, very post COVID. (22:38) Like, you Yeah. (22:40) Very immediately. (22:40) Immediately. (22:41) But you had to go into an office?
Shane (22:43) Yeah. (22:44) I worked in a warehouse.
Scott Benner (22:45) Oh, okay. (22:46) Yeah. (22:46) So you got a hands on job.
Shane (22:48) Yeah. (22:49) Yeah. (22:49) Not a problem.
Scott Benner (22:50) I got a baby job. (22:52) What'd you go to college for? (22:53) Like, what what was your, your degree
Shane (22:55) in? (22:56) Integrated supply management.
Scott Benner (22:58) Oh, no kidding. (22:59) And that's a real, like, skill that you were able to go out in the row and put to practice right away? (23:03) Yeah. (23:04) That's awesome.
Shane (23:05) So, related to, you know, like, logistics, procurement, operations
Scott Benner (23:13) Making things work faster, better.
Shane (23:16) Yep. (23:16) Exactly. (23:17) So
Scott Benner (23:18) What's the dream? (23:19) Amazon? (23:20) Who does it at the highest level?
Shane (23:24) Wait. (23:25) What do you
Scott Benner (23:25) mean? (23:25) Like, what kind of like like, do you work at a smaller I'm not asking you where you work, but do you work at a smaller company or a really big place? (23:30) Like, I I was like, somebody
Shane (23:31) I've worked at some massive company, but now I work at a a much smaller place. (23:38) And, you know, I work contract a little bit, and then now I'm a full time employee.
Scott Benner (23:44) Oh, so you kinda came in to fix a problem, they liked you, you stayed?
Shane (23:49) Well, this is like no. (23:51) This is at a different company
Scott Benner (23:52) Oh, okay.
Shane (23:52) Not where I'm full time at. (23:53) But, yeah, that's why I did. (23:55) Yeah. (23:55) There was, like, a project manager, and they're like, we got this going on. (24:00) You did a good job, sorta extend your contract.
Scott Benner (24:03) Nice.
Shane (24:03) And
Scott Benner (24:05) Nice to hear. (24:06) Bet your parents
Shane (24:07) your incentives.
Scott Benner (24:08) I bet your parents were proud.
Shane (24:10) No. (24:11) It was great work experience, and I I felt really good about what I did.
Scott Benner (24:17) But every day every day they want you there, Shane. (24:19) So does Yeah. (24:20) Is that an on your feet moving around job?
Shane (24:23) No. (24:24) No. (24:25) It was it was more like an office
Scott Benner (24:30) Okay. (24:30) Alright.
Shane (24:30) So style job.
Scott Benner (24:31) I was
Shane (24:31) doing a lot of paperwork, making, like, bill ladings, packing lists.
Scott Benner (24:35) Gotcha.
Shane (24:36) Invoicing.
Scott Benner (24:37) Yeah. (24:37) So okay. (24:38) So I I fun stuff. (24:39) I got you back in high school now. (24:41) You're you're managing without a CGM.
Scott Benner (24:43) You're using a pump. (24:44) Mhmm. (24:44) You got an a one c in the eights, probably. (24:47) You head off to college. (24:49) So you said your note here says, what you said, how diabetes progresses throughout life as a male from childhood into adulthood.
Scott Benner (24:59) How other drugs outside of insulin affect your management of diabetes. (25:03) Yeah. (25:03) Let's talk a little bit about being a guy first and dating and all that stuff with diabetes. (25:08) What what what was your experience with that?
Shane (25:11) With dating?
Scott Benner (25:12) Yeah. (25:13) Like, what's it like telling a person for the first time, like, I use insulin. (25:16) I have this. (25:17) I might pass out. (25:18) Like, I could you know, like, what what what's that like to open up to somebody while you're trying to date at the same time?
Shane (25:23) Yeah. (25:24) And I guess in the dating aspect, it's, you know, it's something that's very important. (25:36) So you definitely wanna let them know, I'm like, hey. (25:41) Like, you know, if I'm not feeling, like, acting like myself, like, I might have lower high blood sugars or, like you know? (25:51) So
Scott Benner (25:51) Is that a tough thing to tell a stranger, though?
Shane (25:57) I to someone that I've dated or, like, in the past,
Scott Benner (26:05) no. (26:05) No? (26:06) No. (26:06) Okay. (26:07) But
Shane (26:08) for sports, I didn't like to tell my coaches.
Scott Benner (26:16) What sports did you play?
Shane (26:18) I played a lot of I did, like, everything. (26:22) I didn't think middle school. (26:25) I did cross country, swimming, wrestling.
Scott Benner (26:30) Okay. (26:30) Everything. (26:31) Like, in middle school, like, high school, you're doing that stuff. (26:34) Yeah. (26:35) Why didn't you like telling your coaches?
Shane (26:39) I don't know, Scott. (26:40) I just think that, like, it was embarrassing Mhmm. (26:45) Maybe.
Scott Benner (26:47) In a in a setting where
Shane (26:49) people to know because, like, I I guess I was sick and tired of just explaining the same thing over and over to everyone because, like, a lot of people growing up in my school district did not I was, like, one of the only people I knew of that had diabetes.
Scott Benner (27:06) Okay.
Shane (27:07) So yeah.
Scott Benner (27:09) You think there's a fear of looking you think there's a fear of looking weak, Shane?
Shane (27:14) What was the question?
Scott Benner (27:15) Do you think there's a fear of looking weak?
Shane (27:22) Looking no. (27:23) No. (27:24) I just, like, didn't feel like you're telling me.
Scott Benner (27:32) You just didn't want you you didn't wanna have conversations. (27:34) You weren't looking to talk to people who you didn't know that well and explain diabetes to them.
Shane (27:39) Yeah. (27:40) I guess I felt like I was like, if I something was that wrong, like, I never, you know, had such low blood sugar or so high that, like Was it led to, like, complication.
Scott Benner (27:54) Gotcha. (27:55) So you were you were you were rocking a higher blood sugar to be I mean, if you're if you have an eight a one c, what is that? (28:00) Like, a one what is that? (28:02) Like, an average of, like, one sixty or one let me figure that out. (28:07) So, so you weren't having a lot of lows while you're performing with your sports?
Scott Benner (28:11) Now did your mom and dad want you to tell the coaches and you just didn't? (28:15) Or
Shane (28:16) They they would. (28:17) They they would do it in the first week. (28:19) They'd be like, hey. (28:20) Did you know, like, Shane has type one diabetes? (28:23) And they're they'd be like, no.
Shane (28:26) You didn't say that.
Scott Benner (28:27) That kid don't talk.
Shane (28:30) Yeah. (28:31) It was just like, oh, that's that's great. (28:33) Like, you know, looking at it now from, like, my age, like, I I would have been like, are you kidding me? (28:40) Like, why wouldn't you tell me?
Scott Benner (28:41) So Shit's like, I the younger me was an idiot is what I'm trying to Yeah. (28:45) I should've definitely told somebody. (28:49) Yeah. (28:49) You're you know, an average blood sugar for, an eight a one c is, like, in the one nineties. (28:55) So you you weren't experiencing a lot of a lot of lows.
Shane (29:01) No. (29:02) I definitely saw at lows. (29:05) My my like, I would have to look at, like, the piece of paper. (29:11) I was definitely in the sevens, low sevens a lot. (29:15) Mhmm.
Shane (29:15) But, like, through puberty, that's where my a one c started to get a little hectic.
Scott Benner (29:22) Okay.
Shane (29:23) So but then it kinda balanced out more throughout college. (29:28) I'd actually did a pretty okay job, considering it was around the sevens. (29:37) I don't think I ever got above eights. (29:40) Okay. (29:40) Then some there's a lot going on with, you know, on top of college and with
Scott Benner (29:48) What else was going on?
Shane (29:51) Just, like, the curriculum, like schoolwork and act and then you wanna, like, be there for certain things. (29:56) Like, there's been plenty of times where, like, diabetes has gotten away where where I can't go out or I can't play in a game because my blood sugar is so high or it's so low. (30:08) And then, like, afterwards, I'm like, I don't have the capacity to mentally go out and and interact. (30:17) I'm like I'm just, like, over it. (30:19) I just wanna stay in.
Scott Benner (30:20) You get you feel a little rocked afterwards?
Shane (30:23) Yeah. (30:24) Definitely. (30:24) I can like, that can happen.
Scott Benner (30:27) Okay. (30:27) And that went on for years?
Shane (30:30) No. (30:31) No. (30:31) I wouldn't say for years, but definitely, like, in high school, starting then into college, and then now. (30:41) So when I was younger, I feel like I was just, like, a little energizer bunny just going everywhere.
Scott Benner (30:49) Yeah. (30:50) So, like, an anchor point for you, like, an an eight to nine a one c is, like, a one to, like, two blood sugar. (30:58) Just just interesting for people to listen. (31:00) Like, you know, if you have a you know, people you're talking about about a 10 a one c, that's an average of, like, two like, a 240 blood sugar. (31:07) You know, it's it's it's it's a lot.
Scott Benner (31:10) Like, you know what I mean? (31:11) Like, in is when you get lows too, you probably were getting lows that were, like like, crashes, I would imagine. (31:18) Like, you'd what? (31:19) Like, after an event or something like that, you drop quickly?
Shane (31:23) Yeah. (31:24) I mean, so, like, right now, Scott, I play hockey, like, every Sunday. (31:32) So and I gotta attribute a lot to this hockey league end because it's helped me get my current job. (31:41) I actually have now.
Scott Benner (31:43) Wait. (31:43) So You you play in ice hockey still, like, in an adult league? (31:47) Mhmm. (31:47) That helped you get you you networked at the hockey league and got your job?
Shane (31:51) Yeah.
Scott Benner (31:51) Nice. (31:53) Yeah. (31:53) And you and it keeps you keeps you moving. (31:56) Right?
Shane (31:57) Yeah. (31:57) And I stopped wearing my insulin pump, you know, as a full contact sport. (32:02) And and now we don't hit. (32:03) Like, you know, like, we we're paying full grown men to go play hockey.
Scott Benner (32:08) Yeah. (32:08) You're getting older.
Shane (32:09) We're not out there. (32:09) Like, I gotta work tomorrow. (32:11) I'm not trying to hit anyone. (32:12) I'm don't hit me. (32:14) But I don't wear an insulin pump anymore because I'm kinda afraid if they get broke.
Scott Benner (32:22) While you're playing, you take it off?
Shane (32:24) Yes. (32:25) So my butcher does spike then. (32:28) Like, the other day, it was bad. (32:30) It usually, like, usually, by the third period too, I don't feel as good as I did when I first started and then the first, like, couple
Scott Benner (32:40) Why don't you why don't you hook back in in bolus once in a while while you're playing?
Shane (32:45) Well, then I have to bring on a bunch and
Scott Benner (32:48) You'd feel better. (32:49) If I change, you'd feel better when it was over.
Shane (32:52) Yeah.
Scott Benner (32:53) Yeah. (32:54) I would like you to do that. (32:55) That's between you and me. (32:57) I don't want your blood sugar getting high for no reason. (33:00) You don't either, though.
Scott Benner (33:01) How long does it take to bring it back down afterwards?
Shane (33:03) Oh, like, my body's very responsive. (33:06) Like, it'll immediately start going back down.
Scott Benner (33:08) So you wouldn't need that much during play. (33:10) Probably just your basil to keep it at at bay.
Shane (33:14) Yeah. (33:14) I'd probably just need, like, two units.
Scott Benner (33:17) Yeah. (33:17) Well, listen. (33:18) You could always bolus a little bit before you start and bolus a little bit after the second period maybe.
Shane (33:24) Yeah. (33:25) It's just like the not having it on and then also just the exertion of playing. (33:33) You know, I would attribute something like like football
Scott Benner (33:36) Mhmm.
Shane (33:36) Being pretty similar. (33:37) You know, a lot of people play football.
Scott Benner (33:39) So Yeah. (33:40) With diabetes, there's I mean, every tight end in the NFL seems to have it. (33:46) Right? (33:46) Like, Andrews, Noah, there's, like, two other Chad is it Mooma? (33:52) How do you say his name?
Scott Benner (33:53) By the way, Chad, your wife keeps emailing me and then not getting back to me. (33:56) You wanna come on the podcast? (33:57) Let's go. (33:59) Other stuff. (33:59) Okay.
Scott Benner (34:00) So so that's what you do through I'm trying to imagine. (34:04) Go through high school, you're not wearing a CGM, you head off to college. (34:08) How does college change from high school, or does it? (34:11) I mean, is your life in high school pretty similar to your life in college, or do things change? (34:15) I mean, the food probably gets worse.
Scott Benner (34:17) Right? (34:17) The weed gets more plentiful. (34:19) Like, tell me what college is like, that transition.
Shane (34:22) Yeah. (34:22) Yeah. (34:23) So, yeah, to your point of food that everyone talks about, like, the, like, freshman 15. (34:30) So I definitely took part in that.
Scott Benner (34:34) Took your took your 15, did you?
Shane (34:37) Yeah. (34:37) Yeah. (34:37) I definitely gained weight. (34:40) I I just remember at the start of my senior year, I weighed, like, a hundred and fifty five pounds. (34:46) And then at the end of the year when I was starting to go to college, I weighed, like, a hundred and ninety.
Scott Benner (34:53) How tall are you?
Shane (34:55) Six foot.
Scott Benner (34:55) Oh, wow. (34:56) You were thin when you left high school.
Shane (34:58) Yeah. (34:59) Well, I used to do cross country, and I was pretty quick.
Scott Benner (35:02) Yeah.
Shane (35:02) I feel like I wasn't, like, Allstate, but I was running, like, six minute mile.
Scott Benner (35:09) You're keeping up with it. (35:10) Right? (35:10) Like, and looking good while you're doing it. (35:12) And then and then you put on weight. (35:13) You put on more weight than you put on 35 pounds.
Scott Benner (35:15) Right?
Shane (35:16) Yeah. (35:16) I I I got really serious with the last season of hockey because I was like, well, this is it. (35:24) Oh,
Scott Benner (35:25) you wait. (35:26) You played ice hockey in college?
Shane (35:30) I did a club.
Scott Benner (35:31) A club. (35:31) Okay. (35:32) Okay.
Shane (35:32) And this is a whole another story, but I so this is actually funny. (35:36) You'll probably find this pretty amusing, actually. (35:38) So I joined club at Western. (35:42) And from there, we went down to team South, and it was the worst hockey game I ever played in. (35:56) We lost, like, 18 to two.
Shane (36:01) My chin got cut open. (36:03) I had fourteen stitches in my chin, and I was like, well, this is no fun.
Scott Benner (36:10) I was gonna say this is this is supposed to be fun.
Shane (36:12) Yeah. (36:13) So Did you bring a goalie? (36:15) Friend. (36:15) You should have brought
Scott Benner (36:16) a goalie.
Shane (36:16) I'm the president of this fraternity. (36:19) You wanna join it? (36:21) And I'm like, yeah. (36:23) So I just do the I just dropped the team, and I joined it.
Scott Benner (36:25) Oh. (36:26) Oh, you were like that. (36:27) Yeah. (36:27) I probably won't get a bloody chin at the fraternity. (36:30) I'll try that instead.
Shane (36:31) What Yeah. (36:32) I'm like, that sounds more fun. (36:35) I don't wanna, like, travel and pay on top of school.
Scott Benner (36:40) Just to, yeah, to do this for club.
Shane (36:42) Just to get hurt.
Scott Benner (36:43) Yeah. (36:43) I gotta tell you, even when you're doing it for the team, it's a lot of effort. (36:48) You know, it's it's a being a being a collegiate athlete is a is a is a ton of effort. (36:53) It's like having two full time jobs. (36:55) Okay.
Scott Benner (36:56) So you dropped hockey, went to I mean, what are we talking about really? (37:00) What'd you pick up drinking?
Shane (37:03) Oh, yeah. (37:03) Definitely. (37:04) Just just how the culture is at a lot of schools
Scott Benner (37:08) Right.
Shane (37:09) Now. (37:09) So
Scott Benner (37:10) How did you manage that with the diabetes? (37:12) Like, did you end up low a lot in the middle of the night afterwards? (37:15) Or how how's drinking impact you?
Shane (37:18) It oh, I didn't have a CGM then. (37:22) So I don't know how I did it sometimes, Scott. (37:26) Like, I I don't the biggest thing was, like, I didn't wanna have low blood sugar while drinking because it's like, oh, like, everyone it's, you know, it's 1AM. (37:39) And
Scott Benner (37:39) Try not to be a bummer.
Shane (37:41) Yeah. (37:42) And it's like, oh, like, well, Shane passed out. (37:44) Like, it's like, no. (37:45) He passed out not from drinking, like like, from having complications. (37:50) Like, it's like his blood sugar is low.
Scott Benner (37:51) Right.
Shane (37:52) Like, that that thankfully never happened because, like, I always still knew the sensation of having low blood sugar while drinking.
Scott Benner (38:00) Mhmm.
Shane (38:01) So, just try to very stay in tune to those sensations that you get. (38:11) So
Scott Benner (38:11) Can you can you put that into words for me? (38:13) Like, how do you know when you're in trouble when you're drinking?
Shane (38:16) With low blood sugar?
Scott Benner (38:18) Yeah.
Shane (38:19) It's just like like like a pit. (38:22) Like, you're just like in your stomach, like, you're just so hungry. (38:26) It feels like nothing's there.
Scott Benner (38:28) Okay.
Shane (38:29) That's how I describe it.
Scott Benner (38:30) So the
Shane (38:30) Like, you just you just have an eight in forty eight hours.
Scott Benner (38:33) Okay. (38:33) Then you gotta
Shane (38:33) eat something. (38:34) You're fasting.
Scott Benner (38:35) You drinking beer, Shane, or or al or, like, different alcohol? (38:38) Or what what was your
Shane (38:39) I sucked at beer.
Scott Benner (38:40) Okay.
Shane (38:41) I did not like liquor.
Scott Benner (38:44) Okay. (38:46) So You still drink today or not as much?
Shane (38:49) I I still have some beers. (38:52) Yeah.
Scott Benner (38:52) Okay. (38:53) So You you manage it. (38:54) I'm I'm assuming you're not drinking to that point anymore, though.
Shane (38:57) No. (38:58) Right. (38:58) No. (38:58) No. (38:58) No.
Shane (38:58) No.
Scott Benner (38:58) No. (38:59) No. (38:59) Was just for school.
Shane (39:00) Yeah. (39:01) Just because well, I I I was, like, pumped. (39:04) Was like, oh, yeah. (39:05) Was like, I might go meet all these new people, and, like, I'm gonna go out and have party and, like, listen. (39:11) You know?
Scott Benner (39:11) Girls too? (39:12) Or just
Shane (39:14) Mhmm.
Scott Benner (39:14) Yeah. (39:15) Yeah. (39:15) So so you're trying to you're trying to meet people?
Shane (39:18) Yeah. (39:19) Like, networking. (39:20) Just.
Scott Benner (39:21) Like how you said network. (39:23) Yeah. (39:23) You're trying to you're trying to you're trying to trying to have sex. (39:26) Right, Shane?
Shane (39:29) Yeah. (39:30) I mean, like
Scott Benner (39:32) mean yeah. (39:33) Right? (39:34) Yeah. (39:34) You're not you're not
Shane (39:35) I I Good. (39:36) Yeah. (39:37) Like, when you join a, like, fraternities, that's they have, like, one on ones and then it's like, oh, like, we're by over a sorority, and we'll, like, get to meet each other.
Scott Benner (39:50) Right. (39:51) Yeah. (39:51) I I didn't go to college, but, like, it all seems pretty obvious to me. (39:54) We have our own place. (39:55) No one else can come into it.
Scott Benner (39:57) We can bring in beer and girls. (39:59) That seems like the whole thing. (40:00) Right?
Shane (40:03) No. (40:04) I mean, like
Scott Benner (40:04) There's more? (40:05) What else did I miss?
Shane (40:07) Well, like, we also, like, did other stuff. (40:09) Like like, we did, like, Special Olympics charities.
Scott Benner (40:16) Oh, you did some check? (40:16) Yeah. (40:17) You did well, that's during the day. (40:18) Yeah. (40:18) Of course.
Scott Benner (40:19) Yeah. (40:19) Yeah. (40:19) I mean, you got the
Shane (40:20) But yeah. (40:20) Like, yeah, like, on Friday night after, like, you know, the week's over because they're you know, like, there's, like, academic standard Right. (40:31) Too. (40:31) So Of course.
Scott Benner (40:32) Yeah. (40:32) No. (40:32) I imagine you gotta you gotta you gotta pass your classes and everything. (40:36) What was it like going to school at that time? (40:38) Like, that's is that COVID post you were you were in school during COVID.
Scott Benner (40:43) Right?
Shane (40:44) Yeah. (40:45) So it was hard, especially when during the transition of, like, March 2020, like, I had some engineering classes, and they were, like, labs. (41:00) We had to go in person for, like, three hours. (41:02) Mhmm. (41:03) And I I struggled.
Shane (41:06) I still passed, but that was one of the only times I ever got, like, a c. (41:12) So
Scott Benner (41:12) It's tough.
Shane (41:13) I just didn't know how to three d model in AutoCAD. (41:19) So
Scott Benner (41:20) From your house? (41:20) Did you have to go home for a while? (41:22) Did they they kick you off campus for a while?
Shane (41:25) Yeah. (41:26) So, like, I mean, I could still go to yeah. (41:29) I lived off campus, but, yeah, there was no more classes, like, on campus.
Scott Benner (41:34) Yeah. (41:34) Were you guys Zooming for a class at that point? (41:37) Mhmm. (41:37) Oh, jeez.
Shane (41:38) Yeah. (41:38) Teams.
Scott Benner (41:38) My son hated that. (41:40) He said it was terrible.
Shane (41:42) Yeah. (41:42) It was well, it was tough too from, like, the professor's perspective because it's like you have your curriculum. (41:47) You have your whole set up for the semester. (41:51) And then it's like, here's a wrench, and that derailed the train. (41:55) And now you have to figure out how to do this through email
Scott Benner (42:00) or Zoom. (42:01) Or virtually when you're used to being in public with in you know, with each other. (42:06) Mhmm. (42:07) Is but you got to go back. (42:08) Right?
Scott Benner (42:08) They what you missed? (42:10) Like, your was it, like, your sophomore year was messed up, or where where was it?
Shane (42:14) It was, like, my junior.
Scott Benner (42:15) Your junior year. (42:16) June. (42:17) Okay. (42:17) Yeah. (42:18) That sucks.
Scott Benner (42:20) Anyway, so you just hit an age. (42:24) Like, I like, you just you just had to get off your parents' insurance. (42:27) Right?
Shane (42:29) Correct.
Scott Benner (42:29) Can you tell me about that? (42:30) Like, was that a big, like, source of consternation leading up to it? (42:35) Were you worried about it? (42:36) Like, what was it like?
Shane (42:37) Yeah. (42:37) Definitely. (42:38) I was definitely worried about it. (42:42) Know, it it's a full step into adulthood. (42:48) Yeah.
Shane (42:50) I'm not worried, though, because I know I can do this.
Scott Benner (42:54) Mhmm.
Shane (42:55) So I would just have to keep, you know, pushing.
Scott Benner (43:04) It like getting that what's it like getting that first check when you're paying for your your your benefits all of sudden out of it? (43:12) Was it shocking how much money they took?
Shane (43:16) Yeah. (43:16) I mean, it's not something that's really talked about in, school. (43:21) So, you know, it's definitely a wake up call, but
Scott Benner (43:31) It wasn't too bad?
Shane (43:33) No. (43:33) I mean, like, I can keep all my bills paid.
Scott Benner (43:37) Yeah. (43:37) Good for you. (43:38) That's awesome. (43:40) Yeah. (43:41) I mean, yeah, that's not a thing.
Scott Benner (43:42) Like, when somebody says to you, like, oh, what are you, you know, what are you majoring in? (43:46) This is my major, and about how much money should I expect to make? (43:48) This is about how much money nobody nobody says, like, well, that's before taxes and before your and before your benefits and before you pay for, you know, all your bills and everything. (43:56) And you realize when you're done, you're like, oh, there's not a lot of money left. (44:00) It done and it doesn't matter how much you make.
Scott Benner (44:01) I, you know, I I saw a young person come out of college recently, super lucky. (44:06) By the way, not just lucky, a lot of hard work, but super lucky. (44:09) They came out of college making $90,000 a year, a lot of money. (44:14) You you know? (44:14) And and I was talking to this person, and I said, how do feel about this?
Scott Benner (44:20) He said, I was really hoping to make more money. (44:22) And was like, you were hoping to make more than $90,000 coming out of college? (44:25) And they were like, yeah. (44:27) He said, I don't know how I'm gonna make it on this. (44:28) I was like, wait.
Scott Benner (44:29) What? (44:30) I was like, in every
Shane (44:31) I guess it's like, where do you live then? (44:33) Because, like, you can live in Kentucky, and and the cost of living there will not be the same if you live in Massachusetts. (44:41) Yeah. (44:41) I Or something.
Scott Benner (44:42) I really I was just interested by, like, how much, like, cost has changed for things so quickly that, like, somebody's understanding of $90,000 was skewed so quickly. (44:54) You know what mean? (44:54) Like, it's a lot I I said, you know, there's a lot of adults don't make that much money. (44:58) And you're, like, you know, you're out of school here, like, six months and you're it's your first job offer.
Shane (45:03) Yeah. (45:03) That's fantastic.
Scott Benner (45:04) You're killing.
Shane (45:05) It's a lot.
Scott Benner (45:05) Yeah. (45:05) Yeah. (45:05) No. (45:06) I wanna be clear to this person. (45:08) Did a lot of work their whole life.
Scott Benner (45:10) Like, they came out of college like a full fledged adult on the on their topic ready to go. (45:14) You you know what mean? (45:15) Like, you there's no training for this. (45:17) This person's gonna slide in and do an amazing job, and has been working really hard their whole life to to get to that point. (45:24) But still, like, like, to hear them talk about the money like that and not be sure, like, is this enough?
Scott Benner (45:29) And I'm like, oh god. (45:30) And this person doesn't, you know, have any health issues that they know of at the moment. (45:35) So not a I I don't know. (45:38) It's just it's interesting. (45:39) Do you and your friends, like, ever talk about stuff like this, or does this not get talked about really?
Shane (45:45) Benefits, money?
Scott Benner (45:46) Yeah. (45:46) Money and, like do you guys actually, like, dig into this stuff?
Shane (45:49) Yeah. (45:50) I have a close group of friends, and we talk about this very often. (45:56) And this is all people I met through my fraternity, actually. (46:00) So
Scott Benner (46:00) Yeah. (46:01) That's become a good a good circle. (46:02) Friends. (46:03) Yeah. (46:03) It's become a good circle for you.
Scott Benner (46:06) Yeah. (46:06) Look. (46:06) Let me look. (46:07) So what else do you can I pick a little bit into, like, people your age? (46:10) Like, I've I've had some conversations with guys your age, you know, on the podcast in the last year, and I'm, you know, I talked about dating.
Scott Benner (46:17) They're like, I don't really worry about dating much. (46:19) I'm like, it's so weird. (46:20) Like, at your age, like, all I cared about was girls. (46:22) And, like and and earlier than that, but people don't talk about it the same way anymore. (46:25) Like, I I mean, college was the last time you could walk outside, walk into a room and expect there to be, like, dateable people in front of you.
Scott Benner (46:34) Like, now it's all digital. (46:36) Right? (46:36) And so, like Yeah. (46:38) How do you do like, are you maybe you're dating somebody already, but, like, how do you do that?
Shane (46:42) Yeah. (46:43) No. (46:43) You're completely right. (46:44) Honestly, it's, it's a you know, the only other place I really go to is like, I had to go out of my way to, like so that's why I try to keep active and, like, do other extracurriculars outside of work, So it's just, like, hockey. (46:58) I'm in a bowling league.
Scott Benner (46:59) Yeah. (46:59) I'm
Shane (47:00) trying to dart league. (47:01) Like
Scott Benner (47:02) Trying to get out of the house.
Shane (47:03) Yeah. (47:04) Yeah. (47:04) I love being trying new things.
Scott Benner (47:07) I mean, are there women at darts?
Shane (47:08) We're not good at it. (47:09) Like, darts are falling.
Scott Benner (47:12) I like that. (47:12) You so you'll go do things you you're not good at just to get out with people. (47:17) Yeah. (47:17) That's a good idea.
Shane (47:18) Because it's like, holy smokes. (47:19) Like, this guy just got a 180, like, three bullseyes. (47:22) Like like, what? (47:24) He's like, I just I just well, I just lost a game of five zero one in, like, six throws.
Scott Benner (47:29) Yeah. (47:30) What's happening? (47:31) I think that's really awesome. (47:32) My son came home with a guitar last week. (47:34) He's like Oh, I've
Shane (47:35) been thinking about getting Yeah. (47:37) Like, an addictive guitar.
Scott Benner (47:38) Yeah. (47:38) He's like, I'm gonna try
Shane (47:39) listen to, like, two thousand rock mainly because my, you know, like, my siblings.
Scott Benner (47:46) Mid That's
Shane (47:47) what they listen to.
Scott Benner (47:48) What bands is that? (47:49) What what where does that put you on on a band? (47:50) Like, what what kind of
Shane (47:51) Oh, boy. (47:55) Let's see. (48:01) Sum forty one.
Scott Benner (48:03) Okay.
Shane (48:03) I like listening to them. (48:04) Blake one eighty two. (48:05) Yeah. (48:06) That kind of
Scott Benner (48:06) I gotcha.
Shane (48:07) Music genre.
Scott Benner (48:08) That's interesting. (48:09) Yeah. (48:09) Yeah. (48:09) Like, when you say rock music to me, I think of anything between, like, I don't know, Led Zeppelin, the Rolling Stones, Metallica, through the Guns N' Roses era, through Nirvana, like then it kind of to me, the rest of it seems like pop music to me. (48:32) I know I know that that's that's not because when you said
Shane (48:34) I would say, like, there was a shift in, like, 2010, like, where pop music took took over.
Scott Benner (48:44) Yeah. (48:45) I know it's not poppy, like, in in the standard, but, like, when you say blink one eighty two to me, like, I don't think rock. (48:50) No. (48:51) Yeah. (48:51) It's interesting.
Scott Benner (48:52) Like, it just be but I also grew up, like, when I turned the radio on, every time I turned the radio on, like, you know I don't know. (48:59) Creedence Clearwater Revival came on or, like, you know, the Rolling Stones or, The Beatles. (49:05) Like, that was that was the radio when I was growing up. (49:08) I remember when, one day, the the oldies the oldies station in my town started playing Guns N' Roses. (49:15) And I was like, wait.
Scott Benner (49:16) No. (49:17) I I listened to that in high school. (49:19) Like, how did that happen so quickly? (49:21) It really freaked me out. (49:22) But now you probably don't even like, you're probably I mean, you're aware of some of these songs because they're so popular, but you don't know Yeah.
Scott Benner (49:28) You don't know 10 Guns N' Roses song. (49:30) You know Paradise City and Welcome to the Jungle. (49:32) You know what I mean?
Shane (49:33) Yes. (49:33) Yeah. (49:34) Definitely Welcome to the Jungle.
Scott Benner (49:35) Right. (49:35) Yeah. (49:36) Yeah. (49:36) It's interesting how quickly music moves, through through generations. (49:41) But, again, like, are you meeting dateable people at bowling and darts?
Scott Benner (49:45) No. (49:45) Right?
Shane (49:47) No. (49:47) No. (49:47) Yeah. (49:48) It's definitely digital now. (49:53) Quite a few of my friends, that's the same case.
Scott Benner (49:55) Yeah. (49:58) Is it awkward, or is it just so commonplace that it's not awkward?
Shane (50:04) I mean, like, it's it can be awkward. (50:09) You know? (50:09) If it is awkward, there's not another date. (50:12) But, I've had good dates. (50:16) It led to more dates and, that have built a relationship out of.
Scott Benner (50:22) Yeah. (50:23) So And you've had and you've had ones where you're like, okay. (50:25) Well, thanks. (50:26) See you.
Shane (50:27) Yeah.
Scott Benner (50:27) Yeah. (50:28) And you've you've disliked people and they've disliked you. (50:30) Right? (50:31) Or vice versa.
Shane (50:33) Yeah. (50:34) Yeah. (50:34) Or it's like, okay. (50:35) Like, feel like I tried this. (50:39) Like, go ahead and meet you.
Scott Benner (50:41) Yeah.
Shane (50:42) Like, you know.
Scott Benner (50:46) But you're But
Shane (50:47) yeah. (50:47) I mean, like, there's only so much time too for everything.
Scott Benner (50:52) Yeah. (50:52) To do that as well. (50:53) But on an app, am I right? (50:55) Like, Sheena, you're you're basically looking at five pictures of somebody and through five photos and something they said that doesn't feel cringey, you're like, okay. (51:02) I'll try this.
Scott Benner (51:04) And then you have to wait to see if they'll try it too. (51:06) Then they gotta look at your five pictures and what you wrote and go like, alright. (51:09) He doesn't seem like a lunatic. (51:10) And then and then you meet for a coffee or something like that.
Shane (51:14) Yeah. (51:14) Yeah. (51:14) I'm very casual.
Scott Benner (51:17) Yeah. (51:19) That's interesting.
Shane (51:20) You know, like like, let's go to, like, the local brunch spot
Scott Benner (51:24) or Mhmm. (51:26) No. (51:27) No. (51:27) I hear it.
Shane (51:27) I don't know. (51:28) Like, if the vibe's right, maybe maybe, like, hey. (51:30) Let's go play a game of darts and drink a beer.
Scott Benner (51:32) Yeah.
Shane (51:33) Like, I don't you know? (51:34) You do that. (51:34) Because maybe you're both beer enthusiasts. (51:37) Do you
Scott Benner (51:37) ever bump into somebody who just wants to have sex and they're not looking to date?
Shane (51:44) I don't really look for that Yeah. (51:46) Personally.
Scott Benner (51:46) There's a way to look for that, though. (51:48) Am I wrong about that? (51:48) Like, it kind of you just, you just kinda
Shane (51:51) Yeah. (51:52) You kinda just, like, swipe Yeah.
Scott Benner (51:53) You change
Shane (51:54) other way.
Scott Benner (51:54) You change what you talk about in in your buy I would be terrible at this, by the way. (51:59) Also, I think Yeah.
Shane (52:00) It's definitely very, you know, it's not
Scott Benner (52:06) very, like Optimal? (52:07) It's not optimal. (52:08) Right?
Shane (52:09) Yeah. (52:10) Because, like, a lot of them now too, like like so when I first using, like, dating apps, like, I use everyone knows Tinder and, like, Bumble. (52:21) Like, that's why I use, like, when I was first in college.
Scott Benner (52:24) Mhmm.
Shane (52:27) But, like, you'd be able to talk to people a lot easier. (52:29) But now if you don't pay for them, it's, like, a lot harder as a guy, at least, to get
Scott Benner (52:38) Oh. (52:39) It's like putting up a Facebook post and needing to boost it for anybody to see it.
Shane (52:43) Exactly.
Scott Benner (52:43) No kidding.
Shane (52:44) Yeah. (52:45) So I now that's how now it feels like I needed to boost myself versus, like, when the apps were so new, it was a lot more just like
Scott Benner (52:55) Well, they wanted people to have success in the beginning because they wanted you to tell other people about it. (53:00) Mm-mm. (53:00) Yeah. (53:01) Now now everybody has to use it, so now they gotta make some money off it somehow. (53:05) This is the part where they make the money.
Shane (53:07) Yeah.
Scott Benner (53:07) So That's a bummer, man. (53:09) Like, it it really is. (53:10) Like, I I don't know that it's that much different in generations past. (53:13) Like, you go get a job where, you know, whether you're a woman or a man, like, if you go get a job in a, you know you know, especially if you're I guess if you're a guy, you go get a job in a in a mainly male, like, you know, ecosystem. (53:26) There's just not a lot of women to meet.
Scott Benner (53:28) And, you know, if you if you're a girl, you go out, maybe they're you're in a little more mixed company, and that might be a little easier. (53:34) But, you know, I mean, you're in a warehouse. (53:36) I mean, there's not a ton of I wouldn't imagine, like, the the ratio must be pretty heavy to men where you're at. (53:41) Right? (53:43) In the warehouse.
Shane (53:44) I don't work at a warehouse anymore. (53:45) Oh, yeah. (53:45) No. (53:46) You're absolutely correct. (53:47) When I do go to my company's warehouse, it's mainly
Scott Benner (53:51) A bunch of guys.
Shane (53:52) Male dominated.
Scott Benner (53:53) Yeah. (53:53) Yeah. (53:53) Yeah. (53:53) Yeah. (53:54) Not what you're looking for, unless you are.
Scott Benner (53:56) I didn't ask you, but you just No. (53:58) Yeah. (53:58) Okay. (53:59) Yeah. (54:00) So what do you so do you live on your own, do you live at home still?
Shane (54:04) I have, roommates right now. (54:07) So, a split rent. (54:11) So it's, it's working out. (54:15) I we have no we we I've been living with the same couple of dudes for, once in a while, three years.
Scott Benner (54:25) Three years. (54:26) Okay.
Shane (54:27) Yeah. (54:27) And I I and when I lived in college too, had roommates. (54:30) Like, at one point, I lived with, like, five other guys. (54:32) Yeah. (54:33) So that was a This is There's a lot
Scott Benner (54:36) going on. (54:36) There's a lot going on.
Shane (54:37) A lot of smells. (54:38) Yeah. (54:38) Yeah. (54:39) Yeah. (54:40) It was, like, fifty fifty.
Shane (54:41) Like, half of us clean, half of us didn't, and then there was, a battle.
Scott Benner (54:46) Just the guy that vacuums and then everybody else just quietly sits there and goes, let him vacuum if he's gonna vacuum. (54:51) What about, it's interesting. (54:54) What what what about that that, having roommates? (54:59) Like, do do you have to, at some point, say to somebody, like, look. (55:02) I might need help, like or this is my glucagon.
Scott Benner (55:04) Like, if you had those conversations with people?
Shane (55:06) Yeah. (55:07) No. (55:07) Every one of my roommates has been very aware, and they're always been, like, occasionally, like, throughout time, but, like, how's everything going? (55:15) You know, like, is there anything I can do?
Scott Benner (55:17) Oh, that's cool.
Shane (55:18) Or just, like, hey. (55:19) Like, here's some snacks. (55:21) Like, I got you.
Scott Benner (55:22) You seem low. (55:25) Has that ever happened? (55:26) Has has a roommate ever come up to you and been like, hey, man. (55:28) Look. (55:28) You seem like maybe you need something?
Scott Benner (55:32) No. (55:32) No. (55:33) They're not that proactive.
Shane (55:34) I think people forget sometimes that I'm diabetic, honestly.
Scott Benner (55:38) Do you like that? (55:42) I
Shane (55:45) try to go throughout the day myself just like I'm not gonna let this get in the way. (55:52) Good. (55:53) So I'm gonna do what I gotta do to take care of myself and then go from there.
Scott Benner (56:03) If I asked you to describe yourself, like, how long how many things do you think you'd have to say before you got to, I have diabetes?
Shane (56:16) Yeah. (56:17) I mean, I I'd be more than my ten fingers.
Scott Benner (56:23) Yeah. (56:23) You'd be going for a while. (56:24) Right? (56:24) How did you find the how did you find me? (56:26) How did you find the podcast?
Shane (56:29) I think I just typed in, like, diabetes one day on Spotify.
Scott Benner (56:34) No kidding. (56:34) Yeah. (56:35) And then it
Shane (56:36) popped up, I was like, Juice Box. (56:37) I'm like, oh, like, obviously, like, you get a juice from your blood sugar
Scott Benner (56:41) as well. (56:42) That was it? (56:42) That was that my marketing worked on you?
Shane (56:45) Yeah. (56:46) It was really good.
Scott Benner (56:47) Thank you.
Shane (56:50) It's very good.
Scott Benner (56:51) My genius overwhelmed you, and you were like, oh, I have to follow.
Shane (56:55) Yeah. (56:55) No. (56:55) And then I listened to it, and I was like, this is very insightful. (57:01) You get to hear a lot of different perspectives Yeah. (57:06) Backgrounds.
Shane (57:08) And I think it's just good that you have this going, Scott, because it I I you know, I never done anything like this. (57:20) And
Scott Benner (57:21) Yeah. (57:21) You're nervous to do this. (57:22) Right? (57:24) Yeah. (57:24) Yeah.
Scott Benner (57:25) Yeah. (57:25) Yeah. (57:25) Yeah. (57:25) Yeah. (57:25) But but why was it important for you to come on and talk?
Shane (57:30) I just feel like, I hope I could've brought a different perspective out of it to provide.
Scott Benner (57:41) So No. (57:41) I just wanna
Shane (57:42) for having the disease for twenty three years, personally.
Scott Benner (57:46) Well yeah. (57:46) So It it's interesting because you made it through some time, right, where you were I mean, you're doing your eight a one c, and you're you didn't have as much gear as you have right now. (57:55) Now you have the gear. (57:56) Like, did you find just getting the CGM and moving to what you moved to tandem. (58:00) Right?
Scott Benner (58:01) And moving to, like Yeah. (58:02) You're using an algorithm, you use, like, the x two or something like that? (58:05) Mhmm. (58:05) Yeah. (58:06) And so was that the difference in the rest of the improvement, or had you made an improvement before then and this just makes it easier?
Shane (58:13) Well, definitely, I am a lot healthier perfect, like, person now. (58:19) I kinda do, like, had, a moment of reflection. (58:24) Be like, what am I gonna do, like, outside of, like, work? (58:31) And it's like, I can't just come home. (58:34) Like, I'm not in college anymore.
Shane (58:35) I can't just, like, come home. (58:36) And, like, I I was like, oh, I I'm still drinking or, like, you know, I I I would vape or any stuff. (58:45) I'm like, this is terrible.
Scott Benner (58:46) Yeah. (58:47) You you working, coming home habit. (58:49) You were working, coming home, getting high? (58:51) Like, you were still in college?
Shane (58:55) I no. (58:55) I wouldn't say I was, like, coming home and being high. (58:57) I no. (58:58) I broke that pretty quickly.
Scott Benner (59:00) That you broke
Shane (59:01) basically, it was just, like, who I was associated with
Scott Benner (59:03) Okay.
Shane (59:04) At the time. (59:04) That was, like, be like, oh, like, I made a pack myself. (59:08) Like, I would never smoke by myself with particularly weed because it's
Scott Benner (59:14) Seems sad. (59:15) Boring.
Shane (59:15) Yeah. (59:16) It's sad. (59:16) It's more fun when you're with others. (59:18) So Right. (59:20) Once I lost the association of people that smoke weed
Scott Benner (59:23) Weed went away. (59:25) Weed went away. (59:26) Okay. (59:27) You did it help you with your anxiety?
Shane (59:31) No.
Scott Benner (59:32) No. (59:32) Made it worse? (59:33) Did it make it worse?
Shane (59:34) You're telling yourself, like, oh, this is helping me. (59:36) But deep down, it's it's not.
Scott Benner (59:38) It's not. (59:39) It wasn't helping you.
Shane (59:40) It wasn't helping me. (59:41) It can help out, though. (59:42) Yeah. (59:42) Everyone's different.
Scott Benner (59:43) Yeah. (59:43) I know. (59:44) Of course.
Shane (59:44) So if it helps
Scott Benner (59:44) you out Yeah. (59:46) Right on that. (59:46) Don't mind. (59:46) Listen. (59:47) I don't care what
Shane (59:47) Yeah. (59:47) And and then it's also about, like, how much you do and when. (59:52) So, you know, if it's Monday morning, I'm gonna have my bomb. (59:58) Right?
Scott Benner (59:59) That's a little different than you have, like, a a pen that you hit twice a day.
Shane (1:00:02) Yeah. (1:00:03) And, no, like, my senior college, I got to one point like that. (1:00:05) Like, I'd wake up, and this is during COVID. (1:00:07) Like, I'm like, what am I doing with my life? (1:00:10) Like, I wake up.
Shane (1:00:10) I, like I don't even eat breakfast, like, brush my teeth. (1:00:14) I just, like, hit a the bowl or, like, a bun and then just sit around the couch. (1:00:20) Know the beards.
Scott Benner (1:00:21) Shane, you know you're in trouble when you start having philosophical conversations with your friends where you're like, do you think we should get a water bong? (1:00:27) I think it would make it better. (1:00:29) Like, you're like, like, how much better does weed need to get exactly? (1:00:32) You you know what I mean? (1:00:33) Yeah.
Scott Benner (1:00:34) Yeah. (1:00:34) But so what were you using, a, like, a heat pen, like, of like, just you're not even burning it. (1:00:40) Right? (1:00:40) Like, you're just heating it up and vaping it?
Shane (1:00:42) Yeah. (1:00:43) Scott, it's crazy, like, how, like, so much changed when I went to college because, like, vapes didn't exist
Scott Benner (1:00:50) Mhmm. (1:00:50) When I
Shane (1:00:50) was in high school. (1:00:51) Now they do. (1:00:53) So and then there was, like, different kinds of vapes. (1:00:55) And, like, there was, like, these, like just like music. (1:00:58) It's like, oh, there's the jewel.
Shane (1:01:01) Now there's a storm. (1:01:02) Now there's a mister Vapor. (1:01:04) And now the list goes on. (1:01:06) And it's like, now after that, I don't even know what they are now. (1:01:08) It's like, I stopped.
Scott Benner (1:01:10) Mister Vapor. (1:01:10) Mister Vapor is a funny name.
Shane (1:01:13) Yeah. (1:01:13) It's like, oh, like, oh, he's got the breeze.
Scott Benner (1:01:16) The breeze? (1:01:17) Oh. (1:01:17) You're like Yeah. (1:01:18) Now now people have social status based on the vape that they have?
Shane (1:01:21) Yeah. (1:01:22) Or it's like, what is that? (1:01:23) Like, oh, he has a breeze.
Scott Benner (1:01:25) He knows he knows things.
Shane (1:01:27) Yeah. (1:01:27) And I was just like And, obviously, nicotine
Scott Benner (1:01:33) is a drug. (1:01:34) Yeah.
Shane (1:01:34) Caffeine is a drug. (1:01:37) Those have direct correlation. (1:01:41) Alcohol. (1:01:42) Weed, not so much, honestly, from what I can tell, and fluctuating manually. (1:01:49) Like, obviously, I'd eat food, and that would do it.
Scott Benner (1:01:52) Right. (1:01:53) But weed didn't touch your blood sugar? (1:01:56) No. (1:01:57) No. (1:01:57) Beer did, obviously.
Shane (1:01:59) Beer, obviously, deal with with carbs. (1:02:01) Yeah. (1:02:01) Liquor, that's you know, depends if you're, like, chasing or mixing
Scott Benner (1:02:07) Right.
Shane (1:02:07) With other concoctions.
Scott Benner (1:02:09) So That's a lot, man. (1:02:11) Yeah. (1:02:12) It's a it's a lot. (1:02:13) Like, you leave, you're a kid, you go out there in the world, all of a sudden, all this stuff is not just, there. (1:02:17) It's, like, readily available.
Scott Benner (1:02:18) Right? (1:02:18) So you're trying things and and then but it sounds like you cycled through it pretty quickly. (1:02:23) It's it feels like you got the, like, the what am I doing part pretty fast.
Shane (1:02:27) And Yeah. (1:02:28) And I also just like the I don't know. (1:02:31) It's like I feel like I've discussed enough about myself where I I like to try something like, go do something, try something.
Scott Benner (1:02:42) Yeah. (1:02:42) You wanna get into the world. (1:02:43) You wanna get to life now. (1:02:44) Right? (1:02:44) Like, that's your I feel like that's what I'm hearing from you.
Scott Benner (1:02:46) Like, you I wanna get out, be around people, do interesting things whether I'm good at them or not, try stuff, try new stuff, keep moving. (1:02:53) Do you wanna get married?
Shane (1:02:55) Yeah. (1:02:55) I do.
Scott Benner (1:02:55) Yeah.
Shane (1:02:56) Yeah. (1:02:57) Yeah. (1:02:57) Definitely. (1:02:58) I I have a lot of inspiration come from my my family, you know, from aunts, uncles Mhmm. (1:03:07) My parents, siblings.
Shane (1:03:11) So Good. (1:03:12) Definitely inspires me. (1:03:14) You know, like, I'm an uncle myself self now.
Scott Benner (1:03:17) Yeah.
Shane (1:03:18) So it's great to hang out and get that exposure too.
Scott Benner (1:03:25) See people living lives with other people around them, people they love and care for and care about and everything. (1:03:30) Yeah. (1:03:30) It's interesting because there's it there's a lot of data that it feels like it's it's kinda funny. (1:03:36) Right? (1:03:36) Like, if you ask if you ask married people, if they're happier because they're married, like, it's interesting how the answers come back.
Scott Benner (1:03:46) You you know, like, people say, you know, they they definitely need people around, and they wanna have personal relationships in their home and everything. (1:03:54) But, but I think some of the data says that, like, people with children are less happy. (1:04:00) But at the same time, if you ask them if they'd not want their children, nobody generally says yes. (1:04:06) But they do report they report themselves as loving having kids, loving having a family, seeing how important and valuable it is in their life. (1:04:13) But, yes, I don't think I'm as happy as I would have been if I didn't have them.
Scott Benner (1:04:16) Isn't that interesting? (1:04:17) Like, good Yeah. (1:04:18) That is. (1:04:19) Yeah.
Shane (1:04:19) Yeah. (1:04:19) I mean, know anytime I go home and I see my parents, like, they're pumped. (1:04:26) So
Scott Benner (1:04:26) No. (1:04:27) They're probably thrilled.
Shane (1:04:28) Oh, they they probably on down the road too. (1:04:29) I'm sure, like, that can just change throughout time because maybe, you know
Scott Benner (1:04:33) No. (1:04:34) Shane, unless your parents are meth heads, like, I they're they're probably sitting around quietly just waiting to see you again, and they're probably just thrilled to see you. (1:04:42) You know? (1:04:43) Yeah. (1:04:44) I it's hard for you to know that at 26, but I guarantee you're somewhere your mom is just like, I wonder when I'll see Shane again.
Scott Benner (1:04:49) Like, seriously. (1:04:51) This is Pretty soon. (1:04:51) Yeah. (1:04:52) Pretty soon. (1:04:52) She has a good I need I need some laundry done.
Scott Benner (1:04:54) I got other things I got going on. (1:04:56) I'm gonna be
Shane (1:04:56) No. (1:04:56) No. (1:04:57) No. (1:04:57) I do. (1:04:57) I do.
Shane (1:04:58) I take care of my
Scott Benner (1:04:59) You do my own laundry. (1:05:00) So how long you think
Shane (1:05:01) She'll walk through that. (1:05:01) She'll be like, hey. (1:05:02) Brandon, I'm like, you don't need to do it.
Scott Benner (1:05:04) Yeah. (1:05:04) But you know why she's offering. (1:05:06) Right? (1:05:09) Don't know why she offers. (1:05:10) She misses you.
Scott Benner (1:05:11) She misses she misses that part of her life that's gone where she took care of you and and you were around all the time. (1:05:19) There's an argument to be made that you should let her do your laundry.
Shane (1:05:22) I I actually just did over Thanksgiving.
Scott Benner (1:05:25) So I bet you made her as happy as could possibly be. (1:05:27) She's probably she's probably
Shane (1:05:28) Here's my stinky laundry.
Scott Benner (1:05:30) She was probably thrilled, like, genuinely.
Shane (1:05:33) So I should give her my hockey bag.
Scott Benner (1:05:35) Yeah. (1:05:35) Well, nobody's gonna be happy about that. (1:05:37) There were some baseball stuff in there.
Shane (1:05:38) That thing stays zipped.
Scott Benner (1:05:40) Oh my god. (1:05:40) There's some stuff in my car when the kids were growing up. (1:05:43) I was like, oh, god. (1:05:44) Just throw it away. (1:05:44) We'll get another one.
Scott Benner (1:05:45) It's horrible. (1:05:46) Yeah. (1:05:46) Yeah. (1:05:46) Just really bad.
Shane (1:05:47) Those t shirts are only worn for hockey.
Scott Benner (1:05:51) You know, at 20, you You're permanently Yeah. (1:05:53) Yeah. (1:05:53) We were just talk how old do you think you'll be when you get married? (1:05:56) Do you have, like, a in your mind, is it
Shane (1:05:59) I have no like, this this time, this day, you know.
Scott Benner (1:06:05) No. (1:06:05) But in age. (1:06:06) Like, do you see yourself married by a time? (1:06:08) By, like, a
Shane (1:06:09) I wouldn't be surprised, like, if within the next four year.
Scott Benner (1:06:12) Four years. (1:06:12) Do you know that girl right now?
Shane (1:06:18) That's that's a great question. (1:06:24) I think so.
Scott Benner (1:06:25) Oh. (1:06:26) Yeah. (1:06:26) Look at you. (1:06:27) That's very nice. (1:06:28) Have you thrown darts at her yet?
Scott Benner (1:06:30) No. (1:06:30) No? (1:06:31) You should take her out. (1:06:32) See if she can throw a dart. (1:06:34) See if she can hang.
Scott Benner (1:06:35) She got a good sense of humor? (1:06:37) Mhmm. (1:06:38) That's good. (1:06:38) You're gonna need that. (1:06:39) Are you okay when she's mad?
Scott Benner (1:06:41) Because she's gonna yell at you a lot over the years.
Shane (1:06:43) Yeah. (1:06:44) Everyone gets mad.
Scott Benner (1:06:45) You'll be alright with that. (1:06:45) Okay.
Shane (1:06:48) You don't get mad. (1:06:49) It's like, oh, okay.
Scott Benner (1:06:51) Yeah. (1:06:51) Yeah. (1:06:51) Yeah. (1:06:51) Well, it is weird when people don't get upset, isn't it?
Shane (1:06:55) Yeah. (1:06:55) I mean, I really don't get upset a lot. (1:06:59) I know I don't. (1:07:00) But when I do, it's very obvious.
Scott Benner (1:07:03) Yeah. (1:07:03) Well, everybody gets upset. (1:07:04) Like, I'm I'm I'm weirded out by people who act like everything's always okay always. (1:07:08) I'm like, uh-huh. (1:07:09) What are you hiding exactly?
Scott Benner (1:07:11) You know? (1:07:12) No. (1:07:12) It's alright. (1:07:13) It's so interesting. (1:07:14) So this girl you know the girl, but you're not dating her.
Scott Benner (1:07:16) Is that right? (1:07:19) I mean You have? (1:07:21) No.
Shane (1:07:23) No. (1:07:23) That it's just something very new.
Scott Benner (1:07:25) It's something oh, it's a new oh, you've met a new person that you're that you think might be the right person.
Shane (1:07:30) Yeah. (1:07:31) I mean, I didn't date for a very long time, Scott. (1:07:34) So
Scott Benner (1:07:35) Because
Shane (1:07:35) I did that on purpose after college. (1:07:38) I'm like, I'm just gonna focus on work, finally making more, like, money. (1:07:45) Mhmm. (1:07:46) I need to.
Scott Benner (1:07:47) Yeah.
Shane (1:07:47) You know? (1:07:48) Like like, things are starting to get real now. (1:07:51) So, really went on, like, a journey of just, like, trying new things out, trying to meet more people, expand on stuff I love. (1:08:04) So I think in my email, I sent you reaching out. (1:08:12) Actually, I mentioned, like, doing long distance running.
Shane (1:08:17) So I found people that once I moved away from college to where I'm at now
Scott Benner (1:08:23) Yeah.
Shane (1:08:25) It really inspired me to really achieve, like, those milestones of, like, running a half marathon
Scott Benner (1:08:32) Mhmm.
Shane (1:08:33) A 25 k and a marathon. (1:08:39) And I'm really happy I did all that, but I don't think at now, at this moment, I would ever wanna do a marathon again. (1:08:50) Maybe a half an hour, but a marathon is just way too much.
Scott Benner (1:08:54) There's a lot of effort.
Shane (1:08:55) Especially being diabetic. (1:08:56) Yeah. (1:08:57) Like, I don't know how I did it when I
Scott Benner (1:09:00) did it. (1:09:01) Did you have a lot of supplies with you while you were running?
Shane (1:09:04) I had so much Gatorade. (1:09:07) I had, like, a belt wrapped around me. (1:09:12) And then
Scott Benner (1:09:13) You're like it was Gatorade. (1:09:14) You're like Batman with Gatorade going for a run.
Shane (1:09:17) Yeah. (1:09:18) Yeah. (1:09:18) I was the only person with Gatorade to strap on in the in the race. (1:09:24) I can see.
Scott Benner (1:09:25) I think the, the image for your episode will just be Batman in a marathon with food around his waist and and a really old sticky CGM cover.
Shane (1:09:35) Well, you also have to eat so much food and, like like, the amount of carbs that go into it. (1:09:40) And I'm like, I just can't do this for, like, a guy that's my size. (1:09:44) Like, I'm six foot, and I'm, like, two hundred ten pounds now. (1:09:48) Like, I actually gained weight from
Scott Benner (1:09:50) from trying to run. (1:09:51) Because, yeah, because you were feeding so many lows.
Shane (1:09:54) Yes. (1:09:54) Like, I would do my lawn run with my train buddy every Saturday. (1:10:05) And the longest one that we did got up to 20 miles at one
Scott Benner (1:10:09) Jeez.
Shane (1:10:09) At one point. (1:10:11) And I wouldn't be able to, like, move, like, walk downstairs. (1:10:15) I am like I'm like, this is brutal. (1:10:18) No. (1:10:18) If I drive me a It takes, like, three hours to do it.
Scott Benner (1:10:22) Oh my god. (1:10:23) If I had to drive 20 miles, I'd be irritated once a week. (1:10:26) But
Shane (1:10:29) it was the it was so much fun because, like, you have like, I listen to music.
Scott Benner (1:10:35) Yeah.
Shane (1:10:36) So I got to, like, really, like, dive into muse like, more. (1:10:41) And, I didn't listen to podcast. (1:10:44) I did not
Scott Benner (1:10:45) Is it hard?
Shane (1:10:46) Listen to music. (1:10:47) Yeah. (1:10:47) You listen to music when you're ready. (1:10:48) I listened to music the whole time during my actual race.
Scott Benner (1:10:52) That makes sense.
Shane (1:10:52) Like, I made a playlist that was four hours long. (1:10:55) And I'm like, okay. (1:10:56) If I make it to this song, I know I didn't finish Yeah. (1:11:02) In my time.
Scott Benner (1:11:02) I have an I have a last question for you. (1:11:04) Did when you found the podcast, did you did you listen to the management stuff? (1:11:09) Like, did you care for the pro tip series, for example, or did you get your information out of conversations?
Shane (1:11:14) Yeah. (1:11:15) I listened to the pro tip series. (1:11:17) I I was very sporadic in listening to the podcast. (1:11:23) Mhmm. (1:11:24) I'm very sporadic in general general.
Shane (1:11:28) But yeah. (1:11:31) No. (1:11:32) Listening to your protest series and just like it's a nice reminder for stuff I already know
Scott Benner (1:11:40) Mhmm.
Shane (1:11:40) That I've been told throughout time just to be like, oh, yeah. (1:11:44) Or just you know, like, I need those those reminders.
Scott Benner (1:11:49) The reminders. (1:11:50) It keeps it in your head. (1:11:51) Right?
Shane (1:11:52) Yes. (1:11:52) Yeah.
Scott Benner (1:11:53) I I
Shane (1:11:54) Even though, like, I've dealt with this for twenty plus years, so it's still need to be reminded.
Scott Benner (1:12:00) Right. (1:12:01) Right. (1:12:01) No. (1:12:01) I I agree with you. (1:12:02) I think it it's very valuable like that for people.
Scott Benner (1:12:04) Did your a one c or your variability get better when you were listening, or does is it better when you're listening?
Shane (1:12:11) Yeah. (1:12:12) I would say so far, there is a correlation with that. (1:12:15) It's definitely very in par with using a CGM.
Scott Benner (1:12:19) Mhmm.
Shane (1:12:20) But, yeah, my last a one c was a 6.4.
Scott Benner (1:12:26) Good for you, man.
Shane (1:12:27) I hear
Scott Benner (1:12:27) That's awesome. (1:12:28) You're 26. (1:12:28) You get a 6.4. (1:12:29) You're making money. (1:12:30) You got your eye on a lady.
Scott Benner (1:12:32) You might have you might be you might have a baby eight years from now.
Shane (1:12:37) Very true. (1:12:38) Yeah.
Scott Benner (1:12:38) You would you worry about diabetes for the baby?
Shane (1:12:41) Yes. (1:12:42) This podcast has actually opened up my eyes to to that.
Scott Benner (1:12:48) So you you know what to look out for you know what to look out for then? (1:12:51) Mhmm. (1:12:52) Okay. (1:12:53) Yeah. (1:12:53) It's a lot, man.
Scott Benner (1:12:54) Life's big. (1:12:54) You know? (1:12:56) Yeah. (1:12:56) Yeah. (1:12:57) How do you think you're doing?
Scott Benner (1:12:58) Like, if I I I know I that was my last question. (1:13:02) This is my last question. (1:13:03) How are you doing? (1:13:05) And and how what are your what are your expectations for the future? (1:13:12) Do you think you're gonna do well, like, with your health?
Scott Benner (1:13:14) Like, do you feel generally positive, generally neutral? (1:13:17) Like, how do you feel about the future?
Shane (1:13:19) Right now, I'm doing a lot better than I was two years ago, I would say, in a multitude of aspects from, like, mentally, mentally, physically, financially, really taking that time for twelve months to set aside, to really think about the future and
Scott Benner (1:13:44) Pull yourself together a little bit.
Shane (1:13:46) Yeah. (1:13:47) Yeah. (1:13:47) Yeah. (1:13:48) And I am definitely a little worried just because, like, you know, I just in the sense that, like you know, like, I don't know what diabetes is gonna do to me, like, in complications.
Scott Benner (1:14:14) You're worried you're worried that something unforeseen could happen.
Shane (1:14:17) Yeah. (1:14:18) I mean, that's life, though.
Scott Benner (1:14:19) Yeah. (1:14:20) You're right. (1:14:20) I I think that is life. (1:14:21) Also, I mean, listen. (1:14:22) Keep your a one c where it's at.
Scott Benner (1:14:24) Keep it nice and stable. (1:14:25) Don't have a lot of lows. (1:14:25) Don't have a bunch of highs that you ignore, and I think you got a real good shot. (1:14:29) You know what I mean?
Shane (1:14:30) Mhmm.
Scott Benner (1:14:30) Yeah. (1:14:31) No. (1:14:31) It's interesting. (1:14:31) If if I could have gone back, like you said, you're better off now than you were two years ago. (1:14:35) If I go back three years ago, is there anything I could have said to 23 year old Shane that would have snapped him out of it, or did you have to go through this process?
Shane (1:14:44) I think I had to just go through this process. (1:14:48) Yeah.
Scott Benner (1:14:48) Yeah. (1:14:49) I think I believe that too.
Shane (1:14:51) Okay. (1:14:51) Yeah.
Scott Benner (1:14:51) Alright, Shane. (1:14:52) I appreciate you doing this. (1:14:53) I really, thank you very much for taking the time, and I know I had a little technical thing in the beginning. (1:14:57) I appreciate you being, patient about that. (1:14:59) No.
Shane (1:15:00) Of course. (1:15:00) Thank you, Scott. (1:15:01) I really appreciate your time today too and and talking with you, and no worries about that. (1:15:06) I'm glad we got the the all work out. (1:15:09) So
Scott Benner (1:15:09) Yeah. (1:15:09) This is awesome. (1:15:10) Thank you so much, man. (1:15:12) Hold on one second for me. (1:15:13) Yep.
Scott Benner (1:15:18) This episode of the Juice Box podcast is sponsored by Omnipod five. (1:15:23) Omnipod five is a tube free automated insulin delivery system that's been shown to significantly improve a one c and time and range for people with type one diabetes when they've switched from daily injections. (1:15:34) Learn more and get started today at omnipod.com/juicebox. (1:15:39) At my link, you can get a free starter kit right now. (1:15:41) Terms and conditions apply.
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#1744 Life Coach: Empty Nest
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Today's guest has question, Scott has answers (maybe).
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DISCLAIMER: This text is the output of AI based transcribing from an audio recording. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors and should not be treated as an authoritative record. Nothing that you read here constitutes advice medical or otherwise. Always consult with a healthcare professional before making changes to a healthcare plan.
Scott Benner (0:00) Hello, friends, and welcome back to another episode of the Juice Box podcast. (0:13) This is part two of a two part episode. (0:16) Go look at the title. (0:17) If you don't recognize it, you haven't heard part one yet. (0:20) It's probably the episode right before this in your podcast player.
Scott Benner (0:28) Nothing you hear on the Juice Box podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise. (0:33) Always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan or becoming bold with insulin. (0:44) My diabetes pro tip series is about cutting through the clutter of diabetes management to give you the straightforward practical insights that truly make a difference. (0:53) This series is all about mastering the fundamentals, whether it's the basics of insulin, dosing adjustments, or everyday management strategies that will empower you to take control. (1:03) I'm joined by Jenny Smith, who is a diabetes educator with over thirty five years of personal experience, and we break down complex concepts into simple, actionable tips.
Scott Benner (1:13) The diabetes pro tip series runs between episode one thousand and one thousand twenty five in your podcast player, or you can listen to it at juiceboxpodcast.com by going up into the menu. (1:31) This episode of the Juice Box podcast is sponsored by Omnipod five. (1:35) Omnipod five is a tube free automated insulin delivery system that's been shown to significantly improve a one c and time and range for people with type one diabetes when they've switched from daily injections. (1:46) Learn more and get started today at omnipod.com/juicebox. (1:51) At my link, you can get a free starter kit right now.
Scott Benner (1:53) Terms and conditions apply. (1:55) Eligibility may vary. (1:56) Full terms and conditions can be found at omnipod.com/juicebox. (2:02) The podcast is also sponsored today by US Med, usmed.com/juicebox, or call (888) 721-1514. (2:12) You can get your diabetes testing supplies the same way we do from US Med.
Scott Benner (2:17) I said, here's what I really think. (2:18) I think if you go on an algorithm, you'll be able to sleep better. (2:21) And I think and I think you won't know how much that's gonna change your life until you've had it for a month.
Liesl (2:27) Yeah.
Scott Benner (2:27) And then I I and I stopped myself and I said, and here's another thing. (2:32) Let's be more honest. (2:33) I said, there are days, chunks of my daughter's day where she boluses for her food, and then she goes off and does something. (2:41) She goes to class where she sits with her boyfriend or she, you know, goes out with her friends. (2:47) And because an algorithm is making changes to her insulin during that time based on her data, she doesn't really pay that close attention to her diabetes.
Scott Benner (2:57) Mhmm. (2:57) And and it's not that she's not aware of it. (2:59) It's not that she won't do something if, you know, if something really comes up or whatnot. (3:05) But she doesn't have to, like, go, oh, no. (3:07) It went to one twenty.
Scott Benner (3:09) I got a bolus or it's gonna go to one fifty. (3:12) Like like yeah. (3:12) Like, you know, she goes to one twenty, and the damn thing gives her insulin. (3:16) Then and then it stops. (3:18) Right?
Scott Benner (3:18) And and then, you know, and then if she tries to get low, it stops again. (3:21) I was like, so in my mind, when you're asking me, should I get a pump? (3:26) I think yes because Mhmm. (3:29) Of what it lifts from you that you can't really quantify, and you won't know until it happens. (3:36) Anyway, I wonder
Liesl (3:38) what Some it shoulders some of the burden for her, doesn't it?
Scott Benner (3:41) Oh, I mean, I'll it it when you sit in a conversation like this and go back to 50 calories today, a 100 tomorrow so that you'll die more slowly, well, it's doing more than shouldering the burden. (3:53) Right? (3:54) Right. (3:54) Like like, right, if you if you have if you have that kind of context when you're thinking about it, it's magic. (4:00) If you were diagnosed a year and a half ago, it's shouldering the burden.
Scott Benner (4:04) Yeah. (4:05) So your perspective has a lot to do with what you see it as a part of these con what I like about these conversations is that I hope to alleviate some of the the mental anxiety that people have and the burden that they have Yeah. (4:17) Because they live in a modern society where they're accustomed to everything kinda working the way it's supposed to and, diabetes then feels like it's not. (4:24) But I'm telling you just and say to yourself, holy shit. (4:29) I'm getting away with something here.
Scott Benner (4:31) Yeah. (4:31) You know? (4:32) Yeah.
Liesl (4:32) I I still think it's important for me as a health care professional and just as a person to recognize that I need to be careful that it doesn't come across as, well, I know you've got type one, but you should be grateful you've got the tech because there was a time when it wasn't available.
Scott Benner (4:49) Yeah. (4:49) I know. (4:49) I don't I wouldn't say that to somebody, but I do think it's important that they understand it.
Liesl (4:53) Yeah. (4:54) Yeah. (4:54) And and I and I know that you wouldn't do that, but I I just just say that people understand that just because the tech's there doesn't mean that I would expect somebody with type one diabetes to be a whiz at it just because the tech is there. (5:05) Yeah. (5:05) The tech is great.
Liesl (5:07) And as we've said, it takes some of the burden away, but you've still got that wet towel draped around your shoulders.
Scott Benner (5:13) Yep. (5:13) And you still
Liesl (5:14) have earlier. (5:15) So
Scott Benner (5:15) You also still have the rest of what Daphne's doing for people because that technology is basically useless if you don't understand glycemic load, glycemic impact, how to change your settings, you know, how to bolus for fat in your food. (5:28) Like, if you don't have those ideas, it's still gonna seem chaotic. (5:32) Yeah. (5:32) Yeah.
Liesl (5:33) Yeah. (5:33) And I think that's a really good point, Scott, because when we look at our data every year, we've looked at our we look at our that we call it our key performance indicator data. (5:42) So it's what happens to people's h b a one c when they've done a Daphne course a year later, their severe hypo rates, their DKA rates. (5:50) And I guess I thought that once people had the CGM and the tech that they would have a lower h b a one c before they did the course anyway, or they wouldn't have as much DKA. (6:02) There wouldn't be so many severe hypos.
Liesl (6:04) But what we're seeing is that people are coming in with the advantage of the tech already, but they're still achieving the same degree of reduction in their h h b a one c than they were when everyone was doing finger pricking. (6:17) They're still seeing the same reduction in severe hypos, the same reduction in DKA. (6:22) So that just goes hand in hand with what you said, which is if you give somebody the tech, they can achieve a lot. (6:28) But you give them the tech and the education, and it's it's boundless what they could achieve. (6:34) You know?
Liesl (6:35) It it just at least can double what they can achieve if they're given the opportunity. (6:39) And part of my job is to try and make sure that they get given that opportunity.
Scott Benner (6:43) Mhmm. (6:44) No. (6:44) It's wonderful. (6:44) Also, I mean, to be completely candid that the the human condition still exists no matter what level of technology you have or what level of of education you have. (6:54) And the the feeling that, like, our bodies aren't supposed to work this way.
Scott Benner (7:00) Like, you're not supposed to have to think breathe in, breathe out, you know, or, you know, you know, you you imagine if I said to you, look. (7:07) Hey. (7:08) Here's the problem. (7:09) Your heart's not gonna beat if you don't consciously think beat beat beat beat beat for the rest of your life. (7:16) You'd be dead in three minutes.
Scott Benner (7:17) You you you know what I mean? (7:18) Like and and the and you are asking people with diabetes to do that. (7:21) You're asking them to be to be a pancreas, to be aware of how a number of different systems work and how food and and exercise and stress and all, know, and everything else impacts those systems. (7:34) And the truth is is, like, none of us really understand it well enough. (7:38) No.
Scott Benner (7:38) And, you know, so you give them what what I have found is that there's there's, like, kinda hallmarks. (7:45) And if they have the hallmarks, they can do well. (7:47) Like and I mean that very simply, you know, understanding the impacts of their food, understanding how to time insulin against those impacts, understanding seriously how fat and protein impact their blood sugars, the you give them the autonomy to make changes to their settings that they don't feel like they have to wait for someone to tell them that their basil's not strong enough or not weak enough that they, you know, that they should bolus again. (8:13) That you don't saddle them with the idea that every if they bolus without food, it's stacking when that's not always true. (8:20) Like, great.
Scott Benner (8:20) Like, if you can give them those kinds of hallmarks, then most people
Liesl (8:25) Absolutely.
Scott Benner (8:25) Most people can make the rest of the leaps. (8:27) They can they can they can draw the rest of the lines themselves. (8:31) That's been my finding over and over again is that there's there's some basic fundamental foundational stuff. (8:38) And once you give it to them in a way that they understand it and hopefully they're motivated to do something with it, they have a lot of success after that.
Liesl (8:46) Yeah. (8:46) Yeah. (8:46) And I I had somebody on one of my Daphne courses years ago, and she said, look. (8:50) She said, I don't really understand how all of this works, but I don't understand how my car works. (8:56) She said, I just know where to put my feet and where to put my hands, and I trust it to get me from a to b.
Scott Benner (9:00) Perfect.
Liesl (9:01) So if I know what to do with Daphne, I might I don't have to understand the ins and outs of it as long as I know what to do when. (9:09) I know I'll get to where I want to go. (9:11) And I thought that was quite quite a good analogy of there's lots of things we do in life. (9:16) We don't understand how an airplane takes off the ground, but we trust that the pilot knows how to do it, so we just jump on board. (9:22) And she jumped on board with a Daphne course saying, I don't really quite understand, but I trust you, and I trust the process, and I'm just gonna get on board with it.
Liesl (9:31) And and I think that takes tremendous courage and a degree a huge degree of trust in somebody like me to be providing her with the right information.
Scott Benner (9:40) It's also thoughtful. (9:42) It's incredibly thoughtful. (9:44) And here's a secret that's not much of a secret if people are listening. (9:47) There's a lot about this I don't understand either. (9:50) And yet, there might be I I am I had to put this.
Scott Benner (9:56) I don't wanna sound like an asshole. (9:57) But, like, like, if there's a hierarchy to who's reaching people and helping people with diabetes, I've gotta be up in the top of it. (10:04) And there are plenty about it that I fundamentally, like, on a technical or scientific level, I don't I struggle all the time. (10:11) I say stuff all the time where I'm like, I don't really understand that. (10:14) But what I've learned is I don't it doesn't matter.
Scott Benner (10:17) Like like, what matters is understanding the fundamental stuff and being able to communicate it. (10:22) Yeah. (10:22) Yeah. (10:22) And and I don't need to be perfect or have, you know, a PhD level of understanding about, you know, a lot a lot of functions in the body, which by the way, I can't even pronounce little and explain to you. (10:35) Yes.
Scott Benner (10:35) And it and it and it it doesn't it doesn't matter. (10:39) Like, would matter if I was gonna be your surgeon. (10:42) Okay? (10:42) It would matter if I was gonna be teaching a course at at medical school. (10:46) It doesn't matter if I'm just the guy saying, like, look.
Scott Benner (10:49) When you eat a cheeseburger with french fries, there's fat in the fries. (10:52) And about an hour after you eat, you're gonna see a rise coming in your blood sugar, and that rise needs more insulin. (10:57) And there's a quick formula you can use to try to figure out about how much fat was in there and how that translates to insulin, and then you can put that bolus in Yeah. (11:05) And then the rise never happens. (11:06) Your blood sugar doesn't stay high for four hours afterwards.
Scott Benner (11:09) And you don't put in a bunch of insulin and get super low later and then take in a bunch of fast acting then it goes back up again, and then you lose your goddamn mind and you stop taking care of yourself. (11:18) Right? (11:18) Like
Liesl (11:19) Yeah.
Scott Benner (11:19) That that's the part I know for sure.
Liesl (11:22) And I think the frustrating thing when the thing that does frustrate people when they come on a Daphne course is there's so much that that we can't just say, do this plus that, and you'll get success with what you want. (11:34) Because it's so individual to the person, isn't it? (11:37) And you must know that in your experience that it's great to have a starting point and say, you know, try this for your fat, high fat, high protein meals. (11:45) But if that doesn't work and you see it doesn't work, you need to try a different proportion or a different ratio or something. (11:51) And and the same with exercise.
Liesl (11:53) Exercise is so individual that it's great to have a starting point, but there isn't a black and white set of rules that says do this and you'll be able to run a marathon or do that and you'll get through a game of football or something. (12:09) It it's so personal. (12:11) And I think that is it just shows that the more we understand, the more questions we have and the less we understand. (12:18) And if it wasn't that way, insulin would never have been discovered. (12:23) We never would have finger pricking.
Liesl (12:24) We never would have CGMs. (12:25) We never would have the tech that we have. (12:28) And I really hope that at some point I have a family member with type one diabetes. (12:33) And when she was diagnosed, I cried for twenty four hours. (12:37) And my husband said, I don't know why you're so upset.
Liesl (12:40) Why you know about all of this? (12:42) You can support her with it. (12:44) And I just said, she's 11 years old. (12:47) She will never go to a party again without thinking how much do I have to inject for that muffin? (12:53) How much do I have to inject for that pizza?
Liesl (12:55) I said it's the loss of that carefree living that I was mourning. (13:00) Mhmm. (13:00) And I really hope that in her lifetime, she's able to say, isn't it quaint? (13:07) My auntie used to teach people how to manage type one diabetes, and now we're just cured.
Scott Benner (13:13) Yeah. (13:13) Hey. (13:14) Listen. (13:14) I'll take anything from cured to this box and this box talk to each other, and I don't have to think and it just works. (13:20) Like because I don't it's not if we know for sure about fat, for example, then, like, that could be a setting.
Scott Benner (13:28) And and why is it not? (13:30) And then because it is in some of the DIY systems, by the way. (13:33) In some of the DIY systems, you can say there's this much fat in my in my meal, and it it helps it to layer more boluses out over the the future. (13:42) So, again, back to what I was saying earlier is you need the pump companies to admit that that's functionality that should be looked into and tried to figure out and put in. (13:53) I mean, so put a little effort into that.
Scott Benner (13:55) And and by the way, at some point, they will ceiling out on what they're doing, and they're gonna have to move to those ideas to keep getting better, to keep making their money, to try to beat the other guy, which, by the way, is the only thing that keeps innovation going. (14:08) I don't know if you're a capitalist or not, but that's pretty much what keeps people moving. (14:12) Yeah.
Liesl (14:12) Yeah. (14:13) So And I and having that as an optional thing on a pump would be great because some people, they really do have an impact with fat or high protein. (14:20) Don't they? (14:21) Other people, it doesn't affect them in the slightest.
Scott Benner (14:23) It's crazy. (14:23) It some people are like, I've never done that before. (14:25) It's never been a problem for me. (14:27) I'm like, yeah. (14:27) Right on.
Scott Benner (14:28) Like but at least you know. (14:29) Like, that to me is the idea behind the podcast is that I'm gonna put all these ideas out there. (14:36) They might not all impact you or be important for you, but at least you know about them now. (14:41) And if it did end up being important for you, that's awesome because you can do something about it. (14:45) And if it didn't, then right on, then that's the thing you don't need to worry about.
Scott Benner (14:50) I don't love the I don't love I I just think people deserve all the information.
Liesl (14:57) Yeah.
Scott Benner (14:58) You know? (14:58) And then they can do what with it what they want or what they're capable of doing with it. (15:03) But it it would be wrong to hide it from somebody.
Liesl (15:05) Yeah. (15:06) And you've just you've just reminded me. (15:08) You asked me a question almost at the beginning of this about what are the light bulb moments? (15:12) What are the Yeah. (15:13) The moments when the penny drops?
Liesl (15:15) And I think talking about information, basic information can be a real penny drop moment as a you know, yes, high fat, high protein, that can be a real game changer for a lot of people. (15:27) For me, one of the main learning outcomes for people with on a Daphne course is just understanding how long it takes their quick acting insulin to start working
Scott Benner (15:37) Yep.
Liesl (15:37) And how long it keeps working. (15:39) The number of people who have said, now I understand why I had a hypo because an hour after my meal, I was I'd got a glucose of 17, and it should have been less than seven. (15:50) And so I gave an injection of quick acting, but now I realized that my quick acting still hadn't even peaked from my meal. (15:57) And so that understanding how their insulin works in real terms, in that relationship with their glucose, their carbs, and their insulin, that is a big game changer for people.
Scott Benner (16:08) Definitely. (16:09) Yeah. (16:09) So I I I say to all the time that if you if you threw me off a cliff and told me, help people with diabetes before you hit the bottom, I would yell back up, it's all timing and amount. (16:21) Yes. (16:22) That's it.
Liesl (16:23) Yeah. (16:23) Yeah.
Scott Benner (16:23) That's the whole thing. (16:24) By the way, the podcast should be six seconds long. (16:27) Here it is for everybody again. (16:28) It's about insulin timing and the amount of insulin. (16:31) It's about how much insulin you use and when you use it.
Scott Benner (16:33) That's the entire thing. (16:35) Is it as easy as why the way I just said it? (16:37) It's not. (16:38) But that is at the core of the that's your entire fight. (16:41) Yeah.
Scott Benner (16:41) It's timing and amount. (16:43) So, you get that right, you'll be that's that's the a one c you're looking for. (16:48) That's the variability you're looking for. (16:49) Now you have to get it right at breakfast, at lunch, at dinner, at your snacks, you know, for your your settings, for your, you know, you know, that your Basil uses all day long, you know, for your, you know, for your adjustments, you know, it it's but it's all but, again, at the end, it's just it's the right amount of insulin at the right time. (17:10) It's matching the impact of carbohydrates or body function against the insulin's ability to fight it off.
Scott Benner (17:19) It's kind of it. (17:19) You know?
Liesl (17:21) It's like having another job on top of your normal full time job, isn't it? (17:24) Well, I mean, like it's like having to run two jobs at the same time.
Scott Benner (17:27) It it it reminds me all the time of this is gonna be out of context for you, but there's a, there's a movie now that's getting pretty old with Brad Pitt in it. (17:34) It's called Moneyball. (17:36) And it's a it's about, it's it's not it's a real story about, an American baseball team that eventually, like, kinda bucks the system and goes towards analytics. (17:48) And they start deciding to find the value in players that look valueless in in a normal, in a normal Okay. (17:57) Setting.
Scott Benner (17:57) Right? (17:58) And so they go to this player whose arm is shot, who used to be a catcher, and he needs to throw the ball out. (18:03) And they wanna move him to a position where he doesn't have to throw very much, but he's never played it before in his entire life. (18:09) And they say to him, you know, the the one guy goes, we're gonna move you to first base. (18:15) And he get and the guy says, well, I've never played first base.
Scott Benner (18:18) Well, the guy turns to the other coach and goes, it's very easy. (18:21) We'll teach you how to do it. (18:22) Tell him. (18:22) And he tells the other he tells the other coach. (18:24) He goes, tell him.
Scott Benner (18:25) The guy's name's Wash. (18:26) He goes, tell him, Wash. (18:27) And he goes, it's incredibly difficult. (18:29) And, like and so and and I and so while the one guy's going like, it's easy. (18:34) It's just we'll teach you how to do it.
Scott Benner (18:36) And then the other guy's like, I mean, I don't know, man. (18:38) Maybe we could figure it out, but probably not. (18:41) And I feel like that's how I'm talking about diabetes sometimes. (18:44) I feel like I'm the guy who's like, we'll just move you to first. (18:47) And then somebody else comes along and goes, it's incredibly difficult.
Scott Benner (18:50) But I think it's doable. (18:53) Like, I've seen it enough times. (18:54) And by the way, that was the leap for me. (18:56) I I I'd love to meet the person who figured out the Daphne thing one day because I I was like, look. (19:04) I'm not in this space.
Scott Benner (19:06) I'm not a doctor. (19:07) I'm not a I'm I'm in no way connected to the the technical or professional aspects of diabetes. (19:13) Right? (19:13) Yeah. (19:14) My daughter gets type one in 2006 when she's two years old.
Scott Benner (19:19) I am following what I am being told, and it is not working. (19:23) And I'm becoming overwhelmed, and she's becoming sicker. (19:27) And I'm a 100% sure I'm killing her most days, and I'm probably right. (19:31) And I I look to the people who are supposed to be telling me what to do, and I I come to the conclusion that I don't think they're gonna help me. (19:38) I don't think it's because they don't care.
Scott Benner (19:41) I don't think it's be I just think that whatever it is that they're programmed to say is not helping me.
Liesl (19:47) Yeah.
Scott Benner (19:47) So I dig into my daughter's health and become as much of an expert on all the aspects of it as I can. (19:54) And when I get to the edge of my understanding of it, and I start, like, interviewing other people and trying to find out their understanding of it to kinda, you know, bring together ideas. (20:03) And one day, it just hits me. (20:06) I've got my daughter's a one c in the low sixes now. (20:08) I've had it in the fives, and I know what to do.
Scott Benner (20:12) I'd never quantified it. (20:13) I never wrote it down. (20:14) I'm not as smart as your your grandmother who had the the or, you know, who had the had the list. (20:18) I don't I nothing was written down. (20:21) I just had come to the conclusion that there was a certain number of things that I did.
Scott Benner (20:24) And when I did them every day, her blood sugars were stable, and we had outcomes that we were looking for. (20:30) And so by then, I had the podcast, and I just sat down one day against my nature and wrote down the things that I thought helped people that helped us. (20:41) And then I said I I said, I think this is universal. (20:45) It's not exact. (20:46) Like, don't get me wrong.
Scott Benner (20:47) Like, you can't just do exactly what I do the way I do it, and it's gonna work for you. (20:52) But it's foundational enough that you can adapt it to yourself. (20:56) And Yeah. (20:57) When I started sharing it like that, get a lot of pushback from people, by the way, who said it was dangerous and it was gonna hurt people and blah blah blah. (21:04) And then just a lot of, like, you know, people, you know, toeing the company line.
Scott Benner (21:09) And, we don't talk about it like that. (21:11) I think back then, they were still aiming for an a one c that was eight. (21:14) Were They telling you if you had an eight a one c, you were doing well. (21:17) And and I was like, I don't think that's right. (21:20) You know?
Scott Benner (21:21) And so I shared my thing and then people actually, I you don't know this, but one of the you know, when I very first started writing a blog, like, one of the first pieces of correspondence I got back from a reader that said that the blog was valuable from them was from a person from England who said that Really? (21:38) Yeah. (21:38) She said her and her daughter have been finding a lot of value in the things I've been sharing on on my blog. (21:44) And, and then from there, it just kinda grew and grew and grew. (21:49) But it's not growing from my understanding.
Scott Benner (21:52) It's growing, I think maybe my my understanding is the seed of how it started, but then I had to keep bringing in other voices to try to add on top of it. (22:01) You you know? (22:02) Yeah. (22:02) And then making it and but then back to what we were talking about earlier. (22:06) That's all nice for me and my kid.
Scott Benner (22:09) But if you can't find a way to get it to other people, then if a tree falls in the woods, did anybody hear it? (22:16) Right? (22:16) So, like, then then Yeah. (22:17) Then your job becomes getting it out to people without letting it die. (22:22) Like, so you have to, like so right?
Scott Benner (22:24) Because at some point, that pump company was like, we got a pump. (22:26) This is it. (22:27) Now go out there and sell it. (22:28) Make sure people can get it. (22:29) Put it in their hands.
Scott Benner (22:30) And then they stopped innovating. (22:32) So if you innovate and sell and innovate and sell and keep doing that, that to me is the way you reach more people. (22:39) And I think I I'm sorry. (22:41) I think the more people that we reach, the better chance we have that doctors and and clinicians will will understand that there's a an elevated expectation from people and that they need to meet it. (22:52) Sorry.
Scott Benner (22:53) That was my whole thought.
Liesl (22:55) No. (22:55) No. (22:55) I and I think one of the things that you notice if you being a Daphne educator and being on Daphne courses is the relationship that that I have as a Daphne educator with the people that do the course is different. (23:09) It's changed then forever because they become more familiar with me as lethal and not somebody in a uniform sitting on a desk telling them what to do. (23:20) And I understand more about their lives, how they live with diabetes, what the the challenges are for each person as an individual.
Liesl (23:28) And then they get to meet a doctor on a Daphne course. (23:31) And where they will always say, I only come to clinic to get told off, suddenly they meet human beings who are health care professionals. (23:39) And so there's that mutual understanding and the realization that we're doing what we do not because we like to be bossy, but because we genuinely care and we genuinely have and are working hard to understand, to have empathy, to liberate people from that sense of guilt, and to give them information so they can live their best life. (24:07) Isn't that just what we want for everybody? (24:09) Whether they've got diabetes or not, whether they've got arthritis or not, whether they've got any other kind of life limiting condition or potentially life limiting condition.
Liesl (24:19) We just want them to live the best life they possibly can, and that's why we work in diabetes. (24:25) Because you either come and work in diabetes and you get spat out really quickly because it's not your thing, or you get sucked into work in diabetes and you realize you can't get out because this thing that I hated when I was a staff nurse on a ward suddenly became my be all and end all. (24:42) And that yeah. (24:43) I'm I'm in it for life pretty much.
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Scott Benner (25:09) You open up the email. (25:10) It's a big button that says click here to reorder, and you're done. (25:14) Finally, somebody taking away a responsibility instead of adding one. (25:18) US Med has done that for us. (25:20) An email arrives, we click on a link, and the next thing you know, your products are at the front door.
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Scott Benner (27:06) Can there not be or should there not be, or maybe there is, a Daphne course for doctors? (27:11) Because it occurs to me that any reasonably intelligent physician with a tiny bit of a heart who heard the last hour of our conversation wouldn't pull somebody into a room and and scold them. (27:24) And so, like, is is maybe that not a place where Daphne could could be valuable?
Liesl (27:30) We do that already. (27:31) So we've been training doctors to become Daphne doctors since Daphne started in ninety nine, two thousand when it was rolled out. (27:38) And that's what I was doing this afternoon before the podcast. (27:41) I was doing a a Daphne doctor workshop. (27:44) And so we get them to carb count so they understand what that's like.
Liesl (27:49) We will often talk about the language that's used. (27:51) And one of the doctors on the course today has been in diabetes for about a year, and her comment was, I'm already speaking to people differently. (28:01) I'm not telling people what to do. (28:03) I'm asking them how they are. (28:05) I'm asking them what they would like to be different about their life with diabetes.
Liesl (28:08) I'm asking them what their challenges are. (28:11) And she's only been in diabetes a short time. (28:13) And so everybody that she ever sees in the length of her career, which could be another thirty or forty years, is going to benefit from her having that different approach because she's done her DAFNI training, and she's out there now understanding a lot more. (28:30) I wish she very proud of that.
Scott Benner (28:31) Yeah. (28:32) I I would be as well. (28:33) I just had a 16 year old boy tell me the other day he wants to be an endocrinologist, and I thought, oh, he understands diabetes the way I talk about it. (28:40) He might be an endocrinologist one day and talk about it like that to people. (28:43) Yeah.
Scott Benner (28:43) And and I think that's just it really it's fabulous. (28:47) You know, there there's
Liesl (28:48) Yeah.
Scott Benner (28:48) It could be nothing better. (28:49) It's sad that, you know, it takes so long to change things in society, but there's nothing you can do about that. (28:56) So this is this is what you do. (28:57) You plant a lot of seeds. (28:58) You talk to a lot of people, and you wait for that stuff to grow.
Scott Benner (29:01) And and, hopefully, things move in a better direction, and, generally speaking, they do when people like you are out there doing what you're doing.
Liesl (29:07) Yeah. (29:09) I'm not perfect. (29:10) I have had a situation with somebody where I and, again, it's a family another family member with type one. (29:18) And I said to her, what's the one thing you could do differently that might make things different or might improve things? (29:27) And she just looked at me and said, why can people not just say, well done?
Liesl (29:34) Well done. (29:35) You're doing the best you can today. (29:36) And well done. (29:37) You did the best you could yesterday. (29:39) Mhmm.
Liesl (29:39) And well done because tomorrow, you'll do the best you can do tomorrow. (29:43) And I just thought, of all the people that per that she knows, I should be the one not to ask those questions of. (29:50) What's the one thing you could do differently that might make it better? (29:54) You know, really, I should have just said, well done. (29:57) You're doing your best every day, and I know that.
Scott Benner (29:59) Yeah. (29:59) You're So I you're trying to get still
Liesl (30:02) get it wrong.
Scott Benner (30:02) But but let me let me stick up for you for a second. (30:05) Right? (30:05) So you probably don't see this person that often, and you probably saw that they they made an advancement. (30:10) You thought, if I can get them thinking in this direction, they'll make another one. (30:14) Is that about right?
Liesl (30:15) It's it's because my personality is a fixer. (30:18) I like to be a fixer. (30:19) That's the thing.
Scott Benner (30:20) You know my I I hate to say that part one of my favorite things about this conversation is that when your voice gets a little higher, you sound like, Sharon Osborne when she was younger, which is delighting me. (30:30) Do
Liesl (30:31) you know the funny thing? (30:32) So that she's from Birmingham, isn't she?
Scott Benner (30:34) I don't know. (30:35) I just know that you sound like her sometimes.
Liesl (30:38) Well, I was born in Birmingham, and I haven't lived there since I was three. (30:41) But maybe I'm a bit like my mom, and when I get excited or passionate about something, a little bit of a brummy twang comes out in what I'm saying.
Scott Benner (30:48) Yeah. (30:48) I so much want you to yell, up.
Liesl (30:52) Aussie. (30:52) Exactly. (30:54) That's awesome.
Scott Benner (30:55) Oh, is there anything that we haven't spoken about that you want to? (30:59) Anything that we missed or skipped over?
Liesl (31:02) Goodness. (31:03) We've covered so much, haven't we, Scott? (31:05) We've talked about so much. (31:08) I just the value of education for people with diabetes. (31:12) It's what they deserve, and it should be an entitlement.
Liesl (31:15) That's what I believe very firmly if they if they want it if they want education, they should be able to have it.
Scott Benner (31:21) Yeah. (31:21) No. (31:22) I I agree. (31:22) I I think in any way we can get it to them is important. (31:25) I I will tell you that the, I was just having this conversation, with my actually, with my my nephew.
Scott Benner (31:34) He's in college. (31:35) And he needed to interview people about media, but he had to interview somebody over 50. (31:39) So it ended up being me. (31:41) I wasn't thrilled that I was the right one for that. (31:43) But but, you know, he's asking me about how things have changed about how I consume television or movies and stuff like that.
Scott Benner (31:50) And I found us getting off of a little bit of a he asked about the podcast a little bit. (31:55) And I said, you know, what's interesting is that before the cell phone, the podcast wasn't really possible.
Liesl (32:03) Yeah.
Scott Benner (32:03) Like, right? (32:04) So the cell phones came, and then suddenly there was a place to send the audio to. (32:08) But it really didn't take off until data became cheaper because Yeah. (32:13) People couldn't afford to download an episode of anything because you used to pay for your data by I forget how you did it. (32:18) But but it was expensive, right, to download something.
Scott Benner (32:21) And when data became kinda ubiquitous, then all of a sudden, people could share their their thoughts. (32:29) And I said, and then it and and then you think, well, that's great. (32:33) Until then everyone realizes that's possible, then they flood the area again with with, you know I mean, listen. (32:39) I'm sure everybody's podcast has value, but, like, a lot of information that maybe isn't as valuable, then it becomes confusing to the consumer, then they don't know how to parse through it. (32:49) And then I could hear him, like, getting a little, like, numb in his head, and I said, how many times have you sat down in front of Netflix and scrolled through it for an hour but never watched a movie?
Scott Benner (32:59) And he goes, a lot. (33:00) And I was like, right. (33:01) I was like, so is that much choice good or bad because you didn't watch anything? (33:08) And I he just froze. (33:09) And, and I was like, so I said, yes.
Scott Benner (33:12) Because he asked me how like, he asked me about the distribution of the podcast. (33:16) And I said, so, yes, the distribution is the only thing that made it blow up, but it also let everybody else who could figure out how to sit in front of a microphone do it too. (33:25) And then it puts me in a position of having to, like, persevere through that to get to the other side to continue to reach people. (33:32) I was like I was like, there and, anyway, my point to him was there's no perfect answer to your question. (33:37) Because he his question was, you know, should we all be going to the theater still or streaming better?
Scott Benner (33:43) Like, you know, what what do you find more valuable? (33:45) And I and I said to him, I was like, you're not that's not the question. (33:48) I was like, the question is what's gonna win? (33:50) What ends up being here when it's over? (33:53) You know, like, what is it that we end up settling on that we end up building on for the next thing?
Scott Benner (33:58) And I just I keep thinking about that since I've been talking to him about the, like, the diabetes aspect of it. (34:03) Like, what do we what have we settled on that helps people, and how do we build on it to try to get to the next thing, to get to the next fight, to see if we can fight through it, to see what perseveres comes out the other side. (34:15) How do we build again on that over and over? (34:18) I'm super excited for it to be I mean, I really I I don't know. (34:25) Like, I'm I'm the wrong person for this idea, but I'm seeing people right now using AI for their diabetes in ways that is really fascinating me.
Scott Benner (34:34) I don't know if you've seen people do this or not, but I'm starting to I've done it on the podcast once or twice. (34:41) I probably will do it a little more with people, but I watched somebody do it online recently where they were having trouble with their insulin, and they just they were at wit's end. (34:51) They didn't know what to do, and they just started feeding their their their graphs into, one of the AI models and then having a live conversation with the AI model. (35:01) And the I the person flat out said in their post online, I didn't even know if it was right, but I was so screwed I had to try something. (35:09) And then they tried it, it worked for them.
Scott Benner (35:12) And I was like, that's fascinating because I that I find that's how people get to the podcast. (35:17) When I was talking to my daughter's friend the other day and trying to help her through her thing, I said to her, try to imagine where a person has to be to say, I'm gonna turn a podcast on and listen to it about my health. (35:30) I was like, imagine how lost you have to be to make that decision. (35:34) Right? (35:34) Because that is not a that's not a on its face, that's not a reasonable decision to make for somebody who doesn't know me or doesn't know what's here or anything else.
Scott Benner (35:42) Right? (35:42) I was like, that's how lost people are when they're walking around. (35:45) They're like, maybe a guy will tell me. (35:47) Maybe my AI will know what to do with this graph. (35:50) And and, anyway, like, you're now seeing the AI does seem to know what to do with the graph.
Scott Benner (35:55) I don't know if you've done this, but I've had people go ahead. (35:58) Go ahead, please. (35:59) What were you gonna say?
Liesl (36:00) And I've not because I don't work face to face with, people with diabetes anymore. (36:04) I'm kind of more in the background. (36:06) So watching somebody use AI for their diabetes is not something I've seen, but I do know that there's more and more reliance on apps. (36:16) And one thing I like about your podcast is that it's people talking. (36:20) And if we're not careful, people are gonna lose that peer support from talking to other people who either have type one or have family with type one because it's all gonna be about an app on their phone and the technology.
Liesl (36:34) And I don't think you can divorce that personal connection.
Scott Benner (36:39) Allow me to be hopeful. (36:41) Allow me to be hopeful. (36:42) Maybe the technical side of their life will become so unencumbered or that they can spend more time on the community side. (36:49) Yeah. (36:49) That would be lovely.
Scott Benner (36:50) I hope so. (36:51) Yeah. (36:51) I saw, oh gosh. (36:53) What was I gonna tell you? (36:55) Jeez.
Scott Benner (36:56) The thing, the thing, the thing, the thing. (36:58) Oh, Scott. (36:59) This is terrible. (37:02) It was with an AI. (37:04) Oh, shit.
Scott Benner (37:06) Lisa, look what happened. (37:08) My age got caught up with me there.
Liesl (37:10) Oh, don't worry. (37:10) It happens to me all the time.
Scott Benner (37:11) Yeah. (37:12) Yeah. (37:12) I'm so disappointed. (37:13) I had one last thought, but that that's also a misnomer because I could just keep talking forever, so I don't really have one last thought.
Liesl (37:19) I could talk to you all night. (37:21) So
Scott Benner (37:21) Well, you're very good at this. (37:23) I was gonna say you're, you're you're chatty as hell. (37:25) It's awesome. (37:26) Do you have, you you've mentioned a couple of people in your life that have type one that are in your family. (37:32) Is there other autoimmune in your family?
Scott Benner (37:34) Do you have any autoimmune issues?
Liesl (37:36) No. (37:37) Nothing? (37:37) None at all.
Scott Benner (37:38) Celiac, thyroid, you don't see it through the family?
Liesl (37:42) Nothing. (37:43) No. (37:43) And and you know what? (37:45) I think the biggest lesson I learned when I got really upset when this family member was diagnosed. (37:52) And it just goes to show how you cannot however much you know, you can't divorce emotion from the situation because I was in tears talking to my husband, and he was a bit flummoxed as to why I was so upset.
Liesl (38:05) And through my tears, just said, thank god I'm not a cancer specialist nurse because then she might have got cancer.
Scott Benner (38:12) Oh.
Liesl (38:13) Now how irrational is that? (38:15) It doesn't make any sense at all. (38:17) Yeah. (38:17) But it was just this whole, oh my god. (38:22) This somehow, is this my fault?
Liesl (38:24) Of course, it's not my fault. (38:25) It's just bloody bad luck. (38:28) But it it just taught me the family members of anybody I've ever met who's got type one diabetes will perhaps have gone through emotions, irrational emotions, which I would have laughed at if I hadn't experienced it myself. (38:43) Thank god I'm not a cancer specialist nurse. (38:46) I'm a diabetes specialist nurse because she's got diabetes and not cancer.
Scott Benner (38:50) Well I
Liesl (38:50) mean, that just doesn't make any sense, but that's genuinely how I felt on that day.
Scott Benner (38:55) The unseen stuff, like, unseen psychological stuff is fascinating. (38:58) Like, imagine you you I go out to dinner with my family, and I sit down, and it is in the my daughter's 21 now, but it's still in the back of my head. (39:07) Like, is she gonna pre bolus for this? (39:09) Has she bolus? (39:09) And I haven't noticed because now it's on her phone, and I can't really tell.
Scott Benner (39:12) You you know? (39:13) And now you're all sitting there, and all you wanna say is, hey. (39:17) You bolus. (39:18) Right? (39:19) But you don't wanna put that on her because, a, if she forgot, that's on she doesn't need to feel like I'm watching her.
Scott Benner (39:26) And if she didn't forget, she doesn't need to feel like nobody trusts her. (39:29) But yet in the silence when nobody says, hey. (39:32) Did you bolus yet? (39:33) Everyone at the table knows that everyone else is thinking about it. (39:37) Yeah.
Scott Benner (39:37) And it's and it's in the background. (39:38) It's not right on the front of your head. (39:39) It's in the background, but there's an when I've noticed that every time I sit at a restaurant, until I know my daughter has bolus for food, I'm on some level a tiny bit uptight or or on guard or something. (39:54) I don't even know really how to put it. (39:56) And the minute I realized that she's done it, it's lighter.
Scott Benner (40:01) And I wonder if it doesn't feel that way to her as well. (40:04) You know what I mean? (40:06) Like and and that's the kind of little stuff that if we sat here long enough and talked and talked and talked, we could sit and make a list of a million things like that. (40:15) And Yeah. (40:16) And those things are happening to you all day long whether you're the person with type one or the or somebody that loves them.
Scott Benner (40:22) It just it it's unfair. (40:24) There's that it's the wet towel. (40:25) Like, I swear, I've never thought of that wet towel analogy before in my life, but now I realize it's like it's it's like, you know you know those, like, thin clingy, like, sarongs that you women, like, wrap around the the beach. (40:36) It's like that thin material, but cold and wet and just laying on top of you. (40:42) A little shitty.
Scott Benner (40:43) You know? (40:44) Like, and you can't make it go away. (40:47) But, again, I have seen people with diabetes get together in a room, and I watch that feeling. (40:52) It looks like it lifts off them. (40:54) So
Liesl (40:55) Yeah. (40:55) Yeah. (40:56) And and actually, until you said that out loud, I think I recognize that, and I'm conscious of it, but I'd never been properly conscious of that feeling of of sitting and waiting. (41:06) And once you know that they're bolus, the meal can start, and you can all enjoy it. (41:11) Yeah.
Liesl (41:12) And the other thing, you mentioned something. (41:13) We're talking about emotions. (41:15) One of the things that we ask our DAFNI course participants is about we ask them three very specific questions. (41:23) And we ask them to quantify how overwhelmed they feel by the responsibility of diabetes, how alone they feel with their diabetes, and how much they feel as if they're failing with their diabetes. (41:36) And what we see at the end of that five day course is they've gone from scoring a five or a six, which is what you don't want them to feel.
Liesl (41:46) A five or a six is that it's a serious problem or a very serious problem. (41:50) And at the end of five days, they're scoring a one or or a two, which is it's not a problem or it's a slight problem. (41:57) So to see that impact on somebody's psychological health in just five days is phenomenal. (42:04) But when they fill in the forms a year later, they've maintained that psychological benefit. (42:10) And I don't know any other intervention in health care, be it a tablet or physio or anything else that can achieve that improvement in five days and maintain it a year later?
Liesl (42:24) And even though as an educator, I always knew that was the case. (42:27) I never had the evidence to back it up. (42:30) Now we ask the participants to answer these questions. (42:34) They answer them on their own away from anybody, so there's no coercion. (42:38) And now we can quantify exactly what that improvement is.
Liesl (42:42) And that makes me emotional every time I look at that data because behind the data is a real person with a family who's living a different life because that emotional burden has got less. (42:56) And that to me is is truly what it's all about.
Scott Benner (42:59) You know what the data helps you with too is it helps you stop wondering if it's true. (43:04) It allows you to believe it's true and press forward.
Liesl (43:06) Yeah.
Scott Benner (43:06) I did a thing a few years ago that helped me a lot. (43:09) I did a, there was this really this lovely girl that people reach out to help me all the time. (43:14) They're like, I you know, the podcast helped me. (43:16) How can I help you? (43:17) And at one point, there was this grad student, and she's like, how can I help?
Scott Benner (43:22) And I said, I wanna do a survey to see if the podcast actually helps people. (43:26) And I don't know how I don't know how to do that, so you go ahead and do it. (43:30) And she put a survey together, and we actually got 1,200 people to take the survey. (43:34) 1,200 listeners to take it, which was is a pretty big data set.
Liesl (43:37) A great number.
Scott Benner (43:38) Yeah. (43:38) And, it turns out that the podcast helps them significantly more than their doctors do or anything that they found print online or etcetera for their diabetes. (43:47) And I don't I mean, it's somewhere the data somewhere that from the thing, but the point is that it didn't matter because it let me what doesn't matter is that that I can't quote it to you anymore. (43:58) What it did for me was what was most important. (44:01) It took this thing that I thought I was seeing, that I believed was true.
Scott Benner (44:05) It proved it to me enough that I could stop wondering about that part of it and just push forward. (44:11) And it really it really did allow me to to you know, because I'm not a I I mean, I I I joke around and hear a lot, and I think I try to keep this entertaining so that people will listen about their diabetes, which is not a thing I think most people are inclined to listen to. (44:24) And when I joke around, I think there are times that I can come off like a dumbass because I'm but I I'm not I'm not a I'm not a, like, a crazy narcissist who's just, like, every time I see something, believe it. (44:36) I'm like, yay. (44:37) I'm great.
Scott Benner (44:37) And, like, and I move forward. (44:39) Like, I really wondered, like, is this actually doing what I think it's doing for people? (44:43) Like, I believe it is, but I don't have the ability to just, like I don't know. (44:49) Like, to just take it on face and go. (44:51) And that data coming back was really helpful to me.
Scott Benner (44:54) And I think Yeah. (44:55) You know, same for you is, like, you can say, look. (44:57) Because when you said the thing about the first five days and their score goes up from day one to day five, my follow-up question before you told me about the year after data, my follow-up question was gonna be, but yeah. (45:08) But does that actually matter in the long run? (45:10) Like, or are you just talking them into believing they can do it and they get home and they can't actually do it?
Scott Benner (45:15) And Yeah. (45:16) You know, and that there's your answer. (45:17) And so beautiful. (45:18) Yeah. (45:18) Then run around yelling Daphne at people.
Scott Benner (45:20) You know what I mean?
Liesl (45:21) I do. (45:22) My friends that my friends will be, if if they if they listen to the podcast, they'll be like, well, she was in heaven because she was talking Daphne basically for an hour and a half. (45:30) So she's absolutely in heaven because, yeah.
Scott Benner (45:33) That's Very good.
Liesl (45:34) That's what they know me for.
Scott Benner (45:35) Well, it's like, can't I can't thank you enough for reaching out and for sharing all this. (45:39) I think this has been a really terrific conversation. (45:41) And, I I is there anything if people in The UK, if they don't like, how do they reach, like, a Daphne course if they Yeah. (45:49) If they want it?
Liesl (45:51) So we we delivered Daphne is delivered in a 117 different centers and over 200 locations in The UK. (45:57) So if anybody is interested in coming on a Daphne course, they just need to go to our website, www.daphne.nhs.uk, and it will show you where there's a Daphne centre in their area. (46:09) And it may be that they already have their diabetes care in a DAPHNE service. (46:14) And if they don't, they can ask their GP or their service to refer them to somewhere that does deliver DAPHNE so that they can access a course.
Scott Benner (46:22) Well, you asked before we started, like, said, before we started recording, you said, like, if I use any, like like, British colloquialisms that don't make sense, just stop me. (46:31) And I have to admit, like, I'm just gonna call this episode penny drop, but is that but I don't know I've never heard that before in my life. (46:37) So
Liesl (46:38) Have you not? (46:39) No.
Scott Benner (46:39) So, anyway, that's that's what your episode's gonna be called.
Liesl (46:43) Thank you.
Scott Benner (46:44) Yeah.
Liesl (46:44) I've really enjoyed talking to you today, Scott. (46:46) Thank you so much. (46:47) And as you know, I can as you now know, I can talk about diabetes till the cows come home. (46:51) And, having a conversation with somebody else who's in the same position is is really lovely. (46:57) I've really enjoyed my afternoon.
Liesl (46:58) Thank you so much.
Scott Benner (46:59) No. (46:59) Me too. (47:00) The feeling's mutual. (47:01) Hold on one second, please. (47:07) A huge thanks to my longest sponsor, Omnipod.
Scott Benner (47:11) Check out the Omnipod five now with my link, omnipod.com/juicebox. (47:16) You may be eligible for a free starter kit, a free Omnipod five starter kit at my link. (47:24) Go check it out. (47:25) Omnipod.com/juicebox. (47:27) Terms and conditions apply.
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Scott Benner (48:07) This series is all about mastering the fundamentals, whether it's the basics of insulin, dosing adjustments, or everyday management strategies that will empower you to take control. (48:17) I'm joined by Jenny Smith, who is a diabetes educator with over thirty five years of personal experience, and we break down complex concepts into simple, actionable tips. (48:27) The diabetes pro tip series runs between episode one thousand and one thousand twenty five in your podcast player, or you can listen to it at juiceboxpodcast.com by going up into the menu. (48:51) Hey. (48:51) Do you need support?
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#1743 Penny Drop - Part 2
You can always listen to the Juicebox Podcast here but the cool kids use: Apple Podcasts/iOS - Spotify - Amazon Music - Google Play/Android - iHeart Radio - Radio Public, Amazon Alexa or wherever they get audio.
Liesl works for DAFNE, a UK-based program teaching dose adjustment for normal eating, while discussing the evolution of diabetes management and the vital importance of peer support.
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DISCLAIMER: This text is the output of AI based transcribing from an audio recording. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors and should not be treated as an authoritative record. Nothing that you read here constitutes advice medical or otherwise. Always consult with a healthcare professional before making changes to a healthcare plan.
Scott Benner (0:00) Hello, friends, and welcome back to another episode of the Juice Box podcast. (0:13) This is part two of a two part episode. (0:16) Go look at the title. (0:17) If you don't recognize it, you haven't heard part one yet. (0:20) It's probably the episode right before this in your podcast player.
Scott Benner (0:28) Nothing you hear on the Juice Box podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise. (0:33) Always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan or becoming bold with insulin. (0:44) My diabetes pro tip series is about cutting through the clutter of diabetes management to give you the straightforward practical insights that truly make a difference. (0:53) This series is all about mastering the fundamentals, whether it's the basics of insulin, dosing adjustments, or everyday management strategies that will empower you to take control. (1:03) I'm joined by Jenny Smith, who is a diabetes educator with over thirty five years of personal experience, and we break down complex concepts into simple, actionable tips.
Scott Benner (1:13) The diabetes pro tip series runs between episode one thousand and one thousand twenty five in your podcast player, or you can listen to it at juiceboxpodcast.com by going up into the menu. (1:31) This episode of the Juice Box podcast is sponsored by Omnipod five. (1:35) Omnipod five is a tube free automated insulin delivery system that's been shown to significantly improve a one c and time and range for people with type one diabetes when they've switched from daily injections. (1:46) Learn more and get started today at omnipod.com/juicebox. (1:51) At my link, you can get a free starter kit right now.
Scott Benner (1:53) Terms and conditions apply. (1:55) Eligibility may vary. (1:56) Full terms and conditions can be found at omnipod.com/juicebox. (2:02) The podcast is also sponsored today by US Med, usmed.com/juicebox, or call (888) 721-1514. (2:12) You can get your diabetes testing supplies the same way we do from US Med.
Scott Benner (2:17) I said, here's what I really think. (2:18) I think if you go on an algorithm, you'll be able to sleep better. (2:21) And I think and I think you won't know how much that's gonna change your life until you've had it for a month.
Liesl (2:27) Yeah.
Scott Benner (2:27) And then I I and I stopped myself and I said, and here's another thing. (2:32) Let's be more honest. (2:33) I said, there are days, chunks of my daughter's day where she boluses for her food, and then she goes off and does something. (2:41) She goes to class where she sits with her boyfriend or she, you know, goes out with her friends. (2:47) And because an algorithm is making changes to her insulin during that time based on her data, she doesn't really pay that close attention to her diabetes.
Scott Benner (2:57) Mhmm. (2:57) And and it's not that she's not aware of it. (2:59) It's not that she won't do something if, you know, if something really comes up or whatnot. (3:05) But she doesn't have to, like, go, oh, no. (3:07) It went to one twenty.
Scott Benner (3:09) I got a bolus or it's gonna go to one fifty. (3:12) Like like yeah. (3:12) Like, you know, she goes to one twenty, and the damn thing gives her insulin. (3:16) Then and then it stops. (3:18) Right?
Scott Benner (3:18) And and then, you know, and then if she tries to get low, it stops again. (3:21) I was like, so in my mind, when you're asking me, should I get a pump? (3:26) I think yes because Mhmm. (3:29) Of what it lifts from you that you can't really quantify, and you won't know until it happens. (3:36) Anyway, I wonder
Liesl (3:38) what Some it shoulders some of the burden for her, doesn't it?
Scott Benner (3:41) Oh, I mean, I'll it it when you sit in a conversation like this and go back to 50 calories today, a 100 tomorrow so that you'll die more slowly, well, it's doing more than shouldering the burden. (3:53) Right? (3:54) Right. (3:54) Like like, right, if you if you have if you have that kind of context when you're thinking about it, it's magic. (4:00) If you were diagnosed a year and a half ago, it's shouldering the burden.
Scott Benner (4:04) Yeah. (4:05) So your perspective has a lot to do with what you see it as a part of these con what I like about these conversations is that I hope to alleviate some of the the mental anxiety that people have and the burden that they have Yeah. (4:17) Because they live in a modern society where they're accustomed to everything kinda working the way it's supposed to and, diabetes then feels like it's not. (4:24) But I'm telling you just and say to yourself, holy shit. (4:29) I'm getting away with something here.
Scott Benner (4:31) Yeah. (4:31) You know? (4:32) Yeah.
Liesl (4:32) I I still think it's important for me as a health care professional and just as a person to recognize that I need to be careful that it doesn't come across as, well, I know you've got type one, but you should be grateful you've got the tech because there was a time when it wasn't available.
Scott Benner (4:49) Yeah. (4:49) I know. (4:49) I don't I wouldn't say that to somebody, but I do think it's important that they understand it.
Liesl (4:53) Yeah. (4:54) Yeah. (4:54) And and I and I know that you wouldn't do that, but I I just just say that people understand that just because the tech's there doesn't mean that I would expect somebody with type one diabetes to be a whiz at it just because the tech is there. (5:05) Yeah. (5:05) The tech is great.
Liesl (5:07) And as we've said, it takes some of the burden away, but you've still got that wet towel draped around your shoulders.
Scott Benner (5:13) Yep. (5:13) And you still
Liesl (5:14) have earlier. (5:15) So
Scott Benner (5:15) You also still have the rest of what Daphne's doing for people because that technology is basically useless if you don't understand glycemic load, glycemic impact, how to change your settings, you know, how to bolus for fat in your food. (5:28) Like, if you don't have those ideas, it's still gonna seem chaotic. (5:32) Yeah. (5:32) Yeah.
Liesl (5:33) Yeah. (5:33) And I think that's a really good point, Scott, because when we look at our data every year, we've looked at our we look at our that we call it our key performance indicator data. (5:42) So it's what happens to people's h b a one c when they've done a Daphne course a year later, their severe hypo rates, their DKA rates. (5:50) And I guess I thought that once people had the CGM and the tech that they would have a lower h b a one c before they did the course anyway, or they wouldn't have as much DKA. (6:02) There wouldn't be so many severe hypos.
Liesl (6:04) But what we're seeing is that people are coming in with the advantage of the tech already, but they're still achieving the same degree of reduction in their h h b a one c than they were when everyone was doing finger pricking. (6:17) They're still seeing the same reduction in severe hypos, the same reduction in DKA. (6:22) So that just goes hand in hand with what you said, which is if you give somebody the tech, they can achieve a lot. (6:28) But you give them the tech and the education, and it's it's boundless what they could achieve. (6:34) You know?
Liesl (6:35) It it just at least can double what they can achieve if they're given the opportunity. (6:39) And part of my job is to try and make sure that they get given that opportunity.
Scott Benner (6:43) Mhmm. (6:44) No. (6:44) It's wonderful. (6:44) Also, I mean, to be completely candid that the the human condition still exists no matter what level of technology you have or what level of of education you have. (6:54) And the the feeling that, like, our bodies aren't supposed to work this way.
Scott Benner (7:00) Like, you're not supposed to have to think breathe in, breathe out, you know, or, you know, you know, you you imagine if I said to you, look. (7:07) Hey. (7:08) Here's the problem. (7:09) Your heart's not gonna beat if you don't consciously think beat beat beat beat beat for the rest of your life. (7:16) You'd be dead in three minutes.
Scott Benner (7:17) You you you know what I mean? (7:18) Like and and the and you are asking people with diabetes to do that. (7:21) You're asking them to be to be a pancreas, to be aware of how a number of different systems work and how food and and exercise and stress and all, know, and everything else impacts those systems. (7:34) And the truth is is, like, none of us really understand it well enough. (7:38) No.
Scott Benner (7:38) And, you know, so you give them what what I have found is that there's there's, like, kinda hallmarks. (7:45) And if they have the hallmarks, they can do well. (7:47) Like and I mean that very simply, you know, understanding the impacts of their food, understanding how to time insulin against those impacts, understanding seriously how fat and protein impact their blood sugars, the you give them the autonomy to make changes to their settings that they don't feel like they have to wait for someone to tell them that their basil's not strong enough or not weak enough that they, you know, that they should bolus again. (8:13) That you don't saddle them with the idea that every if they bolus without food, it's stacking when that's not always true. (8:20) Like, great.
Scott Benner (8:20) Like, if you can give them those kinds of hallmarks, then most people
Liesl (8:25) Absolutely.
Scott Benner (8:25) Most people can make the rest of the leaps. (8:27) They can they can they can draw the rest of the lines themselves. (8:31) That's been my finding over and over again is that there's there's some basic fundamental foundational stuff. (8:38) And once you give it to them in a way that they understand it and hopefully they're motivated to do something with it, they have a lot of success after that.
Liesl (8:46) Yeah. (8:46) Yeah. (8:46) And I I had somebody on one of my Daphne courses years ago, and she said, look. (8:50) She said, I don't really understand how all of this works, but I don't understand how my car works. (8:56) She said, I just know where to put my feet and where to put my hands, and I trust it to get me from a to b.
Scott Benner (9:00) Perfect.
Liesl (9:01) So if I know what to do with Daphne, I might I don't have to understand the ins and outs of it as long as I know what to do when. (9:09) I know I'll get to where I want to go. (9:11) And I thought that was quite quite a good analogy of there's lots of things we do in life. (9:16) We don't understand how an airplane takes off the ground, but we trust that the pilot knows how to do it, so we just jump on board. (9:22) And she jumped on board with a Daphne course saying, I don't really quite understand, but I trust you, and I trust the process, and I'm just gonna get on board with it.
Liesl (9:31) And and I think that takes tremendous courage and a degree a huge degree of trust in somebody like me to be providing her with the right information.
Scott Benner (9:40) It's also thoughtful. (9:42) It's incredibly thoughtful. (9:44) And here's a secret that's not much of a secret if people are listening. (9:47) There's a lot about this I don't understand either. (9:50) And yet, there might be I I am I had to put this.
Scott Benner (9:56) I don't wanna sound like an asshole. (9:57) But, like, like, if there's a hierarchy to who's reaching people and helping people with diabetes, I've gotta be up in the top of it. (10:04) And there are plenty about it that I fundamentally, like, on a technical or scientific level, I don't I struggle all the time. (10:11) I say stuff all the time where I'm like, I don't really understand that. (10:14) But what I've learned is I don't it doesn't matter.
Scott Benner (10:17) Like like, what matters is understanding the fundamental stuff and being able to communicate it. (10:22) Yeah. (10:22) Yeah. (10:22) And and I don't need to be perfect or have, you know, a PhD level of understanding about, you know, a lot a lot of functions in the body, which by the way, I can't even pronounce little and explain to you. (10:35) Yes.
Scott Benner (10:35) And it and it and it it doesn't it doesn't matter. (10:39) Like, would matter if I was gonna be your surgeon. (10:42) Okay? (10:42) It would matter if I was gonna be teaching a course at at medical school. (10:46) It doesn't matter if I'm just the guy saying, like, look.
Scott Benner (10:49) When you eat a cheeseburger with french fries, there's fat in the fries. (10:52) And about an hour after you eat, you're gonna see a rise coming in your blood sugar, and that rise needs more insulin. (10:57) And there's a quick formula you can use to try to figure out about how much fat was in there and how that translates to insulin, and then you can put that bolus in Yeah. (11:05) And then the rise never happens. (11:06) Your blood sugar doesn't stay high for four hours afterwards.
Scott Benner (11:09) And you don't put in a bunch of insulin and get super low later and then take in a bunch of fast acting then it goes back up again, and then you lose your goddamn mind and you stop taking care of yourself. (11:18) Right? (11:18) Like
Liesl (11:19) Yeah.
Scott Benner (11:19) That that's the part I know for sure.
Liesl (11:22) And I think the frustrating thing when the thing that does frustrate people when they come on a Daphne course is there's so much that that we can't just say, do this plus that, and you'll get success with what you want. (11:34) Because it's so individual to the person, isn't it? (11:37) And you must know that in your experience that it's great to have a starting point and say, you know, try this for your fat, high fat, high protein meals. (11:45) But if that doesn't work and you see it doesn't work, you need to try a different proportion or a different ratio or something. (11:51) And and the same with exercise.
Liesl (11:53) Exercise is so individual that it's great to have a starting point, but there isn't a black and white set of rules that says do this and you'll be able to run a marathon or do that and you'll get through a game of football or something. (12:09) It it's so personal. (12:11) And I think that is it just shows that the more we understand, the more questions we have and the less we understand. (12:18) And if it wasn't that way, insulin would never have been discovered. (12:23) We never would have finger pricking.
Liesl (12:24) We never would have CGMs. (12:25) We never would have the tech that we have. (12:28) And I really hope that at some point I have a family member with type one diabetes. (12:33) And when she was diagnosed, I cried for twenty four hours. (12:37) And my husband said, I don't know why you're so upset.
Liesl (12:40) Why you know about all of this? (12:42) You can support her with it. (12:44) And I just said, she's 11 years old. (12:47) She will never go to a party again without thinking how much do I have to inject for that muffin? (12:53) How much do I have to inject for that pizza?
Liesl (12:55) I said it's the loss of that carefree living that I was mourning. (13:00) Mhmm. (13:00) And I really hope that in her lifetime, she's able to say, isn't it quaint? (13:07) My auntie used to teach people how to manage type one diabetes, and now we're just cured.
Scott Benner (13:13) Yeah. (13:13) Hey. (13:14) Listen. (13:14) I'll take anything from cured to this box and this box talk to each other, and I don't have to think and it just works. (13:20) Like because I don't it's not if we know for sure about fat, for example, then, like, that could be a setting.
Scott Benner (13:28) And and why is it not? (13:30) And then because it is in some of the DIY systems, by the way. (13:33) In some of the DIY systems, you can say there's this much fat in my in my meal, and it it helps it to layer more boluses out over the the future. (13:42) So, again, back to what I was saying earlier is you need the pump companies to admit that that's functionality that should be looked into and tried to figure out and put in. (13:53) I mean, so put a little effort into that.
Scott Benner (13:55) And and by the way, at some point, they will ceiling out on what they're doing, and they're gonna have to move to those ideas to keep getting better, to keep making their money, to try to beat the other guy, which, by the way, is the only thing that keeps innovation going. (14:08) I don't know if you're a capitalist or not, but that's pretty much what keeps people moving. (14:12) Yeah.
Liesl (14:12) Yeah. (14:13) So And I and having that as an optional thing on a pump would be great because some people, they really do have an impact with fat or high protein. (14:20) Don't they? (14:21) Other people, it doesn't affect them in the slightest.
Scott Benner (14:23) It's crazy. (14:23) It some people are like, I've never done that before. (14:25) It's never been a problem for me. (14:27) I'm like, yeah. (14:27) Right on.
Scott Benner (14:28) Like but at least you know. (14:29) Like, that to me is the idea behind the podcast is that I'm gonna put all these ideas out there. (14:36) They might not all impact you or be important for you, but at least you know about them now. (14:41) And if it did end up being important for you, that's awesome because you can do something about it. (14:45) And if it didn't, then right on, then that's the thing you don't need to worry about.
Scott Benner (14:50) I don't love the I don't love I I just think people deserve all the information.
Liesl (14:57) Yeah.
Scott Benner (14:58) You know? (14:58) And then they can do what with it what they want or what they're capable of doing with it. (15:03) But it it would be wrong to hide it from somebody.
Liesl (15:05) Yeah. (15:06) And you've just you've just reminded me. (15:08) You asked me a question almost at the beginning of this about what are the light bulb moments? (15:12) What are the Yeah. (15:13) The moments when the penny drops?
Liesl (15:15) And I think talking about information, basic information can be a real penny drop moment as a you know, yes, high fat, high protein, that can be a real game changer for a lot of people. (15:27) For me, one of the main learning outcomes for people with on a Daphne course is just understanding how long it takes their quick acting insulin to start working
Scott Benner (15:37) Yep.
Liesl (15:37) And how long it keeps working. (15:39) The number of people who have said, now I understand why I had a hypo because an hour after my meal, I was I'd got a glucose of 17, and it should have been less than seven. (15:50) And so I gave an injection of quick acting, but now I realized that my quick acting still hadn't even peaked from my meal. (15:57) And so that understanding how their insulin works in real terms, in that relationship with their glucose, their carbs, and their insulin, that is a big game changer for people.
Scott Benner (16:08) Definitely. (16:09) Yeah. (16:09) So I I I say to all the time that if you if you threw me off a cliff and told me, help people with diabetes before you hit the bottom, I would yell back up, it's all timing and amount. (16:21) Yes. (16:22) That's it.
Liesl (16:23) Yeah. (16:23) Yeah.
Scott Benner (16:23) That's the whole thing. (16:24) By the way, the podcast should be six seconds long. (16:27) Here it is for everybody again. (16:28) It's about insulin timing and the amount of insulin. (16:31) It's about how much insulin you use and when you use it.
Scott Benner (16:33) That's the entire thing. (16:35) Is it as easy as why the way I just said it? (16:37) It's not. (16:38) But that is at the core of the that's your entire fight. (16:41) Yeah.
Scott Benner (16:41) It's timing and amount. (16:43) So, you get that right, you'll be that's that's the a one c you're looking for. (16:48) That's the variability you're looking for. (16:49) Now you have to get it right at breakfast, at lunch, at dinner, at your snacks, you know, for your your settings, for your, you know, you know, that your Basil uses all day long, you know, for your, you know, for your adjustments, you know, it it's but it's all but, again, at the end, it's just it's the right amount of insulin at the right time. (17:10) It's matching the impact of carbohydrates or body function against the insulin's ability to fight it off.
Scott Benner (17:19) It's kind of it. (17:19) You know?
Liesl (17:21) It's like having another job on top of your normal full time job, isn't it? (17:24) Well, I mean, like it's like having to run two jobs at the same time.
Scott Benner (17:27) It it it reminds me all the time of this is gonna be out of context for you, but there's a, there's a movie now that's getting pretty old with Brad Pitt in it. (17:34) It's called Moneyball. (17:36) And it's a it's about, it's it's not it's a real story about, an American baseball team that eventually, like, kinda bucks the system and goes towards analytics. (17:48) And they start deciding to find the value in players that look valueless in in a normal, in a normal Okay. (17:57) Setting.
Scott Benner (17:57) Right? (17:58) And so they go to this player whose arm is shot, who used to be a catcher, and he needs to throw the ball out. (18:03) And they wanna move him to a position where he doesn't have to throw very much, but he's never played it before in his entire life. (18:09) And they say to him, you know, the the one guy goes, we're gonna move you to first base. (18:15) And he get and the guy says, well, I've never played first base.
Scott Benner (18:18) Well, the guy turns to the other coach and goes, it's very easy. (18:21) We'll teach you how to do it. (18:22) Tell him. (18:22) And he tells the other he tells the other coach. (18:24) He goes, tell him.
Scott Benner (18:25) The guy's name's Wash. (18:26) He goes, tell him, Wash. (18:27) And he goes, it's incredibly difficult. (18:29) And, like and so and and I and so while the one guy's going like, it's easy. (18:34) It's just we'll teach you how to do it.
Scott Benner (18:36) And then the other guy's like, I mean, I don't know, man. (18:38) Maybe we could figure it out, but probably not. (18:41) And I feel like that's how I'm talking about diabetes sometimes. (18:44) I feel like I'm the guy who's like, we'll just move you to first. (18:47) And then somebody else comes along and goes, it's incredibly difficult.
Scott Benner (18:50) But I think it's doable. (18:53) Like, I've seen it enough times. (18:54) And by the way, that was the leap for me. (18:56) I I I'd love to meet the person who figured out the Daphne thing one day because I I was like, look. (19:04) I'm not in this space.
Scott Benner (19:06) I'm not a doctor. (19:07) I'm not a I'm I'm in no way connected to the the technical or professional aspects of diabetes. (19:13) Right? (19:13) Yeah. (19:14) My daughter gets type one in 2006 when she's two years old.
Scott Benner (19:19) I am following what I am being told, and it is not working. (19:23) And I'm becoming overwhelmed, and she's becoming sicker. (19:27) And I'm a 100% sure I'm killing her most days, and I'm probably right. (19:31) And I I look to the people who are supposed to be telling me what to do, and I I come to the conclusion that I don't think they're gonna help me. (19:38) I don't think it's because they don't care.
Scott Benner (19:41) I don't think it's be I just think that whatever it is that they're programmed to say is not helping me.
Liesl (19:47) Yeah.
Scott Benner (19:47) So I dig into my daughter's health and become as much of an expert on all the aspects of it as I can. (19:54) And when I get to the edge of my understanding of it, and I start, like, interviewing other people and trying to find out their understanding of it to kinda, you know, bring together ideas. (20:03) And one day, it just hits me. (20:06) I've got my daughter's a one c in the low sixes now. (20:08) I've had it in the fives, and I know what to do.
Scott Benner (20:12) I'd never quantified it. (20:13) I never wrote it down. (20:14) I'm not as smart as your your grandmother who had the the or, you know, who had the had the list. (20:18) I don't I nothing was written down. (20:21) I just had come to the conclusion that there was a certain number of things that I did.
Scott Benner (20:24) And when I did them every day, her blood sugars were stable, and we had outcomes that we were looking for. (20:30) And so by then, I had the podcast, and I just sat down one day against my nature and wrote down the things that I thought helped people that helped us. (20:41) And then I said I I said, I think this is universal. (20:45) It's not exact. (20:46) Like, don't get me wrong.
Scott Benner (20:47) Like, you can't just do exactly what I do the way I do it, and it's gonna work for you. (20:52) But it's foundational enough that you can adapt it to yourself. (20:56) And Yeah. (20:57) When I started sharing it like that, get a lot of pushback from people, by the way, who said it was dangerous and it was gonna hurt people and blah blah blah. (21:04) And then just a lot of, like, you know, people, you know, toeing the company line.
Scott Benner (21:09) And, we don't talk about it like that. (21:11) I think back then, they were still aiming for an a one c that was eight. (21:14) Were They telling you if you had an eight a one c, you were doing well. (21:17) And and I was like, I don't think that's right. (21:20) You know?
Scott Benner (21:21) And so I shared my thing and then people actually, I you don't know this, but one of the you know, when I very first started writing a blog, like, one of the first pieces of correspondence I got back from a reader that said that the blog was valuable from them was from a person from England who said that Really? (21:38) Yeah. (21:38) She said her and her daughter have been finding a lot of value in the things I've been sharing on on my blog. (21:44) And, and then from there, it just kinda grew and grew and grew. (21:49) But it's not growing from my understanding.
Scott Benner (21:52) It's growing, I think maybe my my understanding is the seed of how it started, but then I had to keep bringing in other voices to try to add on top of it. (22:01) You you know? (22:02) Yeah. (22:02) And then making it and but then back to what we were talking about earlier. (22:06) That's all nice for me and my kid.
Scott Benner (22:09) But if you can't find a way to get it to other people, then if a tree falls in the woods, did anybody hear it? (22:16) Right? (22:16) So, like, then then Yeah. (22:17) Then your job becomes getting it out to people without letting it die. (22:22) Like, so you have to, like so right?
Scott Benner (22:24) Because at some point, that pump company was like, we got a pump. (22:26) This is it. (22:27) Now go out there and sell it. (22:28) Make sure people can get it. (22:29) Put it in their hands.
Scott Benner (22:30) And then they stopped innovating. (22:32) So if you innovate and sell and innovate and sell and keep doing that, that to me is the way you reach more people. (22:39) And I think I I'm sorry. (22:41) I think the more people that we reach, the better chance we have that doctors and and clinicians will will understand that there's a an elevated expectation from people and that they need to meet it. (22:52) Sorry.
Scott Benner (22:53) That was my whole thought.
Liesl (22:55) No. (22:55) No. (22:55) I and I think one of the things that you notice if you being a Daphne educator and being on Daphne courses is the relationship that that I have as a Daphne educator with the people that do the course is different. (23:09) It's changed then forever because they become more familiar with me as lethal and not somebody in a uniform sitting on a desk telling them what to do. (23:20) And I understand more about their lives, how they live with diabetes, what the the challenges are for each person as an individual.
Liesl (23:28) And then they get to meet a doctor on a Daphne course. (23:31) And where they will always say, I only come to clinic to get told off, suddenly they meet human beings who are health care professionals. (23:39) And so there's that mutual understanding and the realization that we're doing what we do not because we like to be bossy, but because we genuinely care and we genuinely have and are working hard to understand, to have empathy, to liberate people from that sense of guilt, and to give them information so they can live their best life. (24:07) Isn't that just what we want for everybody? (24:09) Whether they've got diabetes or not, whether they've got arthritis or not, whether they've got any other kind of life limiting condition or potentially life limiting condition.
Liesl (24:19) We just want them to live the best life they possibly can, and that's why we work in diabetes. (24:25) Because you either come and work in diabetes and you get spat out really quickly because it's not your thing, or you get sucked into work in diabetes and you realize you can't get out because this thing that I hated when I was a staff nurse on a ward suddenly became my be all and end all. (24:42) And that yeah. (24:43) I'm I'm in it for life pretty much.
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Scott Benner (25:09) You open up the email. (25:10) It's a big button that says click here to reorder, and you're done. (25:14) Finally, somebody taking away a responsibility instead of adding one. (25:18) US Med has done that for us. (25:20) An email arrives, we click on a link, and the next thing you know, your products are at the front door.
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Scott Benner (27:06) Can there not be or should there not be, or maybe there is, a Daphne course for doctors? (27:11) Because it occurs to me that any reasonably intelligent physician with a tiny bit of a heart who heard the last hour of our conversation wouldn't pull somebody into a room and and scold them. (27:24) And so, like, is is maybe that not a place where Daphne could could be valuable?
Liesl (27:30) We do that already. (27:31) So we've been training doctors to become Daphne doctors since Daphne started in ninety nine, two thousand when it was rolled out. (27:38) And that's what I was doing this afternoon before the podcast. (27:41) I was doing a a Daphne doctor workshop. (27:44) And so we get them to carb count so they understand what that's like.
Liesl (27:49) We will often talk about the language that's used. (27:51) And one of the doctors on the course today has been in diabetes for about a year, and her comment was, I'm already speaking to people differently. (28:01) I'm not telling people what to do. (28:03) I'm asking them how they are. (28:05) I'm asking them what they would like to be different about their life with diabetes.
Liesl (28:08) I'm asking them what their challenges are. (28:11) And she's only been in diabetes a short time. (28:13) And so everybody that she ever sees in the length of her career, which could be another thirty or forty years, is going to benefit from her having that different approach because she's done her DAFNI training, and she's out there now understanding a lot more. (28:30) I wish she very proud of that.
Scott Benner (28:31) Yeah. (28:32) I I would be as well. (28:33) I just had a 16 year old boy tell me the other day he wants to be an endocrinologist, and I thought, oh, he understands diabetes the way I talk about it. (28:40) He might be an endocrinologist one day and talk about it like that to people. (28:43) Yeah.
Scott Benner (28:43) And and I think that's just it really it's fabulous. (28:47) You know, there there's
Liesl (28:48) Yeah.
Scott Benner (28:48) It could be nothing better. (28:49) It's sad that, you know, it takes so long to change things in society, but there's nothing you can do about that. (28:56) So this is this is what you do. (28:57) You plant a lot of seeds. (28:58) You talk to a lot of people, and you wait for that stuff to grow.
Scott Benner (29:01) And and, hopefully, things move in a better direction, and, generally speaking, they do when people like you are out there doing what you're doing.
Liesl (29:07) Yeah. (29:09) I'm not perfect. (29:10) I have had a situation with somebody where I and, again, it's a family another family member with type one. (29:18) And I said to her, what's the one thing you could do differently that might make things different or might improve things? (29:27) And she just looked at me and said, why can people not just say, well done?
Liesl (29:34) Well done. (29:35) You're doing the best you can today. (29:36) And well done. (29:37) You did the best you could yesterday. (29:39) Mhmm.
Liesl (29:39) And well done because tomorrow, you'll do the best you can do tomorrow. (29:43) And I just thought, of all the people that per that she knows, I should be the one not to ask those questions of. (29:50) What's the one thing you could do differently that might make it better? (29:54) You know, really, I should have just said, well done. (29:57) You're doing your best every day, and I know that.
Scott Benner (29:59) Yeah. (29:59) You're So I you're trying to get still
Liesl (30:02) get it wrong.
Scott Benner (30:02) But but let me let me stick up for you for a second. (30:05) Right? (30:05) So you probably don't see this person that often, and you probably saw that they they made an advancement. (30:10) You thought, if I can get them thinking in this direction, they'll make another one. (30:14) Is that about right?
Liesl (30:15) It's it's because my personality is a fixer. (30:18) I like to be a fixer. (30:19) That's the thing.
Scott Benner (30:20) You know my I I hate to say that part one of my favorite things about this conversation is that when your voice gets a little higher, you sound like, Sharon Osborne when she was younger, which is delighting me. (30:30) Do
Liesl (30:31) you know the funny thing? (30:32) So that she's from Birmingham, isn't she?
Scott Benner (30:34) I don't know. (30:35) I just know that you sound like her sometimes.
Liesl (30:38) Well, I was born in Birmingham, and I haven't lived there since I was three. (30:41) But maybe I'm a bit like my mom, and when I get excited or passionate about something, a little bit of a brummy twang comes out in what I'm saying.
Scott Benner (30:48) Yeah. (30:48) I so much want you to yell, up.
Liesl (30:52) Aussie. (30:52) Exactly. (30:54) That's awesome.
Scott Benner (30:55) Oh, is there anything that we haven't spoken about that you want to? (30:59) Anything that we missed or skipped over?
Liesl (31:02) Goodness. (31:03) We've covered so much, haven't we, Scott? (31:05) We've talked about so much. (31:08) I just the value of education for people with diabetes. (31:12) It's what they deserve, and it should be an entitlement.
Liesl (31:15) That's what I believe very firmly if they if they want it if they want education, they should be able to have it.
Scott Benner (31:21) Yeah. (31:21) No. (31:22) I I agree. (31:22) I I think in any way we can get it to them is important. (31:25) I I will tell you that the, I was just having this conversation, with my actually, with my my nephew.
Scott Benner (31:34) He's in college. (31:35) And he needed to interview people about media, but he had to interview somebody over 50. (31:39) So it ended up being me. (31:41) I wasn't thrilled that I was the right one for that. (31:43) But but, you know, he's asking me about how things have changed about how I consume television or movies and stuff like that.
Scott Benner (31:50) And I found us getting off of a little bit of a he asked about the podcast a little bit. (31:55) And I said, you know, what's interesting is that before the cell phone, the podcast wasn't really possible.
Liesl (32:03) Yeah.
Scott Benner (32:03) Like, right? (32:04) So the cell phones came, and then suddenly there was a place to send the audio to. (32:08) But it really didn't take off until data became cheaper because Yeah. (32:13) People couldn't afford to download an episode of anything because you used to pay for your data by I forget how you did it. (32:18) But but it was expensive, right, to download something.
Scott Benner (32:21) And when data became kinda ubiquitous, then all of a sudden, people could share their their thoughts. (32:29) And I said, and then it and and then you think, well, that's great. (32:33) Until then everyone realizes that's possible, then they flood the area again with with, you know I mean, listen. (32:39) I'm sure everybody's podcast has value, but, like, a lot of information that maybe isn't as valuable, then it becomes confusing to the consumer, then they don't know how to parse through it. (32:49) And then I could hear him, like, getting a little, like, numb in his head, and I said, how many times have you sat down in front of Netflix and scrolled through it for an hour but never watched a movie?
Scott Benner (32:59) And he goes, a lot. (33:00) And I was like, right. (33:01) I was like, so is that much choice good or bad because you didn't watch anything? (33:08) And I he just froze. (33:09) And, and I was like, so I said, yes.
Scott Benner (33:12) Because he asked me how like, he asked me about the distribution of the podcast. (33:16) And I said, so, yes, the distribution is the only thing that made it blow up, but it also let everybody else who could figure out how to sit in front of a microphone do it too. (33:25) And then it puts me in a position of having to, like, persevere through that to get to the other side to continue to reach people. (33:32) I was like I was like, there and, anyway, my point to him was there's no perfect answer to your question. (33:37) Because he his question was, you know, should we all be going to the theater still or streaming better?
Scott Benner (33:43) Like, you know, what what do you find more valuable? (33:45) And I and I said to him, I was like, you're not that's not the question. (33:48) I was like, the question is what's gonna win? (33:50) What ends up being here when it's over? (33:53) You know, like, what is it that we end up settling on that we end up building on for the next thing?
Scott Benner (33:58) And I just I keep thinking about that since I've been talking to him about the, like, the diabetes aspect of it. (34:03) Like, what do we what have we settled on that helps people, and how do we build on it to try to get to the next thing, to get to the next fight, to see if we can fight through it, to see what perseveres comes out the other side. (34:15) How do we build again on that over and over? (34:18) I'm super excited for it to be I mean, I really I I don't know. (34:25) Like, I'm I'm the wrong person for this idea, but I'm seeing people right now using AI for their diabetes in ways that is really fascinating me.
Scott Benner (34:34) I don't know if you've seen people do this or not, but I'm starting to I've done it on the podcast once or twice. (34:41) I probably will do it a little more with people, but I watched somebody do it online recently where they were having trouble with their insulin, and they just they were at wit's end. (34:51) They didn't know what to do, and they just started feeding their their their graphs into, one of the AI models and then having a live conversation with the AI model. (35:01) And the I the person flat out said in their post online, I didn't even know if it was right, but I was so screwed I had to try something. (35:09) And then they tried it, it worked for them.
Scott Benner (35:12) And I was like, that's fascinating because I that I find that's how people get to the podcast. (35:17) When I was talking to my daughter's friend the other day and trying to help her through her thing, I said to her, try to imagine where a person has to be to say, I'm gonna turn a podcast on and listen to it about my health. (35:30) I was like, imagine how lost you have to be to make that decision. (35:34) Right? (35:34) Because that is not a that's not a on its face, that's not a reasonable decision to make for somebody who doesn't know me or doesn't know what's here or anything else.
Scott Benner (35:42) Right? (35:42) I was like, that's how lost people are when they're walking around. (35:45) They're like, maybe a guy will tell me. (35:47) Maybe my AI will know what to do with this graph. (35:50) And and, anyway, like, you're now seeing the AI does seem to know what to do with the graph.
Scott Benner (35:55) I don't know if you've done this, but I've had people go ahead. (35:58) Go ahead, please. (35:59) What were you gonna say?
Liesl (36:00) And I've not because I don't work face to face with, people with diabetes anymore. (36:04) I'm kind of more in the background. (36:06) So watching somebody use AI for their diabetes is not something I've seen, but I do know that there's more and more reliance on apps. (36:16) And one thing I like about your podcast is that it's people talking. (36:20) And if we're not careful, people are gonna lose that peer support from talking to other people who either have type one or have family with type one because it's all gonna be about an app on their phone and the technology.
Liesl (36:34) And I don't think you can divorce that personal connection.
Scott Benner (36:39) Allow me to be hopeful. (36:41) Allow me to be hopeful. (36:42) Maybe the technical side of their life will become so unencumbered or that they can spend more time on the community side. (36:49) Yeah. (36:49) That would be lovely.
Scott Benner (36:50) I hope so. (36:51) Yeah. (36:51) I saw, oh gosh. (36:53) What was I gonna tell you? (36:55) Jeez.
Scott Benner (36:56) The thing, the thing, the thing, the thing. (36:58) Oh, Scott. (36:59) This is terrible. (37:02) It was with an AI. (37:04) Oh, shit.
Scott Benner (37:06) Lisa, look what happened. (37:08) My age got caught up with me there.
Liesl (37:10) Oh, don't worry. (37:10) It happens to me all the time.
Scott Benner (37:11) Yeah. (37:12) Yeah. (37:12) I'm so disappointed. (37:13) I had one last thought, but that that's also a misnomer because I could just keep talking forever, so I don't really have one last thought.
Liesl (37:19) I could talk to you all night. (37:21) So
Scott Benner (37:21) Well, you're very good at this. (37:23) I was gonna say you're, you're you're chatty as hell. (37:25) It's awesome. (37:26) Do you have, you you've mentioned a couple of people in your life that have type one that are in your family. (37:32) Is there other autoimmune in your family?
Scott Benner (37:34) Do you have any autoimmune issues?
Liesl (37:36) No. (37:37) Nothing? (37:37) None at all.
Scott Benner (37:38) Celiac, thyroid, you don't see it through the family?
Liesl (37:42) Nothing. (37:43) No. (37:43) And and you know what? (37:45) I think the biggest lesson I learned when I got really upset when this family member was diagnosed. (37:52) And it just goes to show how you cannot however much you know, you can't divorce emotion from the situation because I was in tears talking to my husband, and he was a bit flummoxed as to why I was so upset.
Liesl (38:05) And through my tears, just said, thank god I'm not a cancer specialist nurse because then she might have got cancer.
Scott Benner (38:12) Oh.
Liesl (38:13) Now how irrational is that? (38:15) It doesn't make any sense at all. (38:17) Yeah. (38:17) But it was just this whole, oh my god. (38:22) This somehow, is this my fault?
Liesl (38:24) Of course, it's not my fault. (38:25) It's just bloody bad luck. (38:28) But it it just taught me the family members of anybody I've ever met who's got type one diabetes will perhaps have gone through emotions, irrational emotions, which I would have laughed at if I hadn't experienced it myself. (38:43) Thank god I'm not a cancer specialist nurse. (38:46) I'm a diabetes specialist nurse because she's got diabetes and not cancer.
Scott Benner (38:50) Well I
Liesl (38:50) mean, that just doesn't make any sense, but that's genuinely how I felt on that day.
Scott Benner (38:55) The unseen stuff, like, unseen psychological stuff is fascinating. (38:58) Like, imagine you you I go out to dinner with my family, and I sit down, and it is in the my daughter's 21 now, but it's still in the back of my head. (39:07) Like, is she gonna pre bolus for this? (39:09) Has she bolus? (39:09) And I haven't noticed because now it's on her phone, and I can't really tell.
Scott Benner (39:12) You you know? (39:13) And now you're all sitting there, and all you wanna say is, hey. (39:17) You bolus. (39:18) Right? (39:19) But you don't wanna put that on her because, a, if she forgot, that's on she doesn't need to feel like I'm watching her.
Scott Benner (39:26) And if she didn't forget, she doesn't need to feel like nobody trusts her. (39:29) But yet in the silence when nobody says, hey. (39:32) Did you bolus yet? (39:33) Everyone at the table knows that everyone else is thinking about it. (39:37) Yeah.
Scott Benner (39:37) And it's and it's in the background. (39:38) It's not right on the front of your head. (39:39) It's in the background, but there's an when I've noticed that every time I sit at a restaurant, until I know my daughter has bolus for food, I'm on some level a tiny bit uptight or or on guard or something. (39:54) I don't even know really how to put it. (39:56) And the minute I realized that she's done it, it's lighter.
Scott Benner (40:01) And I wonder if it doesn't feel that way to her as well. (40:04) You know what I mean? (40:06) Like and and that's the kind of little stuff that if we sat here long enough and talked and talked and talked, we could sit and make a list of a million things like that. (40:15) And Yeah. (40:16) And those things are happening to you all day long whether you're the person with type one or the or somebody that loves them.
Scott Benner (40:22) It just it it's unfair. (40:24) There's that it's the wet towel. (40:25) Like, I swear, I've never thought of that wet towel analogy before in my life, but now I realize it's like it's it's like, you know you know those, like, thin clingy, like, sarongs that you women, like, wrap around the the beach. (40:36) It's like that thin material, but cold and wet and just laying on top of you. (40:42) A little shitty.
Scott Benner (40:43) You know? (40:44) Like, and you can't make it go away. (40:47) But, again, I have seen people with diabetes get together in a room, and I watch that feeling. (40:52) It looks like it lifts off them. (40:54) So
Liesl (40:55) Yeah. (40:55) Yeah. (40:56) And and actually, until you said that out loud, I think I recognize that, and I'm conscious of it, but I'd never been properly conscious of that feeling of of sitting and waiting. (41:06) And once you know that they're bolus, the meal can start, and you can all enjoy it. (41:11) Yeah.
Liesl (41:12) And the other thing, you mentioned something. (41:13) We're talking about emotions. (41:15) One of the things that we ask our DAFNI course participants is about we ask them three very specific questions. (41:23) And we ask them to quantify how overwhelmed they feel by the responsibility of diabetes, how alone they feel with their diabetes, and how much they feel as if they're failing with their diabetes. (41:36) And what we see at the end of that five day course is they've gone from scoring a five or a six, which is what you don't want them to feel.
Liesl (41:46) A five or a six is that it's a serious problem or a very serious problem. (41:50) And at the end of five days, they're scoring a one or or a two, which is it's not a problem or it's a slight problem. (41:57) So to see that impact on somebody's psychological health in just five days is phenomenal. (42:04) But when they fill in the forms a year later, they've maintained that psychological benefit. (42:10) And I don't know any other intervention in health care, be it a tablet or physio or anything else that can achieve that improvement in five days and maintain it a year later?
Liesl (42:24) And even though as an educator, I always knew that was the case. (42:27) I never had the evidence to back it up. (42:30) Now we ask the participants to answer these questions. (42:34) They answer them on their own away from anybody, so there's no coercion. (42:38) And now we can quantify exactly what that improvement is.
Liesl (42:42) And that makes me emotional every time I look at that data because behind the data is a real person with a family who's living a different life because that emotional burden has got less. (42:56) And that to me is is truly what it's all about.
Scott Benner (42:59) You know what the data helps you with too is it helps you stop wondering if it's true. (43:04) It allows you to believe it's true and press forward.
Liesl (43:06) Yeah.
Scott Benner (43:06) I did a thing a few years ago that helped me a lot. (43:09) I did a, there was this really this lovely girl that people reach out to help me all the time. (43:14) They're like, I you know, the podcast helped me. (43:16) How can I help you? (43:17) And at one point, there was this grad student, and she's like, how can I help?
Scott Benner (43:22) And I said, I wanna do a survey to see if the podcast actually helps people. (43:26) And I don't know how I don't know how to do that, so you go ahead and do it. (43:30) And she put a survey together, and we actually got 1,200 people to take the survey. (43:34) 1,200 listeners to take it, which was is a pretty big data set.
Liesl (43:37) A great number.
Scott Benner (43:38) Yeah. (43:38) And, it turns out that the podcast helps them significantly more than their doctors do or anything that they found print online or etcetera for their diabetes. (43:47) And I don't I mean, it's somewhere the data somewhere that from the thing, but the point is that it didn't matter because it let me what doesn't matter is that that I can't quote it to you anymore. (43:58) What it did for me was what was most important. (44:01) It took this thing that I thought I was seeing, that I believed was true.
Scott Benner (44:05) It proved it to me enough that I could stop wondering about that part of it and just push forward. (44:11) And it really it really did allow me to to you know, because I'm not a I I mean, I I I joke around and hear a lot, and I think I try to keep this entertaining so that people will listen about their diabetes, which is not a thing I think most people are inclined to listen to. (44:24) And when I joke around, I think there are times that I can come off like a dumbass because I'm but I I'm not I'm not a I'm not a, like, a crazy narcissist who's just, like, every time I see something, believe it. (44:36) I'm like, yay. (44:37) I'm great.
Scott Benner (44:37) And, like, and I move forward. (44:39) Like, I really wondered, like, is this actually doing what I think it's doing for people? (44:43) Like, I believe it is, but I don't have the ability to just, like I don't know. (44:49) Like, to just take it on face and go. (44:51) And that data coming back was really helpful to me.
Scott Benner (44:54) And I think Yeah. (44:55) You know, same for you is, like, you can say, look. (44:57) Because when you said the thing about the first five days and their score goes up from day one to day five, my follow-up question before you told me about the year after data, my follow-up question was gonna be, but yeah. (45:08) But does that actually matter in the long run? (45:10) Like, or are you just talking them into believing they can do it and they get home and they can't actually do it?
Scott Benner (45:15) And Yeah. (45:16) You know, and that there's your answer. (45:17) And so beautiful. (45:18) Yeah. (45:18) Then run around yelling Daphne at people.
Scott Benner (45:20) You know what I mean?
Liesl (45:21) I do. (45:22) My friends that my friends will be, if if they if they listen to the podcast, they'll be like, well, she was in heaven because she was talking Daphne basically for an hour and a half. (45:30) So she's absolutely in heaven because, yeah.
Scott Benner (45:33) That's Very good.
Liesl (45:34) That's what they know me for.
Scott Benner (45:35) Well, it's like, can't I can't thank you enough for reaching out and for sharing all this. (45:39) I think this has been a really terrific conversation. (45:41) And, I I is there anything if people in The UK, if they don't like, how do they reach, like, a Daphne course if they Yeah. (45:49) If they want it?
Liesl (45:51) So we we delivered Daphne is delivered in a 117 different centers and over 200 locations in The UK. (45:57) So if anybody is interested in coming on a Daphne course, they just need to go to our website, www.daphne.nhs.uk, and it will show you where there's a Daphne centre in their area. (46:09) And it may be that they already have their diabetes care in a DAPHNE service. (46:14) And if they don't, they can ask their GP or their service to refer them to somewhere that does deliver DAPHNE so that they can access a course.
Scott Benner (46:22) Well, you asked before we started, like, said, before we started recording, you said, like, if I use any, like like, British colloquialisms that don't make sense, just stop me. (46:31) And I have to admit, like, I'm just gonna call this episode penny drop, but is that but I don't know I've never heard that before in my life. (46:37) So
Liesl (46:38) Have you not? (46:39) No.
Scott Benner (46:39) So, anyway, that's that's what your episode's gonna be called.
Liesl (46:43) Thank you.
Scott Benner (46:44) Yeah.
Liesl (46:44) I've really enjoyed talking to you today, Scott. (46:46) Thank you so much. (46:47) And as you know, I can as you now know, I can talk about diabetes till the cows come home. (46:51) And, having a conversation with somebody else who's in the same position is is really lovely. (46:57) I've really enjoyed my afternoon.
Liesl (46:58) Thank you so much.
Scott Benner (46:59) No. (46:59) Me too. (47:00) The feeling's mutual. (47:01) Hold on one second, please. (47:07) A huge thanks to my longest sponsor, Omnipod.
Scott Benner (47:11) Check out the Omnipod five now with my link, omnipod.com/juicebox. (47:16) You may be eligible for a free starter kit, a free Omnipod five starter kit at my link. (47:24) Go check it out. (47:25) Omnipod.com/juicebox. (47:27) Terms and conditions apply.
Scott Benner (47:29) Full terms and conditions can be found at omnipod.com/juicebox. (47:34) The conversation you just enjoyed was brought to you by US Med. (47:38) Usmed.com/juicebox or call (888) 721-1514. (47:44) Get started today and get your supplies from US Med. (47:58) My diabetes pro tip series is about cutting through the clutter of diabetes management to give you the straightforward practical insights that truly make a difference.
Scott Benner (48:07) This series is all about mastering the fundamentals, whether it's the basics of insulin, dosing adjustments, or everyday management strategies that will empower you to take control. (48:17) I'm joined by Jenny Smith, who is a diabetes educator with over thirty five years of personal experience, and we break down complex concepts into simple, actionable tips. (48:27) The diabetes pro tip series runs between episode one thousand and one thousand twenty five in your podcast player, or you can listen to it at juiceboxpodcast.com by going up into the menu. (48:51) Hey. (48:51) Do you need support?
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