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Podcast Episodes

The Juicebox Podcast is from the writer of the popular diabetes parenting blog Arden's Day and the award winning parenting memoir, 'Life Is Short, Laundry Is Eternal: Confessions of a Stay-At-Home Dad'. Hosted by Scott Benner, the show features intimate conversations of living and parenting with type I diabetes.

Filtering by Category: Type 1 Diabetes

#1309 I Don't Understand... Arden Two

Scott Benner

Arden and Scott try to figure out how fingernails grow.

You can always listen to the Juicebox Podcast here but the cool kids use: Apple Podcasts/iOS - Spotify - Amazon MusicGoogle Play/Android - iHeart Radio -  Radio PublicAmazon Alexa or wherever they get audio.

+ Click for EPISODE TRANSCRIPT


DISCLAIMER: This text is the output of AI based transcribing from an audio recording. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors and should not be treated as an authoritative record. Nothing that you read here constitutes advice medical or otherwise. Always consult with a healthcare professional before making changes to a healthcare plan.

Scott Benner 0:00
OmniPod, Hello friends and welcome back to another episode of The juicebox podcast.

I got a lot of great feedback from the first one, so let's do another I don't understand with my daughter, Arden. Today's topic is that we don't know where fingernails grow from. You're gonna fall into one of two categories, either you don't know, either, and you'll come along for the ride, or you do know, and you're about to think, oh my God, what's wrong with these people? Nothing you hear on the juicebox podcast should be considered advice medical or otherwise, always consult a physician before making any changes to your health care plan. If you have type one diabetes, or are the caregiver of someone with type one and you're a US resident, and I guess you want to help with type one diabetes research, I'm asking you politely and kindly to go to T 1d exchange.org/juicebox, join the registry and complete the survey. That's it. The survey will take you about 10 minutes. This whole thing shouldn't take you that long at all, and it's super easy. They ask you questions. You know the answers to the questions. It's not like they ask you where fingernails grow from. They're just going to ask you questions about diabetes. You're going to answer them. It's going to be very quick and bickety, bam, just like that, you've helped T 1d exchange.org/juice, box.

This episode of The juicebox podcast is sponsored by AG, one drink. AG, one.com/juice box. When you use my link and place your first order, you're going to get a welcome kit, a year supply of vitamin D and five free travel packs. Today's podcast is sponsored by the insulin pump that my daughter has been wearing since she was four years old, OmniPod. Omnipod.com/juice, box. You too can have the same insulin pump that my daughter has been wearing every day for 16 years. This episode of The juicebox podcast is sponsored by cozy Earth. Use the offer code juicebox at checkout at cozy earth.com and you will save 40% off of your entire order. Hey, arts, what's up?

Arden Benner 2:18
Hello.

Scott Benner 2:19
We're gonna do another episode of I don't understand

Unknown Speaker 2:24
today. We've decided, I'm sorry. I'm

Arden Benner 2:26
sorry, mom. Like, throw the dog's food. Let

Scott Benner 2:28
me just say something. You have no idea how many times I'm up here, like, recording bumpers for the podcast or something, and I start talking like, hello friends. And then just hear like, from downstairs. I'm like, oh,

Arden Benner 2:40
it's always mom. It's always mom. It's her getting ice or like,

Scott Benner 2:44
oh my god, her digging around in that ice tray.

Arden Benner 2:47
She the way she digs for ice is the way that she tries to pick up popcorn. Like, one of those, she goes like, she's like, fluffing it up. Like, that's gonna change the way it tastes. Every time she does that, I'm just like, why are you fingering the popcorn? There's absolutely no reason you have to be doing that right

Scott Benner 3:07
now. I always make her uncomfortable with that when she whenever she touches something, even if it's like, my wallet on the table, I'm like, don't finger my wallet. She's like, Oh, she

Arden Benner 3:16
but that's, that's her. She's taking it the wrong way, because people can always say, like, why are you fingering my food? Why? It's just, it's just a thing. Yeah,

Scott Benner 3:24
she's dirty in her mouth. Yeah, I gotcha. Yeah.

Arden Benner 3:26
She's like, a little teenage boy.

Scott Benner 3:27
Anyway, when I say, like, Oh, I'm sorry about the noise, people on the other end always say, like, I didn't hear it. But no, I didn't

Arden Benner 3:33
think they would hear it. I just thought it was funny because it sounded like she was dumb with the dog.

Scott Benner 3:37
Like, it's like, it's like, she put food in his bowl, but she dropped it from 40 feet. Yeah, that's what it sounded like. She just like her. I don't that'll make it in there. My shoulder hurts, shoulder. Oh, her. That's probably, yeah, we should make fun of her. She's in pain with her shoulder. She might hear this one day, and it'll hurt her feelings. I think she'll listen. She does not listen to my podcast.

Arden Benner 3:58
No, she will because I'm on it. That's what I'm thinking. Maybe because she loves me more. I

Scott Benner 4:03
came downstairs today, I was like, Kelly, I put out a great episode today. I think you would find it really interesting. Do you think you'll listen to it? She's like, No, no,

Unknown Speaker 4:11
I don't listen to your podcast. You know, I

Scott Benner 4:13
made that podcast just for you, right?

Arden Benner 4:15
I know you did. Hopefully one day I can listen to it. Do you

Scott Benner 4:19
think you'll listen to it after my passing,

Arden Benner 4:20
if you pass before me,

Scott Benner 4:24
all right, what is it today that we don't understand you? Tell me you have the list in front of you. Well, it's your list, but all it says is fingernails. What is that I don't I mean, what is your question? Even?

Arden Benner 4:37
Where are they coming from? Someone? Tell

Unknown Speaker 4:39
me where? Oh,

Scott Benner 4:41
so you're saying they're getting longer, but if I feel behind my cuticle, it's not like they're back there and coming out. Like, well,

Arden Benner 4:49
technically, I do know it's true that, like, back behind your cuticle, a little bit your fingernails, lies there, and it's growing from there. It's growing out.

Speaker 1 4:58
It's growing. Going from there or from the tip? No, it's growing from back more the tip is dead,

Scott Benner 5:05
yeah, deader. Wait right here. Yeah, it's

Speaker 1 5:09
not dead, honey. It's not growing from here. No, it's growing from back here. Okay, figure out grows that way, right?

Scott Benner 5:18
Yes, please don't make fun of me while we're making

Arden Benner 5:21
this. Well, that was crazy.

Scott Benner 5:24
Okay, okay,

Arden Benner 5:26
so it's growing, Jesus Christ, it's growing. It's

Scott Benner 5:31
growing from the back, but my finger side, yes, but, but behind the cuticle and under the skin.

Arden Benner 5:37
I do know that to be true.

Scott Benner 5:38
But how do you know that?

Speaker 1 5:41
I mean no is a strong word. US smart people know things your assumption. No, I know that's true. So it's a thing you heard, yeah, okay, and I know that is true, right? That's fair enough. So, like, when I think of this question, I think of Wolverine,

Scott Benner 5:56
you know, X Men, yeah,

Arden Benner 5:59
but if you cut his claws, they would just like, they're a

Scott Benner 6:03
certain length. You know, his claws are made out of the same metals Captain America's shield. I do know such a thing, okay, so, but my point is that they're inside of his arm and they jut out, yeah. So the growth in my mind is like that, like it's pushing out from inside, yeah, but, yeah, yeah, so, but it's building the nail somewhere, like a 3d like a 3d printer.

Arden Benner 6:26
Well, also same to be said with, like, your hair, yeah?

Unknown Speaker 6:30
Because there's not hair inside my brain,

Arden Benner 6:33
like the follicles are on top and then they grow or whatnot. For some reason that makes more sense to me than the fingernail thing.

Scott Benner 6:39
It seems like the same exact thing to me. I

Arden Benner 6:41
don't know. It feels weird because they're like, hard.

Scott Benner 6:46
That's not what I meant. I meant because it's growing from the base, and there's nothing I know, but it

Arden Benner 6:50
just feels unrealistic, because it's like, when I feel that under my skin, like it's like,

Scott Benner 6:55
you can but like now, so like, when you put us, you put a seed in the ground, and it eventually turns into a plant. Where does even that come from? It's got to be the same process in my fingernails, doesn't it? No, I think you're wrong. There's materials that turn into something else

Arden Benner 7:14
and well, obviously that's how it works, but I just don't understand.

Scott Benner 7:18
Okay, so what is it? We have to find out. What is your question? Where do fingernails grow from? Okay, should we ask?

Arden Benner 7:29
You know, what else? What I think is really interesting, how your teeth are bones,

Scott Benner 7:35
yeah, and they grow too, but if you break a bone, it

Arden Benner 7:38
doesn't grow back. Well, yeah, neither do your teeth.

Scott Benner 7:40
How come a gecko can drop its tail and grow it back again? I know that's like some spider man question. When you think of Wolverine, do you think of mall rats? I don't know what mall rats are. More rats a movie with Kevin Smith, where, at some point in the movie, J Muse pretends to be, they're, they're talking about this blueprint of a robbery. They're a robbery, or they're going to take the hat of a secure I forget exactly, but at some point he at the end, he goes and bickety, bam. And then when I think of Wolverine, I think of the words bickety, bam. No,

Arden Benner 8:16
why would I think of that? Wolverine reminds me of Mickey Mouse.

Unknown Speaker 8:18
Wolverine reminds you have Mickey Mouse the same, like hair.

Arden Benner 8:22
Mickey Mouse doesn't have hair his ears, the way his ears are, like Wolverine's little like this, like his hair, because they have, like, his Wolverines like hair supposed to be, I think, like, like a wolf's ears. I'm pretty sure.

Unknown Speaker 8:33
Okay, it's

Arden Benner 8:34
style. Mickey Mouse

Unknown Speaker 8:35
does not have hair. It has he has ears. What is the top of his head? Though it

Scott Benner 8:39
looks plasticky, it's ears. Wait, hold on. I almost forgot what we were talking about. Okay, I'm good. Now, where do, how do what's the question?

Arden Benner 8:50
Where do fingernails grow from? Do

Scott Benner 8:52
you think chat GPT right now is like calling the NSA and they're like, there's a guy in New Jersey, and he seems really dumb. I think you should go get him. Where do human fingernails grow from? Yeah, my daughter is 20 years old. I can't even believe it. She was diagnosed with type one diabetes when she was two, and she put her first insulin pump on when she was four. That insulin pump was an OmniPod, and it's been an OmniPod every day since then. That's 16 straight years of wearing OmniPod. It's been a friend to us, and I believe it could be a friend to you. Omnipod.com/juicebox, whether you get the OmniPod dash or the automation that's available with the OmniPod five, you are going to enjoy tubeless insulin pumping. You're going to be able to jump into a shower or a pool or a bathtub without taking off your pump. That's right, you will not have to disconnect to bathe with an OmniPod. You also won't have to disconnect to play a sport or to do anything where a regular tube pump has to come off. Arden has been wearing an OmniPod. For 16 years. She knows other people that wear different pumps, and she has never once asked the question, should I be trying a different pump? Never once omnipod.com/juice box, get a pump that you'll be happy with forever. The podcast is sponsored today by the place where I get my oh gosh, my sheets, my towels, some of my clothing, a lot of the things that I stay warm or comfortable with. Cozy earth.com I'm wearing a pair of cozy Earth joggers right now. I've recently gotten another pair in a different color. I sleep on cozy Earth sheets. They are so comfortable and soft and temperate, temperate meaning I'm never hot or cold, which is really saying something, because my wife loves to turn that giant fan on, but they keep me nice and warm without making me, like, sweaty or moist. You know what I mean? You don't want to be moist while you're sleeping. And then, of course, the waffle towels I use every day to dry off my bits and parts after I've showered. Cozyearth.com use the offer code juice box at checkout to save 40% off of your entire order. I'm not saying 40% off of one item. I'm saying 40% off of everything you put in the cart. Cozyearth.com use the offer code juice box at checkout. They grow from the nail matrix, which is located under the skin at the base of the nail. The nail matrix is the tissue or root. Oh, root under the what? Why'd you say?

Unknown Speaker 11:33
I said seed earlier.

Arden Benner 11:35
All right, keep going under

Scott Benner 11:37
the cuticle at the base of the nail, it is responsible for producing new cells that become the nail plate. As these new cells are produced, they push older cells forward, which causes the nail to grow outward. Nail plate is the hard, visible part of the nail. Okay, so this, it's made up of layers of Do you know calcium? Keratin, a protein keratin

Arden Benner 12:03
like that you put in your hair to make it silky. Yes,

Scott Benner 12:06
just like in the shampoo commercials, what is in the shampoo? It's not ground up fingernails, right?

Arden Benner 12:12
Ew, why would you say that? What's

Scott Benner 12:14
got to be something?

Arden Benner 12:17
Why would it? What would make you think that is true?

Scott Benner 12:20
Because at one point, wasn't soap Well,

Unknown Speaker 12:23
fat or something,

Scott Benner 12:24
I don't know. All right, hold on.

Arden Benner 12:28
Hold on to that thought. Your thought, you hold on to it. Cuticle is

Scott Benner 12:31
the thin layer of skin at the base of the nail, protecting the matrix from infection. When you get a I hate to say this out loud when you get a manicure? Does it hurt when they trim your cuticles? If they cut them? I find it painful, even if they Oh, my God, listen to me now explain to people that I've had a manicure like when they soak them really well it helps, because

Arden Benner 12:58
it like makes them soft. Yes, yeah.

Scott Benner 13:02
Have you ever noticed how weird My nails are?

Arden Benner 13:04
I don't look at your nails.

Scott Benner 13:06
You really don't know. I'm so self conscious about them. You're not aware of how odd My nails are. So weird hands. My hands are weird. They're

Arden Benner 13:12
so sausagey.

Scott Benner 13:14
I do have really big hands. Yeah, okay, my hands are huge, but that's not what we're talking about. I'm talking about that my nails have a white tip. I'm

Arden Benner 13:23
just telling you you have other things you should be insecure about, and your fingernails are not one of them.

Speaker 1 13:31
I look like I have a French manicure. That's what everyone's nails look like. Wait, everyone has a French manicure? Yeah. Why am I? Why are mine so white? Though I think that's healthy.

Scott Benner 13:41
Wait, this is a good thing. Yeah, I think so. We're gonna find out, because I've been worried about this my whole life. No, I

Unknown Speaker 13:47
think that's bothered me since I was a child. Yeah, I

Arden Benner 13:50
think it's been decent parents.

Scott Benner 13:51
I'm gonna explain it to me. The nail bed is the skin underneath the nail plate. So the plates, the hard part on the top, the cuticle, is the thing that protects you from infection, and the bed is that soft skin stuff underneath, it's not really that soft. Oh my gosh. Hold on, it supplies nutrients and support to the nail plate as it grows. How do it do that?

Unknown Speaker 14:13
You lost me a little bit.

Scott Benner 14:14
The nail bed underneath of your nail is adding is giving nutrients to the plate as it's being built. Right cuticle plate bed. You got it so far.

Arden Benner 14:25
We're in a dark room. I don't know what you're doing.

Scott Benner 14:28
Stop it now. There's also something. There's something called a lunilla, the Lula. Oh, is the whitest? The whitish? How I describe myself, the whitish, crescent shaped area at the base of the nail, visible under the nail plate. So it's kind of the fleshier colored part of the like, right in here of the plate, in by the cuticle. Okay,

Arden Benner 14:53
I didn't know, because, isn't it like, if a nail is like, say it's a square like, it's like that, and then it's like that. It

Unknown Speaker 14:59
has. Like it's dark in here. I can't see what you're doing. Shut up. It's it is just

Arden Benner 15:04
flipped me off. He just flipped me off. By the way. Case you were all wondering,

Scott Benner 15:08
it is part of the nail matrix and is sometimes more visible on certain fingers than others. I have seen people whose lungulas are larger than other people's. Why

Arden Benner 15:17
are you looking at this?

Scott Benner 15:19
You don't ever notice that on people's fingers? No, I

Arden Benner 15:21
don't look at people's hands

Scott Benner 15:22
ever. No, you and I have a similar problem with our finger. Don't

Arden Benner 15:29
tell them.

Scott Benner 15:30
I think they know. They know about mine. I

Unknown Speaker 15:32
don't know if they know about yours. Mine's worse than yours.

Scott Benner 15:35
You think your finger, your pointer finger, is bent further

Arden Benner 15:37
than mine is all of my fingers are bent more than yours.

Scott Benner 15:40
Mine, my left. Wait, this is my right, my right. My right pointer finger bends to the right, like towards the middle finger, pretty drastically, but it also twists that way at the same time,

Unknown Speaker 15:56
so it's twisted and bent.

Arden Benner 15:58
Yeah, let's not start with me. Actually. Do you know that I went to the nail salon when I was little, and the woman who worked there told me that I would be a great hand model. And then I told her. I was like, my fingers are a little crooked. She was like, let me see. And she held them up. She goes, Oh, yeah, you couldn't

Unknown Speaker 16:14
do it. Tell people what they said the last time you went to get your nails done.

Scott Benner 16:19
I'm not sure if you know this about me, I don't drink coffee, but I do have a morning routine. I drink ag one first thing in the morning. I like ag one because it supports my digestion, reduces bloating and helps to keep me you know, on the regular, I love that AG one has these bioavailable ingredients that work with my body. Well, all of the ingredients are non GMO, and they don't contain any added sugar. I just use one scoop a day, and it provides my whole body with gut immune and stress support. So start with ag one and notice the difference for yourself. It's a great first step to investing in your health, and that's why they've been a proud partner of mine for so long. Try ag one and get a free bottle of vitamin d3, k2, and five free. AG, one travel packs with your first order at my link. Drink. AG, one.com/juice box. That's a $48 value for free if you go to my link. Drink. AG, one.com/juice box. Check it out.

Arden Benner 17:18
Okay, so I've been at college. Obviously, I go there for like, five months straight. I don't come home, don't see anyone, and I've been taking, what am I taking? It's switched like four times. I feel but in gerano, yeah, okay, which obviously makes you skinny Mini and I come back and I've lost some weight, and it's not like, I like, I hope I wasn't that when I left, but I come back, and I know all the people at the nail salon we live in, like, a pretty small town, and I walk in there, they say hi to me, everything. And there's this guy who works there. I know him very well, because I've been going there since I was a little kid. And he comes over and he always does the nail polish for me, and he's doing it, and he looks at me, he's like, are you okay? Are you healthy? And I was like, yeah, yeah, I'm good. And I was like, That's That was a weird question to ask. Like, he's never asked me, but he's being nice, making sure I'm good at school. And he's like, Are you sure? And I was like, yeah, why? And he was like, you lost a lot of weight. And I was like, Oh, God. And this is where he gets me. He goes, What did he say? He goes at least 20 or 30 pounds. And I thought, all right, well, shut the up. Like I wasn't. I wasn't wearing tight fitting clothing, nothing. I was just like there was wearing just pants and a shirt, and He, God, made me feel like a little fatty pig. I

Scott Benner 18:38
was buying a plant at a, like, a, what do you call that? Like a nursery, and I'm paying and I'm talking to the guy who I've known for years. And we are good. 20 seconds into our, like, back and forth, and he goes, Oh, hey, it's you. What's up? I went, what? Like, we were already been talking, you know what I mean? And he goes, You look so different. And I said, Oh, thank you. I've lost weight. I just preempted him. But thank you, in case he was because, you know, sometimes people are like, do you have have you Are you sick? Like, you know what I mean? Like, that's why I was being asked. Everyone thinks you have cancer when you lose weight, yeah, yeah. So I'm like, I'm like, No, you know, I and I tell people right away. I'm like, I used that drug you might have been hearing about, I've lost like, 50 pounds. He goes, Oh, you look terrific. And I was like, thank you. And he goes, he lost 50 pounds. And I said, he goes, That's not possible. How could you have lost that much weight? And I said, Well, this is my starting weight. And he goes, Oh, my God, you weighed that much. And I said, Yeah. And he goes, I don't see any loose skin on you. And then I realized he's, like, really looking at me, and he goes, Yeah, like, under your arms look good. And he goes, in your double Chin's gone. And I'm like, I thought I didn't need to lose weight. What happened? He was he was so double Chin's gone. It's not bad for a person who lost weight. No, I'm

Arden Benner 19:57
not saying, it's like, I'm just saying, Did

Unknown Speaker 19:59
he actually say? He said that, I swear to God, Oh, I

Arden Benner 20:01
love that. You know me so well. You thought I was still saying it was there. Yeah,

Scott Benner 20:05
I thought, I thought you were making fun of me, for sure.

Arden Benner 20:07
Should have I didn't.

Scott Benner 20:09
Okay, hold on a second. So what are we talking about? Cell production, cells. I don't want to get back into this. This is your question. You asked about this cells in the nail matrix, divide and multiply. These new cells produce keratin and become part of the nail plate, and then the outward growth pushes it forward. And now here's growth rate. Fingernails typically grow about how much per month. Uh, oh, per month. Um, what are you thinking about? Centimeters?

Oh, wow. Three millimeters. 1.2 inches. Excuse me, point one. Two inches per month. Nail growth can be influenced by factors such as age, health, nutrition and even the season. And nails tend to grow faster in the summer, also for people listening because it is a diabetes podcast that they might be listening inside of your nails can get weird if your thyroid is messed up. And you can get these pit this pitting in your nails if your iron is low. Don't do that. People need to know stuff like that. You can get these. Do you ever see people with ridges in their nails,

Arden Benner 21:17
like little I don't look at people's hands like that. Well,

Unknown Speaker 21:19
it's a way to figure out your health. I

Scott Benner 21:23
understand why you're upset with me. You don't want to help people get helped by stuff like that. They'll be listening back. I was listening to this guy and his dumb daughter doesn't know anything, and they were talking about fingernails, and I learned that my

Arden Benner 21:37
iron to this beautiful girl and her freaky dad, who looks at people's hands, so however she

Scott Benner 21:41
ends up saying it like you might end up helping her. But here's the real deal, we need to know, where does keratin in shampoo come from?

Arden Benner 21:53
What?

Unknown Speaker 21:54
Why are we looking this up? Oh, because, oh, are

Scott Benner 21:56
you afraid it's gonna ruin shampoo for you? No. Oh, I think it's going to stop. Oh, look at this. Yeah, you're not gonna like this at all. Okay, but

Arden Benner 22:06
tell me, animal

Speaker 1 22:07
derived keratin, sheep wool, that's fine. Kerington is often extracted from you're saying it right?

Scott Benner 22:15
Keratin? I think it's,

Arden Benner 22:16
is it keratin? I think it's cured keratin, not keratin. No. Keratin. No. Keratin. Keratin. That's not what you're saying. You're singing like a you from Philly.

Scott Benner 22:25
It sounds the way it sounds. I don't know what you want from not an excuse I got you out of Philly. Now you have some bastardized northeast version of talking a keratin is often extra. I also can't say the name Carrie. Carrie. Yeah. Can I say it? It sounds different to me when you say it than what I see curry. I think I'm you're saying

Arden Benner 22:46
curry, curry. Yeah, you're saying curry. Like, see you are like, Steph Curry. But

Scott Benner 22:50
when you say say it, Carrie, that sounds like Carrie to me. Carry Yeah,

Arden Benner 22:55
no, your E's and your A's are so wrong. It's unbelievable. You should be humiliated.

Scott Benner 23:02
I am a little humiliated. It's extracted from sheep wool, which is a rich and sustainable source. The wool is processed to break down the keratin protein into a form that can be used into cosmetic products. Now here's another way they get it, from bird feathers.

Arden Benner 23:18
I don't have a problem with any of these

Scott Benner 23:20
chickens are another common source of keratin. They are processed similarly to wool extract, and they it's extracted, okay, cattle hooves and horns. No problem with that. Keratin can also be extracted from the hooves, and I don't care about the explanation, just

Unknown Speaker 23:36
give me them. That was it.

Scott Benner 23:42
There's also plant based keratin. Scientists have developed synthetic keratin, like proteins using biotechnology, which just sounds like you get in scalp cancer. But let's take a look. These alternatives mimic the properties of natural keratin are used in vegan and cruelty free products. Oh, the ones you said you were in no trouble with were cruel, hmm, says they're cruel. I mean, where do you think the hooves from the you think that they just trim the nails to the cows dead? I don't know. After they kill the cow for meat, they lop off the feet and make

Arden Benner 24:13
shampoo with it. Okay, well, it's already dead.

Scott Benner 24:17
Like that's the argument of the animal side. But, okay, also soy, wheat, corn. Plant proteins from sources like soy, wheat and corn can be hydrolyzed, broken down into smaller molecules to create carton like proteins. These hydrolyzed plant proteins are then used in shampoos and vegan alternatives to animal derived carton. The production process is the carton is extracted from animal byproducts through a process of hydrolysis, hydrolysis, hydraulic hydrolysis. Done. Hydrolysis, hydrolysis.

Arden Benner 24:48
I've heard that word one

Scott Benner 24:49
more time, okay, where the protein is broken down into smaller peptides, amino acids. GLP, one's a peptide.

Unknown Speaker 24:56
Were you trying to say amino acids? Did I not say amino.

Scott Benner 25:01
And because I just having another thought at the same time,

Arden Benner 25:03
the extracted characters that you're like talking so much right now,

Unknown Speaker 25:07
do you want to read? No, I

Arden Benner 25:09
just fear that this is too much reading and we have to talk. Okay,

Scott Benner 25:13
so, so enough of what keratin is. Yeah. I say,

Arden Benner 25:18
like they can wikiHow this. Well, if

Scott Benner 25:21
they can do that, then what do they need? The podcast. For?

Arden Benner 25:23
That's the whole point. Is, we're supposed to talk. We're supposed to be the entertainers. How

Scott Benner 25:26
would I tell a child how fingernails grow?

Arden Benner 25:32
Are you serious? Right now, I

Scott Benner 25:33
want to see if it dumbs it down, because there's part of me that doesn't understand what the matrix is. Oh, it calls it the nail factory, the matrix. I didn't like that. Explain the MIT, the nail matrix in more detail. I know this is going to be I think, I hope somebody finds this interesting, because I kind of do just so hot in here. I Yeah, you gotta take off your sweatshirt? No, okay. Oh my god. We're almost done with this anyway. Let's just tell people that Nell matrix is found beneath the Q. We know that the primary function, we know that the matrix so you

Arden Benner 26:12
know what I'm realizing, yeah, that it didn't dig any deeper. No, not even not that there's not that like, you don't actually have to dig that deep for anything. Nothing's that deep.

Scott Benner 26:24
I see what your point is. You know, like, there's no more to be told about, but, yeah, like, that's

Arden Benner 26:28
just what it is. Well, there is, I mean, I'm sure there's more to it, but that's like, science, that's like, that's getting, like, gets into like, molecules and stuff like that, not just the explanation, yeah, yeah. But for explanations, there's only so much that you can say,

Scott Benner 26:41
Okay, I do have a question. Why is nail fungus so hard to get rid of?

Arden Benner 26:49
Why do you have so much trouble with this?

Scott Benner 26:52
I don't have so I want to just first say, I do not have nail fungus, but I've heard people get it, and it's really difficult to get rid of, like toenail fungus and stuff tough pro so it says that dense keratin, keratin, I don't know how to keratin. You've messed me up now on that.

Arden Benner 27:10
No, you were already messing it up

Scott Benner 27:13
there, protein that is difficult for medications to penetrate. It makes it hard for the antifungal treatments. Oh, it makes sense. Pause,

Arden Benner 27:20
don't me and Cole have too much keratin in our skin, and that's why we get those weird patches.

Scott Benner 27:25
Do I have that too? Is that what, like, old, like, I have some age marks? Is that what age marks are?

Arden Benner 27:30
No, I think you're just old.

Scott Benner 27:34
Wait, wait, can? What's the question? Can too much?

Arden Benner 27:38
It's not a question. It's just like, is that true what I just said,

Scott Benner 27:42
Where do you think you have patches? What is it you've heard?

Arden Benner 27:47
Like, you know, like me and Cole, like, sometimes, like, on our stomachs, we'll get like, darker patches, and we're like, what is that? And then we have to use, like, that special whatever to wipe it off in your belly

Scott Benner 27:56
button. Yeah? Oh, my god, yeah. What is that?

Arden Benner 28:00
It's, I think it's keratin. Probably it's like a build up of keratin.

Scott Benner 28:05
Oh, and like dark spots on their skin though, too. That's

Arden Benner 28:08
probably the same thing, um,

Scott Benner 28:12
small, rough bumps to appear on the skin. Yours isn't rough, arms, thighs, cheeks or buttocks. You ever get on your buttocks? I

Arden Benner 28:18
don't think so. I can't see back there, though.

Scott Benner 28:20
So this isn't that. That's not that. No, I

Arden Benner 28:23
swear it is. Oh, wait,

Scott Benner 28:24
and then there's so it also talks about psoriasis ichthyosis, a group of genetic skin disorders characterized by dry, scaly skin. Yours isn't scaly, so a buildup of keratin can make these things. No, I think I'm right, and psoriasis is an autoimmune condition that accelerates the growth cycle of skin cells. Psoriasis.

Arden Benner 28:44
Kim Kardashian, she's always like, my psoriasis is acting up. Does

Unknown Speaker 28:49
she say that? Yeah,

Arden Benner 28:50
oh my god. Like every episode of the Kardashians, there

Speaker 1 28:53
was a commercial, psoriasis isn't a problem, right, right? But, Kim Kardashian,

Scott Benner 28:59
there was a commercial when I was a kid for something called Gold Bond. And it was like a cream and it would say, Do you know the the like it would, it would, oh, my god. How do they put it? Are

Unknown Speaker 29:12
you gonna mask this thing,

Scott Benner 29:14
Gold Bond? Use your brain. Do you know the dad?

Arden Benner 29:19
I think that chat GGP is going to be the reason that you stop using your brain. It could be, and that's not because it knows everything, no, but it actually doesn't, because it cannot help me with my math homework.

Scott Benner 29:29
I think your problem with your math homework was your teacher. Yeah, right. That was upsetting.

Arden Benner 29:37
That's just, that's just the education system. I'm telling you. That's why I don't understand money.

Scott Benner 29:42
That's in another episode, okay, I think we're done. You understand how nails grow? No, but it's fine. No, the matrix makes the cells and they double and build and they get it.

Arden Benner 29:55
You don't do you do understand? I

Scott Benner 29:57
was proud of myself because I think I understand this. Point? No, I

Arden Benner 30:00
get it. It's just not as deep as I wanted it to be. What

Unknown Speaker 30:02
did you expect was happening? It's like, you know, you

Arden Benner 30:04
know how we're talking about, like, when you travel somewhere and you think it's going to be so much different from where you already are, and it's like, actually not that different at all. That's just how the world works. I think, yeah, disappointing, isn't it? The world is kind of a little disappointing, okay, because it's like, it's so interesting. Like, you every day, like, you're supposed to talk to people and make conversation, but you can only make conversation of what you've done that day. But they're like, I don't want to, like, hear about this over and over and over again, but then it's like, well, that's all I got. Like, that is what we have to talk about. Like, I don't know what to tell you,

Scott Benner 30:37
that's my day. I can talk about this or nothing, yeah. Well, how come people, you know, I woke up this morning because in my dream I was so I had a dream last night that I was trapped in a house with some people that I grew up with, and I forget why we couldn't get out like as I look back on it, now, I know it was this incredibly detailed dream, but I forget almost all the details. So

Arden Benner 30:58
who was in my dream last night? Go ahead. Homelander from the boys. Yeah,

Scott Benner 31:03
was he mean, or did he like you? He actually

Arden Benner 31:05
liked me, which made me feel like I might be a terrible person, but we can get to that in a cycle. Okay,

Scott Benner 31:10
so I woke up because I finally gotten out of the house, right? Like we've been trapped in this house for so long, it felt like we were never gonna get out like we were prisoners. And then there it was. The door was open and I could leave. And I said, Hey,

Speaker 1 31:27
I gotta pee before we go. All right? And I walked back in the house to pee, okay? And then I woke up and I had to pee. Are you acting like that is crazy. I don't think it's crazy. Not crazy at all. That happens to people all the time. How come we don't tell people about that in

Scott Benner 31:39
the middle of the day when they ask how you're doing? And I said, I say,

Arden Benner 31:42
I would tell people about that, but the problem is, if I tell that to mom or call, they're gonna be like, Okay, that's stupid.

Scott Benner 31:47
But we have a weird division in our house, though, because you and I think alike and they think alike. Yeah, yeah. So wait, what was this about homelander?

Arden Benner 31:57
Oh, I had a dream last night that homelander was in and I think some of the boys cast was in it, but I remember him being there because I don't know where we were, we were not we were not at home, but I feel like we were definitely like northeast, but as more like city, like, not like New York, kind of like suburbs, I don't know, But I'm in someone's house, and then he just, like, showed up, and I was like, Well, I know, like, he's gonna kill us. And for some reason, like, he thought I had information that I did not have, and I had to be like, I do not have this information. And he, like, fully believed me, because I did not have it, and I, like, was not afraid to tell him that. I was like, I don't have the information you're looking for. And I was like, but I know someone who might so then I took him somewhere. It was like, to a shop or something. I don't know why. And then after we were there, like, we had to fight some bad people. Makes me wonder if they were bad, because I was with homelander. And then after it was over, he like, I was just a normal person, but he like, really, he thought I was really smart, and he trusted me, because I was like, I'm not gonna get killed by you. Like, I'm getting out of this. Situation, because I'm not a part of it. And then we were kind of like,

Scott Benner 33:06
buddies after that. Do you think that in that dream, homelander was college, and you were working your way through it, and it didn't kill you? No, not at all. I think you just made that up. Okay, I

Arden Benner 33:15
was just wondering. I think you might have been in like, I actually think I saved your life. Oh, I

Scott Benner 33:18
was hoping I was gonna be a superhero. But no, no,

Arden Benner 33:20
none of us were superheroes. That hurts. Yeah, and I didn't see him, like laser, anyone or anything, did I?

Unknown Speaker 33:27
I don't know. I think everybody's watching

Scott Benner 33:30
this show that knows what you're talking about. Me should watch it. If they have Amazon Prime to watch it. Well, they should watch it. How weird is it that if you have Amazon Prime, your packages get there sooner, and you get to watch the boys.

Arden Benner 33:43
Yeah, interesting. And upload

Speaker 1 33:45
and upload. Oh, people don't do people know upload. I don't think people know upload. Good

Scott Benner 33:50
show, good show, Amazon Prime, made by the guy who produced the American office.

Speaker 1 33:56
Oh, really, yeah, I didn't know that. What's his name? Greg,

Scott Benner 34:01
something maybe hold on a second.

Arden Benner 34:04
How about Steve Carell gets better looking as time goes on.

Scott Benner 34:09
He does. Let's talk about that. Yeah, is he gray? Now? Yeah, he's gray. Greg Daniels is the guy's name, by the way. He's worked on the US version of the office parks and rec, King of the Hill, and, of course, upload, which is a great show on Amazon Prime, only three seasons. Yeah, I think there's another one coming. There's been two, and there's one more coming, and there's three, and there's another,

Arden Benner 34:35
there's one more coming, or there might be more than that, but it's like, definitely, I think they're making it, for sure. I'm a fan. Yeah, it's really good. And the main guy with Robbie something, chef's kiss. You like him? He's the main character in the duff too, not the main character, but he's the main guy. I've liked him since I was little. Wait. And his cousin is the green arrow,

Speaker 1 34:57
Steven Amel. Amel, oh, it's Robbie Amel. Rob. You know, and when you said chef's kiss, was

Scott Benner 35:02
he in a show called chef's kiss? No, just were you giving him a chef's kiss? I thought that's what you're doing. I thought you were offering it. But then I was like, maybe it's a TV show on the CW, I don't know.

Arden Benner 35:10
No, but you're welcome for the bear, for that recommendation. Oh,

Scott Benner 35:13
the bear. Excellent. We'll have to, like, find a way to talk about television in some of these episodes, if we can. What am I hearing? Is it like scratching? Yeah,

Arden Benner 35:22
something's moving.

Scott Benner 35:24
It's one of the it's one of the chameleons, bugs. They can't get out of where they are. No, it's fine. They're fine. They can't get to you don't

Arden Benner 35:32
know that. It's like, it's it's really loud. It's just moving

Scott Benner 35:35
around. It's fine. It'll stop. They can't get out of there.

Speaker 1 35:39
Come on, you're okay. The chameleons have to eat. No, they don't Sure they do. How are they gonna get big and strong?

Arden Benner 35:46
You'll feed them whenever. But I text you, and I'm like, Hey, can you make breakfast? And you're like, Oh,

Unknown Speaker 35:50
do you think? Oh, my God. Do

Scott Benner 35:52
you think it's a good idea to record yourself telling people that at 20 years old you're texting me, yeah, a couple more days at 19 years old, you're texting me to make you breakfast. I

Arden Benner 36:00
think that makes perfect sense. You only get me in this house for so long.

Speaker 1 36:04
I've had you for 20 years already. No, I go to college. It feels like long enough, and then I come home and I expect you expect for me to make you breakfast every day, but you're also making yourself breakfast and not at the same time. You get up later than me. You should get up later when you asked me to make you breakfast this morning, I had been up for five hours already,

Arden Benner 36:25
Dad, I don't want to talk about it. I had a bad night. I did not feel good. I had cramps.

Scott Benner 36:30
I know I'm sorry. Okay, we're done with this one. I think this was good. Thank you. Goodbye.

If you'd like to wear the same insulin pump that Arden does, all you have to do is go to omnipod.com/juice box. That's it. Head over now and get started today, and you'll be wearing the same tubeless insulin pump that Arden has been wearing since she was four years old. I'd like to thank cozy Earth for sponsoring this episode of The juicebox podcast and remind you that using my offer code juice box at checkout will save you 40% off of your entire order at cozy earth.com that's the sheets, the towels, the clothing, anything available on the website. A huge thank you to one of today's sponsors. AG, one drink. AG, one.com/juice box, you can start your day the same way I do with a delicious drink of ag one if you're newly diagnosed, check out the bold beginnings series. Find it at juicebox podcast.com, up in the menu in the featured tab of the private Facebook group, or go into the audio app you're listening in right now and search for juicebox podcast, bold beginnings. Juicebox is one word. Juicebox podcast, bold beginnings. This series is perfect for newly diagnosed people. Thank you so much for listening. I'll be back very soon with another episode of The juicebox podcast. If you're not already subscribed or following the podcast in your favorite audio app, like Spotify or Apple podcasts, please do that now, seriously, just to hit follow or subscribe will really help the show. If you go a little further in Apple podcasts and set it up so that it downloads all new episodes, I'll be your best friend. The episode you just heard was professionally edited by wrong way recording, wrongwayrecording.com. You.


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#1308 Up in Smoke

Scott Benner

Cheyenne was diagnosed with T1D in 2022 and she has experienced workplace discrimination.

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DISCLAIMER: This text is the output of AI based transcribing from an audio recording. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors and should not be treated as an authoritative record. Nothing that you read here constitutes advice medical or otherwise. Always consult with a healthcare professional before making changes to a healthcare plan.

Scott Benner 0:00
Hello friends and welcome back to another episode of The juicebox podcast.

Cheyenne is here. She has type one diabetes since 2022 she's in her 30s. Cheyenne is on the show today to talk about discrimination that she met at her job at a weed dispenser, and she's going to tell us about having her gallbladder removed. I'm pretty sure this is the only podcast where you're getting those two stories in the same episode. Nothing you hear on the juicebox podcast should be considered advice medical or otherwise, always consult a physician before making any changes to your healthcare plan. Don't forget to save 40% off of your entire order@cozyearth.com All you have to do is use the offer code juicebox at checkout. That's juicebox at checkout to save 40 percent@cozyearth.com when you place your first order for AG, one, with my link, you'll get five free travel packs and a free year supply of vitamin D drink. AG, one.com/juicebox. Lots of people with autoimmune seem to have trouble with their thyroid, and that's why I've made the defining thyroid series, juicebox podcast.com. Click on defining thyroid the menu to find out more.

This episode of The juicebox podcast is sponsored by touched by type one. Touched by type one.org and find them on Facebook and Instagram. Touched by type one is an organization dedicated to helping people living with type one diabetes, and they have so many different programs that are doing just that. Check them out at touched by type one.org this episode of The juicebox podcast is sponsored by the continuous glucose monitor that my daughter wears, the Dexcom g7 dexcom.com/ dexcom.com/juicebox, get started today using this link, and you'll not only be doing something great for yourself, you'll be supporting the juicebox podcast. Today's episode is sponsored by Medtronic diabetes, a company that's bringing people together to redefine what it means to live with diabetes. Later in this episode, I'll be speaking with Jalen. He was diagnosed with type one diabetes at 14. He's 29 now he's going to tell you a little bit about his story. To hear more stories with Medtronic champions, go to Medtronic diabetes.com/juicebox or search the hashtag Medtronic champion on your favorite social media platform, Cheyenne.

Cheyenne 2:39
And here to basically, kind of go over some things about discrimination and what it's like to be diabetic and working with, you know, discriminatory practices

Scott Benner 2:53
well. So let me get a couple things from you. Okay, so yeah, when were you diagnosed with type one? How old are you now? So

Cheyenne 2:59
I was diagnosed with type one in 2022 and let's see, I am 31 now. So I was 29 when I was diagnosed. And basically I the trajectory of how that worked was, I had a gallbladder removal surgery in June. I started working at this dispensary in August, and we were not due to open to the public until December of that year, so we were pretty much meeting virtually up until then, and I got diagnosed with diabetes, pretty much, actually, strangely, by my primary. You know, it was the typical symptoms of thirsty. I mean, I was going through like two gallons of you could find me with a gallon of water consistently. I was peeing every 20 minutes. Losing a lot of weight. I looked like, it's like, Why do I feel like this? What's going on? But hey, I look amazing. So I was like, hell yeah, but no, I really look terrible. But either way, I got diagnosed by my primary, who was like, Hey, I think you might have type one diabetes. And I'm like, I don't know what that is, because I'm like, the only one in my immediate family. We had no prior knowledge to diabetes at all. I was like, diet, what? Super confused. And he was like, Yeah, you know, you might have diabetes. So between him thinking I have diabetes and having to confirm that with insurance to get cleared for insulin, I ended up in DKA pretty severely, and I was in the ICU for about five days. I went in, you know, it was Thanksgiving, and I was like, why am I so sick? You know, what's going on? I was projectile vomiting all over the place. Went into the hospital, and they were like, full blown. DK, oh, full blown. I mean, literally, like, I got very lucky in the fact that, because I'm a pukey guy. I puke literally, like, over everything, all the time. So at the time, we were like, Am I just puking because I'm having a stomach issue? Am I puking because I have the flu? And we were like, all right, something's wrong here. Our doctor was like, Hey, you might have diabetes. Maybe these two things are connected. So

Scott Benner 5:17
I have to tell you, Cheyenne, I know we're going to talk about, like, job discrimination at some point, but I'm gonna be hard pressed not to call this episode A pukey gal.

Cheyenne 5:26
Please do like, Yes, I'm for it.

Scott Benner 5:30
So let me make sure I understand the timeline a little bit. You've started a new job, you have your gallbladder removed, yeah, okay, yep. And then a couple of months later, you start vomiting, and you're losing weight, you're excessively drinking that kind of stuff. Is that all

Cheyenne 5:46
right? Definitely. Yeah. So Thanksgiving, I'm in the hospital, and it's pretty bad. When you go in there, the ER is full. They take you immediately, and they take me back. They took my blood sugar and said, Oh my god, oh my God. And that must have been the scientific word for what was going on, because that's all anybody could ever say. Was holy and oh my god. And they immediately admitted me. And from what I understand, my a 1c going in there was almost 18, which was the hot, yeah, that was apparently the highest I just thought that I couldn't see because I couldn't see either, like, my vision was blurry. I was just like, weak. I get pictures actually, from when I was first admitted. And I was like, This is what this looks like. How

Scott Benner 6:31
long? Hey, Shane, how long do you think you had been type one and not known? It probably about

Cheyenne 6:39
six to eight weeks, okay? And it was, it wasn't, it wasn't too long, but it was long enough, for sure, to where my body was like, Well, this is wrong something, something's really wrong here. Yeah, so I'm in there, and they're like, Yeah, this is definitely wrong. This. There's something going on. And they finally, they didn't give me, I think, my first insulin shot until, like, the after 24 hours or so, but as soon as they did, it's like my whole body woke up. I was like, oh, oh, I feel better now. I can see I stopped throwing up, and I'm like, oh, that's, that's what I need. Was insulin.

Scott Benner 7:13
So, so hey, why did you have your gallbladder out?

Cheyenne 7:16
So I was actually having, I was having stomach issues to the point where I was, like, constantly puking, and like, I still have, like, I have suspicions that I have, like, something called Barrett's esophagus. I've got some pretty I've had, like, two upper GIS, and I've, I can't It's a weird, strange thing about me. I physically cannot burp. I've never been able to burp. It's like, air comes up my throat and then returns down to my stomach, so it's always caused me stomach issues. And they were like, Here, let's get your gallbladder out. And I was like, Can I have a piece of what's in my gallbladder? And the doctor was like, Yeah, sure, if I can get you one. And he vacuums it out and says it was like, grains of sand in there. And then let

Scott Benner 7:58
me ask you a weird question, yeah? So you have stomach acid, you have acid reflux, oh,

Cheyenne 8:03
horribly. I cannot miss a single dose of like, an antacid a day, or I am in trouble and I don't drink. I'm a person who doesn't drink anything but water or coffee.

Scott Benner 8:14
Do you think you have low iron?

Cheyenne 8:16
Have you ever been definitely, definitely, because I take iron. I take, yeah, okay,

Scott Benner 8:21
because the proton pump inhibitors that you're taking for the acid blocks iron uptake. And this is going to sound crazy, I have Barrett's okay. I don't know how badly I have it or not, but they said they saw like the beginnings of it when they scoped me. I think I'm supposed to go back again, I guess I should do that, and my iron is always low, like to the point where I needed infusions, like I was shutting off, but I went on a GLP medication a year ago for weight loss. It's actually been like 13 months ago now, and I've lost 50 pounds. So that's nice, but the GLP slows down your digestion, right? So when my digestion slowed down, my acid reflux started to go away, and I just had my blood work done yesterday, and my ferritin level is 180 and I haven't had an infusion in over a year. That's crazy. Yeah, by now, my iron, my ferritin level, would have been in the teens without the GLP medication. So I'm not saying you need a GLP, but I'm saying I feels like you and I have similar issues. This episode is sponsored by Medtronic diabetes. Medtronic diabetes.com/juicebox and now we're going to hear from Medtronic champion, Jalen. I

Speaker 1 9:39
was going straight into high school. So it was a summer. Heading into high school was that particularly difficult, unimaginable. You know, I missed my entire summer, so I went to I was going to a brand new school. I was around a bunch of new people that I had not been going to school with. So it was hard trying to balance that while also explaining to people what type one diabetes was. My hometown did not have an endocrinologist, so I was traveling over an hour to the nearest endocrinologist for children. So you know, outside of that, I didn't have any type of support in my hometown.

Scott Benner 10:12
Did you try to explain to people, or did you find it easier just to stay private?

Speaker 1 10:17
I honestly, I just held back. I didn't really like talking about it. It was just, it felt like it was just a repeating record where I was saying things and people weren't understanding it, and I also was still in the process of learning it, so I just kept it to myself. Didn't really talk about it. Did

Scott Benner 10:32
you eventually find people in real life that you could confide in? I never

Speaker 1 10:37
really got the experience until after getting to college, and then once I graduated college, it's all I see. You know, you can easily search Medtronic champions. You see people that pop up, and you're like, wow, look at all this content. And I think that's something that motivates me. Started embracing more. You know how I'm live with type one diabetes,

Scott Benner 10:57
Medtronic diabetes.com/juicebox, to hear more stories from the Medtronic champion community.

Cheyenne 11:05
Oh yeah, for sure, I've had these stomach and crazy issues pretty much ever since I've had a stomach like,

Scott Benner 11:12
I'm sorry. I'm asking you this, and I've No, you're good, and because we got we started in video, I've seen you, and you're like, younger than me, and I feel weird about this, but how do you poop? Is it good or not good?

Cheyenne 11:24
Oh, not. Okay. So here's the other thing too. So I, let's say this, I have not consumed more than about 500 to 800 calories in over

Scott Benner 11:35
15 years because you're afraid of what happens on the other side.

Cheyenne 11:38
Yes and no. It's for multiple reasons, for eating disorder, reasons for mental health reasons and for environmental reasons. Okay, pretty much so many factors that when they were like, diabetes, we were like, Huh, what like? Well, where did that come from? Because

Scott Benner 11:58
people think type two. They think weight, you're not heavy, like, that whole

Cheyenne 12:03
thing actually under. I would be considered somebody who's underweight. I went in that hospital at almost 92 pounds, and I am a, I think I'm like, 120 normal 122 right now, yeah, I'm

Scott Benner 12:16
just gonna ask, like, does the poop come out nice and like, the way you want it to be. Is it, like, reasonably firm, or is it squishy, or is it thin? Nah,

Cheyenne 12:24
it's like, squishy and floaty and like, Fatty, like, almost like celiac. But I've been tested for celiac and I don't have celiac. I'm

Scott Benner 12:30
gonna say something sideways crazy to you. Yeah, no, go for it. So I have an episode that'll be coming out later this year, with which I don't know if it'll probably be out before yours, I got together with like, a gut doctor, right? And he's not even a doctor. He's like a gut guru kind of guy, and I spend a half an hour, you'll hear it in the episode, explaining to him basically how my digestion works, you know, start to finish, and I get done, and he says, I'd like you to take slippery elm bark or slippery elm root. Oh, my God, let me look it up. I take it every day. Okay? I should probably know what it is, right?

Cheyenne 13:07
I know what that is, actually, yeah. Do you really? Yeah? I do. I do.

Scott Benner 13:11
Okay, so I slippery elm and I take these two tablets every time I eat. And in a day and a half, I was shooting like a king.

Cheyenne 13:24
I'm literally like, writing that down right now. It's going in my in my shopping cart.

Scott Benner 13:29
I'm gonna go into Amazon for you and actually find it for you, right? And so, like, you know? So then he said he also gave me a digestive enzyme to take along with it that actually had HCl in it, which is hydrochloric acid. I think, yeah, yeah. He goes, I know that seems counterintuitive, because, of course, you have, you feel like you have extra stomach acid. And I was like, right. He goes, but just like, you know, Humor me. And I was like, All right, man, like, whatever. So, all right, I'm gonna give it to you here. I'm taking Horbach slippery elm bark capsules. Oh, it's 4000 milligrams. They're like, $9 like, for, for, like, I don't know how many of them, 90 of them, or something like that, right? And, um, and I'm my stools come out the way you want them to.

Cheyenne 14:22
That's good, because I swear it's been a problem my whole life. I

Scott Benner 14:25
saw me too and and then I did. I added the the HCl like he asked me to. But I want to get that one for you. It's a digestive enzyme with an HCl. See if I can just search HCl. Oh, look at that. I bought Thorn beta team HCl and pepsin digestive enzymes for protein breakdown and absorption. 225 capsules. This was expenses. $42 for the 225 capsules. I'm taking one of them when I eat, along with two of the slippery ELMS and. It literally changed my life. Yeah, that's that's going in my shopping, right? And then, and then my son, who has, like, the same exact issue as me, I was like, try these, and he's now taking them without me asking him to, oh, wow, which says something. And so now that, here's the thing, is that this is masking a problem. It isn't fixing a problem, right, right? And so I am in the middle of doing like, a urinalysis for him, for the guy, and then he says that once he gets my urine analysis back, he'll be able to tell me what to do to hopefully heal this like and so we don't have to be masking it. So I don't know how that's actually going to go or not, but even if I just mask it for the rest of my life, it's way better than it was.

Cheyenne 15:41
Yeah, that's good to know, definitely, because I tell my primary a lot. I would like to just, instead of mask the issue, I would like to get to the root of the cause and attack the cause.

Scott Benner 15:52
If you take slippery elm and send me an email a week from now and you're like, I can't believe I'm going to the bathroom better. That's crazy. I would love to hear, I'd love to hear if it did or didn't work like but I'm gonna get past

Cheyenne 16:03
that. I'm gonna send you a poop diary. Oh, my God,

Scott Benner 16:05
would you that'd be fantastic. The Dexcom g7 is sponsoring this episode of The juicebox podcast, and it features a lightning fast 30 minute warm up time that's right from the time you put on the Dexcom g7 till the time you're getting readings, 30 minutes. That's pretty great. It also has a 12 hour grace period so you can swap your sensor when it's convenient for you. All that on top of it being small, accurate, incredibly wearable and light these things, in my opinion, make the Dexcom g7 a no brainer. The Dexcom g7 comes with way more than just this, up to 10 people can follow you. You can use it with type one, type two, or gestational diabetes. It's covered by all sorts of insurances. And this might be the best part. It might be the best part alerts and alarms that are customizable, so that you can be alerted at the levels that make sense to you, dexcom.com/juicebox, links in the show notes, links at juicebox podcast.com, to Dexcom and all the sponsors. When you use my links, you're supporting the production of the podcast and helping to keep it free and plentiful. I would somehow like, think that was funny and like it, because I want to know if it works for people. Because that's why I'm, like, it's why, my God, you have no idea shine. Like, I let him record his entire intake. Meeting with me, it's embarrassing. Like, but I just That's so

Cheyenne 17:31
funny. I'm putting I'm doing it right now. It's, like, already ordered and, like,

Scott Benner 17:36
I'm like, let me find out if this, like, if it's gonna help other people, then, like, let's do it. You know what I mean. Anyway, okay, I'm sorry. So you're in the hospital. DKA. I mean, you your, they said your ANC was like 18. What was your blood sugar? It had to be over 1000 Oh, god,

Cheyenne 17:49
yeah, it was like 1280, and so, so prior to that, I was still I was taking my blood sugar with like a meter. But to be honest, at that time, because I had no education in it, I didn't really know what I was looking for, yeah. So often the numbers I was seeing was between 360 and then just straight high, and I'd be looking at it like, yeah, hey, hi to you too. But can you tell me, like, what the number is? Because I don't know what I'm I don't know what I'm doing here, but I'm pretty sure that high needs bad and

Scott Benner 18:18
so remind me your GP. Put you on to the idea of diabetes, but really wasn't. But then you were in a fight about insulin with insurance. Is that right? Yes,

Cheyenne 18:26
yes. Because I was on Medicaid, and they were like, well, that's weird. We need to have, they wanted, like, two to three rounds of labs. And because I was, like, still working, I didn't really have the time between two weeks. Okay, yeah, it just kind of, it was a bad timeline. They were like, well, we need labs. And I was like, Okay, I'll get that done somehow, while I also have to work. And then between that time, I was like, ended up in the hospital.

Scott Benner 18:51
So now, how does all go? How does all of this impact your employment, right?

Cheyenne 18:56
So, because we were still meeting virtually, I get into the hospital, and I was there for about five days, I had communicated with my bosses pretty much primarily through text message and email, which we will learn that was a big mistake on their part. Okay, they primarily communicated with me this way. They said, hey, no big deal. We understand. Let us know when you get out of the hospital we will go from there. So the time, I'm like, Okay, sounds great. I also didn't have any sort of clue as to approach like an emergency FMLA or anything like that, which I did learn is a thing in some states, not for everybody and not for every employer, but it was an option for me. I just didn't know it at the time. Okay, so I get out of the hospital and I start. They wanted me for insurance. I think what it was is they wanted me to do a diabetes education class to get on they wanted me on the pump immediately. They wanted me on a CGM immediately. Basically, they wanted me to have everything pretty much right away. I didn't wait six months any of that. So I went to a diabetes education class, which proved to be pretty much, I don't want to say useless, but it was useless because not only was I the only, the only type one in there. But no, I I didn't learn anything. Truthfully, all they did was really talk about how to how to portion and work with food. And as somebody who was pretty much obsessed with everything I put in my body for like, a long time, I already kind of knew how that worked, so I didn't really need to be there. And I took that class. Was still trying to meet virtually with work. They told me to just stay home. Don't worry about it. By this time it is December, we were supposed to open up, but we didn't, so we were still meeting virtually, plus also meeting twice a week in person. While we were doing these meetings, we were essentially just just like bullshitting. There really wasn't much working. To be honest. It was just hanging out on Zoom and bulging.

Scott Benner 21:06
So you're saying that working for a cannabis dispensary was not like taxing work.

Cheyenne 21:11
It really was not for this company, not for this one. It's not like that everywhere, but for this particular one, because it was such a weird situation, because we weren't open yet, right? It was just wild. So, yeah, so we were not open still, and we were just meeting virtually, plus two days a week. And between all that, I was still taking classes, and let's see, what else did they have me do? Oh, yeah, I do meet with nutritionists. That's right, I had to meet with another nutritionist, and she sat me down twice a week for, I think, like, two to three weeks. And was like, you know, can you put together a plate of food for me? And then was like, Okay, you need to be here. So I was like, Well, I'm not learning anything from anyone, and that's what prompted me to kind of study on my own, honestly, and that's actually how I found this podcast was looking on my own. I was like, Oh, this makes sense. And now I'm being, I'm currently being treated by my primary, but also I'm being treated by a nurse practitioner who specializes in type one, so she's wonderful. And so I've currently got a great care team, but it took me some cherry picking to really get to where I'm at with that. I

Scott Benner 22:20
see? Yeah, I mean, it takes time. It sounds like you got the pretty classic, you're an adult, like, we're not going to give you any kind of guidance here. Did they even set up your insulin for you? Did somebody help you with like, initial settings a little

Cheyenne 22:36
bit in the hospital? I do vaguely remember, like, as I was so hungry, that was one thing I do remember in the hospital being so hungry, and they would not feed me, and they were restricting me from everything. And one side I'm gonna, I'm gonna Sideswipe here to this hilarious story of me eating 100 milligrams of cannabis while I was in the hospital, thinking it was no big deal, and I tried to sneak out of my room to the vending machine twice, and they were like, Cheyenne, where are you going? And I was like, the vending machine. And then they would come take my blood sugar. Was like, why is it so high? What did you eat? And I said, I didn't eat anything. And Cheyenne, Why are your eyes so red? I don't know. And

Scott Benner 23:21
so let's discuss for a second prior to all of this. And I imagine, like, what's your weed usage look like?

Cheyenne 23:31
Oh, I mean, I'm a classic user. I definitely cannabis every day,

Scott Benner 23:35
right? You wake and bake or you,

Cheyenne 23:39
I wouldn't say, like, not really on before, like, work days and stuff, but on the weekends, definitely,

Scott Benner 23:45
you smoke the flour. Do you vape it? Do I

Cheyenne 23:49
just primarily enjoy flour and definitely edibles.

Scott Benner 23:52
Gotcha so you're in the hospital, and you think I should probably be high.

Cheyenne 23:58
I was so hungry and I was so bored, and it was Thanksgiving, and I was so angry about everything, and frustrated, and like, all I wanted were mashed potatoes, and I didn't get any. So I had somebody

Scott Benner 24:13
like, I just, I just want to do something just like the pilgrims. You thought maybe a couple of gummies would really straighten the whole thing up. Yeah,

Cheyenne 24:21
it's no big deal. And but I wasn't thinking the fact that I hadn't, like, consumed any cannabis for like, several days before that. And so I was like, Yeah, that was a brilliant idea. So

Scott Benner 24:33
you was not so it rocked you, it rocked you, and then you started snacking. Yeah?

Cheyenne 24:38
I tried to sneak out, like, to the vending machine multiple times. I did not have money. I don't know what I thought I was doing.

Scott Benner 24:48
Mr. Zagnut, come out, come out.

Cheyenne 24:53
I don't know what what I thought I was doing or what the goal was there, but it wasn't I.

Scott Benner 24:59
Did you tell them? Did you say, Look, I'm

Cheyenne 25:01
high No, to be honest, I think they probably had some idea. They figured it out. They probably had some sort of idea. Yeah,

Scott Benner 25:11
you started talking about Mr. Mystic suplex, and you're like, yeah. You're like, okay, so you're, you're higher than, like, than you're accustomed to being, because you hadn't done it in a little bit, and then you

Cheyenne 25:22
hit it hard, yeah, yeah. And then I was so hungry, and they just gave me insulin, so I was, like, feeling better, and I just was, I just was, like, I just want to go home. And like,

Scott Benner 25:34
yeah, okay, all right, yeah. So

Cheyenne 25:35
we're now in, like, January. We are now the store is open and I'm going, I'm I'm still working from home, because they're telling me to over text message and email. I'm regularly checking in with them, and they're like, Hey, we have an idea for you. How about you stay home and do this work from home, gig where you can do product descriptions. So if you've ever looked on like Leafly. I heart Jane product descriptions, just like picking stuff, if you ever click on a cannabis menu, you click on a product, there's a description. That's what I used to do, is write those descriptions. Oh,

Scott Benner 26:11
this flowers nutty, and is a mellow high. And that kind of is that at all

Cheyenne 26:16
the way that cannabis is so it's such an interesting plant in the way that, like, I feel like the names generally don't mean anything. It really just boils down to the lab work. And what's present in the plant, you can say indicosity, the hybrid, or, you know, Scrum, DeLeon, just chronic OG fire Cush, and it could be whatever, but it's really just boils down to what's present in the lab works.

Scott Benner 26:44
So the THC levels,

Cheyenne 26:47
right? THC levels. THC A your, you know, all that stuff. So all the cannabinoids that are present in there and stuff.

Scott Benner 26:55
What about the way you decide to burn it? Like, like, what's the difference between, like, smoking it versus putting it in a bong, versus maybe putting it in one of those, like, high heat, you know, the vapes that don't actually do, yeah? What are they called? Like,

Cheyenne 27:09
like, a vaporizer, yeah, okay, yeah. Sorry about Higa. Hi a high temp. I got a, I got, like, a dry flower vape, and I like that thing a lot. It's pretty cool. But, uh,

Scott Benner 27:18
is there a difference? Like, can you put the same flower in three different places and get definitely different impacts?

Cheyenne 27:25
I wouldn't say different impacts. I would just say maybe different ways of entering your body, like smoking, no matter what is going to be the fastest way that it enters and also leaves your body, so versus, like edibles, where it's still going to have to go through that digestive process,

Scott Benner 27:45
it has to get metabolized and go through, like everything, and that takes longer.

Cheyenne 27:49
Uh huh,

Scott Benner 27:50
what about the drive ape? Why? How is that different than smoking?

Cheyenne 27:53
I wouldn't say it's necessarily different other than the way that it is heated. I believe it's got, I can't necessarily remember off the top of my head, but

Scott Benner 28:05
you're just not, you're not taking in smoke, but it's hitting you kind of similarly. Yeah,

Cheyenne 28:10
it's like this. It's like the same, because it's still like a you're still inhaling something. It's still got, like a risk of a carcinogen, no matter what, sure, but it's definitely a little bit healthier in the fact that it's vaporizing, just, I believe the THC portion, not the rest of the because I know for sure, like, you can take dry flour out of your dry herb vape and you can reuse that, and it will be still flour. It's just not going to be as potent. You could still use it to bake and use edibles. Okay, yeah, there's

Scott Benner 28:42
something still left there. Yeah.

Cheyenne 28:45
But you can't, like, do the same thing where, like, if you put it in a bowl and smoke the whole bowl and there's nothing left, like,

Scott Benner 28:51
so, yeah, so you, you couldn't go through a dry, like, a high heat dry vape and then take the what's left, which is probably pretty, like, I would say there's, there's no moisture left, and it's almost burned, right? If you tried to smoke that, you wouldn't get anything out of

Cheyenne 29:06
that. Probably, you might get a little bit, but it would, wouldn't be nearly the same. All right, I'm following, okay, I

Scott Benner 29:11
learned a lot of this podcast, yeah, yeah. So now they're like, Hey, do this. Stay at home, job. Write the descriptions for the for the website, and you're doing that, and that's going fine,

Cheyenne 29:22
yeah, so I'm doing that up until let's see. It turns out that I started doing this. Let's see we're open now. So January, February, March, I did that for about three months. And during that time, I started learning very, very, very much about the CGM, about the pump. I was pretty well good to go. So I'm on the pump. I have the OP five, and I've got the Dexcom g6 so I've got my phone, plus I've got that OmniPod, you know, the receiver. And so out of the blue, I receive a text message one night that says, hey, you need to come and work full time into the store. Or or you're basically going to lose your job. And I'm like, alarmed considering I received this text message, this text message at 11pm like the night before, and I'm like, well, that's odd. So I responded and said, Why? Basically, like, what's about,

Scott Benner 30:18
Bill, what changed since you told me you wanted me to work, since you told me you wanted me to work from home,

Cheyenne 30:23
right? Exactly? I said, Well, I don't have a problem with that, but I just want to know why. And they basically were like, you know, we're not being rude. We've been more than lenient enough with you. No other job would hire you under these conditions. They said all kinds of things they're not supposed to say.

Scott Benner 30:41
So Cheyenne, so your, your understanding was that, hey, they offered me something to do that was from home, and I accepted it. Now you're kind of seeing all the sudden, they were giving me this because I was in the hospital, like I was having these problems, and they were trying, like, so they they're it feels like what they were trying to accomplish isn't what you felt like on your side and then. And so they're basically sitting over there thinking, like, how long are we going to put up with this? And you're over that your house, thinking, this is my job. This is exactly what they want from me, right? Yeah. Okay. I

Cheyenne 31:18
think they thought this was going to be a very quick over and just be done. So I start going to the store. It's now March, going April and May. I'm trying to work full time, and so this was like a 45 minute drive. I'm doing this for 40 hours a week. If I was even one minute late, I was getting wrote up. They just basically really had it out for me. And I also have a printed schedule where they cut my hours only mine, cut mine in half, and in that same day, they hired on somebody of their own relation, which was against company policy. So they replayed. They were slowly replacing me with somebody, right? That was like a family member or something like that. Okay, so I'm trying to work in store while this is going on. I'm having things like highs, I'm having things like lows. I'm having to take insulin and things like this. During this time, they would often say that I was either making things beep or like, I want them to go off as much as they're going off,

Scott Benner 32:27
or they complained about the alarms on your devices. Yes,

Cheyenne 32:31
they would say I was doing it on purpose, because the person that was reporting to not because I shouldn't say it's a cause. However, he would often compare me to his wife, who was type two, and I'm learning now how different those are. But at the time, I really didn't know exactly how different. I just knew they were very different. Okay, he often would say, like, I just need to eat better, or I just need to do this. I'm just not trying hard enough, and I'm doing this on purpose.

Scott Benner 33:02
Oh, so now 55 Yeah, so now this at a snack, yeah, because I see so the now there's a person you're working for directly making

Cheyenne 33:11
me do things in bathroom. Okay, okay, so the same person offered me the work from home is, yeah, now saying, come in here, so I'm working in store with him, and give me these bits. And then took them away without any sort of warning. And then was like, Hey, you're gonna come do this. Also, we're gonna cut your hours in half. Also, you have to take your insulin outside. Also, if your thing goes off and you pull your phone out, we're gonna write you up all Cisco. You know, it was just like, one thing after another. Do

Scott Benner 33:43
you think you were doing a good job? Like, were you accomplishing the work and the time frame that was reasonable and doing like, well, at it? Yeah,

Cheyenne 33:50
yeah. Because, well, my role changed once I got into the store. Once I was in the store, I was just performing in store work with everyone else, which was including just stocking, counting, taking inventory, because that's all I ever did, was inventory. Okay, so it was very the same work that everyone else was doing, and

Scott Benner 34:09
you were also also, you were, you were working for somebody who commingled type one diabetes with type two diabetes. So now if your alarms going off, he's he or she is saying you're not, you're just not eating well, or you're not trying hard enough. And then probably were they communicating that back to the company, like Cheyenne, you know, it's beeping all the time, but if she just did this better, it wouldn't be like, do you think you were being painted in that light by somebody? So

Cheyenne 34:38
as it turns out, so we'll get there. So here, here goes, here goes it. So May and June rolls around, and I went out to visit my mom, who lives in Vegas. I go out to visit her. I get in touch with HR, who is in Arizona. I stopped by. And introduced myself and said, Hey, I feel like there's something going on here. I'm starting to feel discriminated towards it's there was also a lot of other things going on that led up to this, but this was really the big push was I had another co worker who was type two. It was just the constant I just feel like that something was wrong. So I go to talk to HR, they told me they did not know who I was. They did not know I was working from home. No one should have done no one should have offered me that. And what should have happened was I should have applied for emergency FMLA. I should have emailed HR once I was in the hospital, which when I emailed my boss, I CC to HR, but nobody responded to me. In that email,

Scott Benner 35:49
the whole thing's kind of bungled, like a long way. Okay, they

Cheyenne 35:53
had no idea that I was even what it turns out was, is that the position and the role that I was performing at home was actually part of my boss's responsibilities and duties for the company. I was doing part of his job that he did not himself want to do. So he basically passed it on to me, and then, once it no longer became an option, he said, I want you to come work in store. And I think what they thought is that I was going to say no, and they were trying to get ready No, right? Yeah, so they thought I was going to say no, and they hired the relative, right, and cut my hours, replace my hours with theirs. I got this all in email and text message, because from then on out, I started emailing HR every time something was going on. Once I returned back home, one day it was this, I believe it was, let's see. So this is almost about a year later, so let's see it is now, okay, so it's like July, so they call me in there, into this room and put me at a table with him and his assistant manager. And this man is full blown screaming at me, and he is telling me that I am making this up. I don't know what I'm doing. I just need to leave. Basically, you know, if I don't, like, what's going down, there's the door and get

Scott Benner 37:24
out. And what did he say? You were making up that

Cheyenne 37:27
the whole thing that I'm just not, quote, unquote, this sick. I didn't do any of this. And I just, I'm doing this all on purpose for for show, like, for an act. And I'm like, Yeah, because I'm totally spending money on devices and carrying them around for, for what reason? Like, it's just bizarre. Yeah, absolutely bizarre. And it was really what it boiled down to, was nobody wanted me there. They didn't like me. They wanted me to leave. That's really just what it boiled down to, because for I just it was a mess. So I'm shaking at this point because I'm sitting in a room with a man who's screaming at me, and I'm like, this is this is nuts. So I was like, okay, may I please be excused. And he said, yeah, if you don't like the door, get out. So you know. So I just get out and I go downstairs. I grabbed my stuff, I walked outside, and I called HR, and they told me to leave. So when I left, they sent me a text message and basically told me not to come back. So wait, who told you not to come back? The my boss. My boss is this company.

Scott Benner 38:32
I don't want you to tell me what company is, but it is it big enough that human like, is it in a corporation and there's like a big Human Resources thing, or is this a small company, and there's like one person who's HR, there was

Cheyenne 38:45
like one person in HR, and that person apparently, like, I guess HR, changed positions and roles so many times that nobody even knew anything. Okay, nobody knew anything. So

Scott Benner 38:58
this is a startup company, right? Like it's, it's not like an offshoot of another company, or it is,

Cheyenne 39:05
actually, it's an offshoot of a bigger company. It is the LLC that owns, I believe, like real estate properties, and I think they're, they're headquartered in, I think, yeah, they're headquartered in Arizona, so, but the LLC does not exist anymore, from what I understand and

Scott Benner 39:24
and the LLC was the weed like the weed company, yeah, they owned a

Cheyenne 39:28
couple dispensaries and some grow ops in that area. They owned one other dispensary in Maryland that coincidentally was shut down over another lawsuit. Then they had this particular one in Missouri that no longer exists. So

Scott Benner 39:40
what are we talking about? Like, a bigger company that had some cash and decided to try to get into being in dispensaries too? Yeah,

Cheyenne 39:46
I think that's pretty much what it was. Okay, I think that's what it was, is they just tried to open a dispensary in Missouri, and it did not. They hire

Scott Benner 39:53
a bunch of people, get the thing up off the ground, and it has a lot of business problems because. Maybe these aren't business people. Maybe they're more weed people than business people, or something like that,

Cheyenne 40:03
right? Okay, 100% Yeah. They just, they didn't know what they were doing, and

Scott Benner 40:07
they think you're faking this whole thing or, or it doesn't even matter now, because, like, there's been this kind of like attitude that's been fomenting. So basically they just, they just see you as, like, a liar or dirty or not, something that they want around. So now they're just, like, on, like, unarmed, fully, just trying to push you out the door.

Cheyenne 40:27
Yep, essentially, okay, so they pushed me out the door. I was like, well, that's the end of my job. And I basically, I mourned this for probably a while, because I was just frustrated at the fact, like, is this going to happen to me at every job? Is this something that I can do anything about, like, what's going on? So I filed for unemployment that October, yeah, that October, and I got it so that told me that they fired me. So from then on, I kind of did a little research, and I paid a couple of lawyers for some consultation and sent some emails off, and I couldn't afford for any of them to take my case. But what I couldn't afford was the consultation, and each one was like, honestly, you have you have something, you have something here, and I'm like, Okay, well, I'm gonna keep going with that. So what I did was, is I filed with EEOC, and that takes months. That takes months they have to review your case. I assign you a worker, and I went over pretty much this entire thing with them, sent them all the emails, all the text messages. They also deemed that I was being discriminated against and that I was fired, and it definitely looks like they gave me benefits and then took them away, which was pretty much the primary reason that I won this lawsuit. Okay, because, okay, it's not illegal to be an asshole. You can be an asshole all day and night, but it is illegal to separate somebody from the company based on a disability, which is pretty much what they did. And

Scott Benner 42:11
you said a minute ago, like you spent a lot of time worrying about this, because in your mind, you weren't around diabetes ever. So now suddenly you have it, and the first experience you have is an employer being like, Oh my God, you have diabetes. I gotta get you out of here. And now you think, this is gonna be my life, everywhere I go, how am I gonna get a job anywhere?

Cheyenne 42:29
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I was terrified. I was sad because I enjoyed cannabis, and that was like something I wanted to do. So I was like, well, now I feel like I'm there goes everything I worked for. There goes all my studying. There goes there goes everything and yeah, plus the employee discount. Yeah, no kidding, right? Which is not that great. Honestly. I was like, Well, yeah, so the end of that.

Scott Benner 42:55
So do you hire an attorney? Does an attorney finally say, like in these, like your your consultations, does one finally say, Look, I'll do that. I'll do this for a piece of the settlement. Is that how you were able to do it? Or no, you have to pay for it.

Cheyenne 43:09
I actually, yeah, you got to pay for all of that. So what ended up happening was, I represented myself and I had, I did. I had all my notes in front of me. I sounded a lot more organized than I do this morning, and I had everything to go and this mediator. They're not, they don't really. They're not there to take sides. They're just there to referee essentially, yeah, but they saw everything. They went through everything, and I don't want to say they took my side, or they kind of took my side, and the company even what happens then. So during this mediation, they immediately opened with saying that I tried to quit because I left the building. The mediator immediately interrupted that and said that is not a topic of discussion because I received unemployment, which deems that I was fired. So immediately they backtracked that, and they said they were like, Okay, well, what is it that you want? Basically, and so the mediator and I, they separate lines, so like you and the mediator get to talk separately. It goes back into the meeting, and then they talk separate again. And it's very different than it would be if you were, like, going to court, because this was all virtual. Most of this is actually done virtually. Is

Scott Benner 44:35
what you ended up with, health insurance and free weed. Is that what you asked for?

Cheyenne 44:41
I can wish. I can wish

Scott Benner 44:45
so. So when you get into that that that separate space with a mediator, what do you tell them that you'd like? So

Cheyenne 44:52
she actually, they were great. They said, I don't want to tell you this, but ask for 10 times more than your. They get. And so what I asked them for was 50k that's so wild, right? It's a wild number. It does not, it's that's not what I got, right? I ended up with 10k okay, and that cover, and to be honest, that covered my unemployment because unemployment only paid me like 3160 and because of a bunch of hullaboo with Missouri not spelling my name right, I didn't get my unemployment until like, six months later. So

Scott Benner 45:29
the money just helps you bridge the gap and until you can find another job. Yeah, doesn't make you rich. It doesn't like, set you up or anything like that. It's not like, not out of a movie. It's enough money to keep your rolling so you can find more work. Yep,

Cheyenne 45:43
absolutely. So basically, it helped me pay my car it helped me pay some of my family members back. It helped me definitely get through that period 100% it was a very long and daunting process, because in total, it probably took me about a year and a half. Oh, my God. As far as filing for unemployment, filing with EEOC, meeting with three different lawyers for consultation. What kind

Scott Benner 46:12
of work do you do now? Did you find you found what

Cheyenne 46:14
I do now? Yeah, so I got very, very lucky, and I am incredibly lucky, and this is what I want to end with, is on a great note, because the job I have now is fantastic. And I mean, absolutely wonderful. I get to work with AI, I get to work with large language models. The company that I work for is scale AI, they are a wonderful company. And not only that, but they my first day there, when I talked to them about diabetes, they said, Is there anything we can do to make your job easier here? And I had to go in the bathroom and just ball because I couldn't believe that cared enough that they wanted to help. Not only that, I have my I got my own cabinet there that has my own juice, my own snacks that Nobody's allowed to touch. It's cheyenne's cabinet because, because they give a sht, and it's so nice because I went from somebody basically telling me to get the out, I'm faking it to this company who not only cares, but they know I'm doing this right now, and they are like, wanting the link to this immediately. They were like, we can't wait to hear it. And I'm just, I couldn't be any more grateful. Take

Scott Benner 47:38
you seriously and give you some support so you can do your job.

Cheyenne 47:41
Yeah, like,

Scott Benner 47:43
I do you need that much more grateful giant, really, I

Cheyenne 47:46
know I don't. I don't. I just want God, I just wanted somebody to not treat me like garbage, to be honest. Like

Scott Benner 47:54
it does sound like you were stuck in a situation with people who would have maybe distrusted anything that they didn't understand, and then went right to, went right to get away. Like, just get away from us. You're this is, this is more than we bargained for. We don't want to be involved, like, you know, like, I don't want to know about your diabetes. I want to hear the beeping, and I don't want to, I don't want to hear you had to go to the hospital, like these people just were not interested in any way, shape or form, and and then handle it absolutely, and then handled it really poorly,

Cheyenne 48:27
absolutely, yeah, and that is what we that is what we all agreed upon, like, like they basically said, You can be an asshole day and night. That's not the the part that got me that settlement, what the illegal part was, was providing me that work from home, benefit, ripping it away for no reason, and then also further, saying things like, you're lucky to have a job here. No other job is going to hire you, calling me names. That was definitely one, locking me in a closed room, plus they were done. They didn't even know that I was in conversation with HR on a separate note. And had, I think, had they known that maybe things would have went a little bit differently. Well,

Scott Benner 49:13
also, Missouri is a work at will state. Oh,

Cheyenne 49:16
absolutely, yeah. So they could fire you if they don't like the color of your shirt.

Speaker 2 49:19
They could have just fired you if they did it right exactly, and there wouldn't have been any recourse whatsoever for it for you, because it's they could have just said, I mean, anything. They could have said you were late one time you're fired. They could have said you counted something wrong you're fired. They could have, and I'm sure you made a mistake here and there. They could have fired you for any reason at all like work, it will like, honestly, United States labor law workable employment is an employer's ability to dismiss an employee for any reason and without warning, as long as the reason is not illegal. They literally picked the wrong reason. You know, they

Cheyenne 49:55
did this to themselves. Yeah, 100% and. As it's all set when it's all said and done. To be honest, I'm the one that ended up with a better job. That man is now retired, quote, unquote, he

Scott Benner 50:08
got away from him, you know. I mean, that's good for you. Yeah, he apparently,

Cheyenne 50:12
well, soon after this all went down, not soon after, but a couple months after, I had gotten word that the entire team got fired. After that, they just ended up closing the dispensary. They

Scott Benner 50:23
lost the will to work too, huh? Somebody else was like, I'm getting rid of Well, I'm gonna guess after they had to pay $10,000 to you, somebody took a hard look at them, and then that's what happened afterwards. They got rid of

Cheyenne 50:37
it. I have no idea what really prompted all of that, but I can certainly say with confidence that the people that put me in a locked room were fired after me and

Scott Benner 50:51
made me feel good. Yeah, tell me the locked room story. I don't think you mentioned that before, but

Cheyenne 50:55
I had gotten comfortable with my receiver. I was getting ready to kind of talk to them about, hey, this is what's going on with this. These are what these beeps mean, blah, blah, blah. And they're putting me in a room, and they said, This man is starting to scream at me. And he's like, you, you are making this up. My wife has type two. All you got to do is just eat better this, you know? And then he said, our co worker down there, she has type two. There's it's just diabetes. Cheyenne, it's just diabetes. It's not this big of a deal. And had done all this, and then was like, if you don't like it, there's the fcking door. And so I was just kind of baffled at first, because I couldn't believe he was full on screaming at me like that. But then as soon as I said, Soon it was done, I'm sitting there shaking, basically. And I had said, you know, because I know better now, and because of previous ways that I have behaved in workplace settings when things like this have happened, I know better now. And so I said, May I please be excused, and I'm proud of me for that. And I got up and I got my stuff, and I walked outside, and I immediately called HR, and that was the best thing that I could have done, instead of losing my cool, instead of getting angry, instead of lashing out, instead of anything, I just let him, let him go off and said, May I please be excused? And that was the hit. But

Speaker 2 52:24
was that? What does that have to do with a locked room? Did they bring you in that room, lock the door and yell at you? Yep. Oh, so talk about that for a second, like, I got to see you a little bit before we started like you're a, you're a, you're a lean girl, like you're not. I mean, how tall are you?

Cheyenne 52:40
I'm about five four. Yeah, I've always been known as a little bit of a smaller kind of person. I'm little.

Scott Benner 52:48
You're a small 2930 year old person in a room with a guy probably 20 years older than you, who locked the door and then started screaming at you, Yep,

Cheyenne 52:57
yeah, along with another his all his assistant was in there too, and she was, um, typing this whole interaction down, recording, supposedly just

Scott Benner 53:08
from your from, listen, not obviously, you can't prove anything, but your perspective was she horrified?

Cheyenne 53:14
No, she didn't care. She was just kind of, like, going, she just didn't care.

Scott Benner 53:19
Were you scared? Like, like, physically scared. It wasn't

Cheyenne 53:23
that I was physically scared, but I was certainly alarmed that he was full blown screaming at me, especially in a room that is being recorded. I was, like, looking around at the cameras, like, are you serious? And do you have

Scott Benner 53:36
any fear that he would like come towards you, or anything like that? Or it wasn't like that.

Cheyenne 53:39
Ah, nah. He was just sitting in a chair like yelling at me, Jesus. I mean, he was really doing something. I guess I don't know. He was really intimidating you. Yeah, he was 100% trying to intimidate me without it being physical. And that's

Scott Benner 53:56
pretty physical, though. Like, I mean, restricting your movement with a listen, say what you want bring someone to a room and locking the door is, is a, it's a move. You're, you're saying something when you do that, right? And then, like, this is very official. This person over here is going to be taking down notes from what happens here. You're, you're meant to feel scared at that point. And then they

Cheyenne 54:18
presented me with these, what they did was, is they presented me with these write ups that were never signed by me, that I've never seen in my life. They tried to say things like I was using my phone and I asked for proof, and then he started screaming and saying, bitch, I don't need to give you any proof if you don't like it. Yeah. And he's like, you don't like it, there's

Scott Benner 54:40
the door so and things and bitch. Yeah,

Cheyenne 54:43
yeah. And this is what I was like, looking around at the camera. I was like, Are you? Are you hitting me right now? Like, and I'm telling HR, like, in these emails on the phone, like, I implore you to listen to the feedback please. Like, I'm sure

Scott Benner 54:57
they were thrilled. I'm sure they were thrilled only after. Give you $10,000 to be perfectly honest, like that's, yeah,

Cheyenne 55:03
I don't know, because neither they did not know who I these people that I had talked to, they didn't know who I was. They didn't know anything about it. Yeah, they didn't know who

Scott Benner 55:12
they were. That whole locations being run poorly, top to bottom, basically, yeah, it's

Cheyenne 55:16
done. Now. It's gone. Yeah, I want

Scott Benner 55:20
to say this, if you can't make money selling weed, you're an idiot. Yeah, Jesus Christ. It's

Cheyenne 55:28
a whole, it is. It's the whole market is absolutely just bonkers without pre state. But my God, Missouri and here in Illinois, man, they just No. I mean, they're ruining it.

Scott Benner 55:39
Well, that would, that would be like, going out of business selling lemonade in the desert, I don't know. Like, what are you doing? Oh, my God, that's crazy. I appreciate you coming on and sharing all this with me. It really is absolutely, really something else,

Cheyenne 55:58
absolutely insane, but it can be done basically just, it's not illegal for someone to treat you like, unfortunately, but what it is illegal is for them to discriminate based on the fact that it's diabetes like and there are jobs out there, there are jobs out there that will appreciate you, there are jobs out there that will work around your diabetes. You know, it's, it is out there, it's it is. Mean,

Scott Benner 56:27
listen, you might get discriminated against, but I'm going to assume most people are going to be smart enough not to tell you they're doing it.

Cheyenne 56:33
Yeah, absolutely. They, really, man, they, they, they said this like through email, through text message. It could not have been handled any worse than it was.

Scott Benner 56:44
They wrote it down for you, too. I don't think, listen, forget work for a second. I don't get when people, like, write anything down that's like, sketchy. Like, what are you doing? Like, yeah, so everybody gets caught. Like, do not watch the news. Like, don't text that to somebody fascinating. I

Cheyenne 57:00
couldn't believe it, yeah, just wow. I could not believe it. It was insane.

Scott Benner 57:04
How do you feel? Like, how far removed Are you from this? How long ago was it? Let's

Cheyenne 57:08
see, I think it officially closed itself out of like, a year ago. So I've been with this company for, let's see, about a year and a month now,

Scott Benner 57:17
okay, but it's almost two years since this guy yelled at you in a room, yeah, yeah, for sure. Do you think about it ever, or is it? Is it something you're past? Um,

Cheyenne 57:25
I'm definitely past it. Sometimes I think about the fact that the man that yelled at me is also a retired police officer. So I I think about that sometimes, and I'm like, huh, yeah. Then I remember, you know what, that man is miserable, and I'm not. I got a better job than both of them, and good for you. I make probably more money than both of them, and I'm gonna do better than both of them. So they're

Scott Benner 57:50
definitely not gonna have success treating people the way they treated you. That's for sure. Yeah, that's that's not

Cheyenne 57:55
gonna work, yeah? And, wow, I don't care. Like, like, no, type of diabetes is easy, but to sit there and compare like the way that they did consistently was so, so wrong, so wrong. No, I

Scott Benner 58:09
mean, they thought they knew something, by the way, that's where most people go wrong. They, you know, they thought, thought he knew something, and he was smarter than you, and you were just dumb and didn't understand or willfully making problems or whatever. That's just such a small way of of considering things like maybe just not a bright person, not able to take in all the all the factors and really weigh them properly, and just went with the first gut reaction that he had. My, you know, my wife's got this. You're not eating, right? Okay. Well, thanks, thanks, Doctor. Yeah, great, yeah. He

Cheyenne 58:46
was like, at one point, he's like, just take your Metformin. And I was like, sir, I took Metformin for four days and still ended up in the ICU. It was like, spitting at a tornado. Yeah, it did nothing.

Scott Benner 58:56
That's not really for type one diabetes. I have a different type. I don't know if you can hear one and two and how they sound different, exactly.

Cheyenne 59:03
Yeah, it's just that area, the area the city, in this area of low IQ, is absolutely, I

Scott Benner 59:12
was gonna say, dumbfounding. What you're really doing is you're telling me a story of an interaction you had with a stupid person. Yes,

Cheyenne 59:19
that is, I don't know how to say this, but they were all idiots.

Scott Benner 59:23
Well, that's a pretty clear way to say it.

Cheyenne 59:26
Yeah, that's, that's, that'll pretty much cover it. Yeah, it was a bunch of idiots. And I made out, okay, yeah.

Scott Benner 59:32
By the way, Missouri, New York, I don't care where they're idiots, everywhere,

Cheyenne 59:36
absolutely. But the highest concentration is right here, from the corn, you

Scott Benner 59:41
think the corn promise shine? Are you to tell me that corn makes you stupid? Is that what this is,

Cheyenne 59:47
you know? What? I don't know. I don't want to say causation here, but there might be a correlation, okay, a correlate. You, if you you know,

Scott Benner 59:57
I won't give you the whole story, because I just like. I just, I just blurted it out in an episode the other day. But I went to get tires. I had to order tires for my car, right? And they gave me a time to come get them fixed. Then I got there and they pull my car and take off the jack the car up, take off the wheel, pull the tire off the wheel, then go in the back to see if the tires had arrived. And then they come back out and go, Hey, your tires aren't here. And all I could think was, why wouldn't you look for them first? I don't understand, like, such an odd thing to do, like you wouldn't go look to see if you have the tire before you go through all of this. And he actually says, this happens a lot, so it happens a lot, and you still didn't go look, and I'm just, like, I just sitting there thinking, like, how could you have such a misunderstanding of your job? Like, that's really what struck me. Like, you know what I mean? Like, yeah,

Cheyenne 1:00:51
that's accurate. Yeah. It just and it constantly.

Scott Benner 1:00:55
Can I tell you a story I don't think I've told here, because it absolutely doesn't, it doesn't look good for me. And then we'll start. I'm just gonna absolutely, I lost my goddamn mind in the post office recently. So, oh, I

Cheyenne 1:01:09
love this. Okay, thank

Scott Benner 1:01:10
you so super simple. But I ordered silk worms for my chameleon, and yeah, by mistake, they were held at the post office. Like, I just wanted them to come to my house, but there was a hold put on the delivery. And so it gets held at the post office where you go pick them up. So I'm out that day, like doing stuff, and my wife says, Hey, we just got a phone call from the post office. There's a package there for you. It's marked live animals. I think this is probably your silkworms. You should go get them. And I was like, Okay, great. So I swing through the post office, and I go up to the counter and I say, Hey, how are you? I'm here to pick up a package. I got a phone call that said it was here. And the guy looks at me and goes, we don't call people. And I went, I mean, I don't know what to tell you, I have a phone call from this post office that I have a package to be picked up. And he goes, we can barely get the lights on in this place. You think we're calling people to let them know the package is here. And I said, Sarah, I don't know. All I can tell you is that I received a phone call that I have just here. Here's my name, like, this is my address, like, this whole thing, and he's mumbling to himself and mad and like Bob back and forth, and like, you know, and now I'm showing him the the email with the the fcking, like tracking number. Just type the goddamn tracking number in here and go get the box, you know what I mean. But I'm being nice, and I'm like, a cordial and like, I'm joking with him, like, you know, I don't I'm not looking to fix the world. I just want my box. I got to keep going, right? So he types it all in blah, blah, blah. And he goes, it ain't here. And I'm like, well,

Cheyenne 1:02:51
oh my god,

Scott Benner 1:02:53
where, where is it? He goes, it's across the street at the distribution center. I said, Am I supposed to go there for it? Like, thinking, like, maybe I went to the wrong place, right? And he goes, No, you people aren't allowed in there. And I went, Okay. I'm like, but you guys called my house like, an hour ago and said it was here, like, specifically here? No, we didn't. And I'm like, No man. I'm like, definitely did, you know? And now I'm like, Well, I didn't take the phone call my wife did. Like, maybe she's wrong. Like, you know what I mean? So like, it's like, I'm standing there with him and, like, it's get very contentious, and I don't understand what's happening. And I'm like, what what I said, I appreciate it very much. I said, what's gonna happen? He goes, it'll get delivered to your house tomorrow. And I went, you know what? I'm not in a hurry for them. Like, that's fine. Like, okay. So I walk all the way to the door, which is like, 30 feet from him, and it just hits me. I'm like, my wife's pretty bright. I don't imagine she was confused about who she spoke to and what they said. So I called her on the phone and not loudly, like, off in the corner, like, privately, and I'm like, Hey Kelly. And she's like, Yeah. I'm like, who called this morning? And she goes the post office. And I was like, like, was it this location that I'm at right now? And she goes, Yeah, because I checked, because I'll tell you, there was an anthrax scare at my post office, like 20 years ago, and the place was actually shut down for a year while it was remediated like it was really bad. So my wife said to me, when I was on the phone, when I was on the phone with them, I said, Hey, is this the anthrax post office? I want to make sure I send them to the right place. And the person said, Yes, you have the right location. So we're really sure about what location it is, right by the way, somebody was trying to sell it, send to anthrax, to like, a sender, or something like that. And it got stopped at my post office. And like, anyways, it was a big news story decades ago, not the point. The point is, my wife was fcking sure what goddamn post office it was. And I was like, and I was like, and what did you say? What did they say to you? They said, there's a box here, and it's marked live animals, and it's on hold, and you have to come get it. I'm like, Okay, so anyway, I'm finishing up with her on the phone, and I look up to realize that he's eyeballing me from across the room. And as I hang up. The phone, he yells across the room, what you don't believe me. And I all my brain did was, I'm like, what is happening? What is happening. So finally he yelled at me, and there were people in there. There were like, four people in line, and three other people working. And I go, Hey, Bob, fuck you. I said, I said, I believed you. I was checking with my wife, and, by the way, she says, You're wrong. And and I was like, so I'm gonna ask this guy to check on it. And so I start looking at the the other guy, who's like, this tall, young guy, and he's looking at me like, he's looking at me like, what's happening? And I'm like, I don't know, man, I said, but you just found the 25 year old me, and he ain't having this so, like, I started talking. So I just started explaining it to him. I'm like, Hey, man, listen, I don't know what's going on over there with this guy, but here's what happened. Could you just check on and now the guy starts yelling at me, the original guy, oh my God. He is yelling across the post office at me, which brings the manager out from the back, and she goes, What's going on here? And he actually says, I'm telling you, he's a grown man. He goes, That guy doesn't believe me, and I don't know how he was raised or what happened to him, and I don't care. And I just went over, and she goes, What's the problem here? And I said, my best assessment assessment is, Bob's a fcking idiot. And then, like, now I'm speaking at the top of my voice, and like, and she's like, whoa, what? So I went over it again. I said, I don't know why I came in here, and right away he's arguing with me. I said, Hey, you guys called me. And he's immediately shoots back at me, we don't call people. And he starts randomly talking about how inept the post office is, and why they even like, and I'm like, I don't, I don't want to be involved in all this. Like, I'm like, so, like, it's going back and forth. Well, he now he's in full blown, like, he's just attacking me now. And instead of backing down, I just keep going back at him, and I cursed at him, and he goes nice language. And I went, Okay, Bob, well, go yourself. And he goes, you. And I went way to stick to your rule about bad language, Bob, you gave that up pretty quickly. And he goes, You're an asshole. And I said, Bob, I gotta tell you something. I might be an asshole, but I'm 100% sure you're a fcking idiot.

Speaker 3 1:07:20
So exactly like, oh my god, man. And then

Scott Benner 1:07:24
I turned to these lovely people in line, and I go, I'm so sorry. I was like, I don't know what's happening. And this is not how I would normally do this. I was like, I really apologize. You guys must be scared out of your minds right now. I'm like, I really am so sorry. And then the manager, like, grabs me and Bob. She finally shoes Bob into the background, and she goes, What can we do to make this better? And I said, if I was you, I'd fire Bob. But beyond that, I don't have any opinion. Okay? I said, he, at least shouldn't be allowed to talk to people and like, you know, and she, and she's looking at me, and I'm like, I recognize I didn't handle this well, I said, but when he I have to be honest with you, when he attacked me, I forgot everything I had learned in the last two decades of being an adult, and I went right back to being in my mid 20s. And I was like, fuck me, fuck you, and like, and that was just kind of where it went after that. And I just, I escalated it. Then I walked out with a box of goddamn worms.

Cheyenne 1:08:25
Things you went through for those worms, though

Scott Benner 1:08:28
ridiculous, but here, in the end, I'm going to tell you something I and I'm sorry if I sound coarse. I was dealing with a stupid person. Yeah, no,

Cheyenne 1:08:37
I get it. That's what happened

Scott Benner 1:08:38
to me. Listen, I'm not proud of that story. I'm telling it to you because I hope you find it a little amusing, but I'm embarrassed, like, genuinely, like, I could have just gone to the next and asked again, and when he yelled at me, I could have continued to ignore him and I, and I should have, I shouldn't, probably have done that. That's what I should have done. But I had just, it had been a long string of things that happened that a friend of mine once recently said to me, I'm starting to think I'm being tested by the universe. And I was like, and she's like, What do you mean? She goes all this dumb stuff keeps happening. And I feel like I'm being told to smile through it and to like, accept it as like, this is just how it is. And I feel like that happened to you, Cheyenne, like, I feel like you were just involved with a dumb person who, you know, treated you poorly, didn't know what they were doing, and the entire time, thought they were right. I can't tell you how much the guy at the post office believed he was

Cheyenne 1:09:33
right. Yeah, I get that. Yeah, definitely get it here.

Scott Benner 1:09:37
I'm gonna give you one more. The other day, I put out my recycling, and then the truck goes by, and I go out to get the cans, but they only took, like, part of the recycling. And I'm like, what is happening? So I went inside, I called the township I live in. I said, Hey, I don't know what happened, but like, half my recycling was picked up and half of it wasn't. And the woman says, What color? Her cans. Were they in? Was it in? And I went, I go, I don't know. And she's like, we only pick up stuff in green cans. And I went, since when? And she goes, it's a new rule. And I said, Well, how would I know about the new rule? And I swear to God, she said, we put it on our Facebook page and our website. And I said, You think I go to the Facebook page and website for the recycling department of my community? And I was like, I don't do that. I said, Did you send a letter? No. Did you call us? No, so you just hoped I would see your Facebook post about it. And I was insane, insane. I'm like, I'm like, Are you gonna come get it? And she goes, No. And I said, But you only collect the recycling every two weeks. What am I supposed to do with my recycling? And do you want to know what she said? Cheyenne, I'm gonna give you a couple of guesses. Go ahead.

Cheyenne 1:10:51
Oh my god, she probably, she probably wanted to know. Let's see what color, what shape, no. What supposed

Scott Benner 1:10:59
to do with it now that they wouldn't come get it for two more weeks, and I don't have any place to put it. They

Unknown Speaker 1:11:04
told you to throw it away. They

Scott Benner 1:11:06
told me to throw it away.

Cheyenne 1:11:07
Yeah? Like I told you, yeah. You know why? Because it all ends up in the same place. Anyway, I've seen it happen. I have literally seen it happen. I've seen it physically happen. And I have watched the recycling truck go into the landfill and dump it. And I'm like, wait a minute. What are we doing? Why are we doing this? If

Speaker 2 1:11:24
you have nowhere to store it, you can throw it away. I said, well, then what's the goddamn point of any of this? Yes. So she says, Well, you can get two free cans from us. I'm like, I have two of your green cans. I have to get two more. And she goes, yeah. I said, But you only pick it up every two weeks. There'll be times where that's not enough. I'm like, how much of my property should be littered with green can? And I was like, I have one can that it all fits in. Why can't I just put it in that? And she said, the thing

Cheyenne 1:11:50
is, you have to have two cans for them to pick up. One cans full. And then that's, that's how it goes. You need four cans for them to pick up, two cans worth of well,

Speaker 2 1:11:58
I asked her, I'm like, what? What's the big rule change? Because, by the way, I've been putting my recycling out in regular cans like for ever, and she says some of the people are getting injured picking up the trash cans. And I said, you've hired people to pick up recycling who are not strong enough to pick up recycling, and now I can't use a can unless it's green. I was like, may I suggest not solving a problem by making a bigger problem?

Cheyenne 1:12:27
Oh my gosh.

Scott Benner 1:12:28
I said, What if you just hired people that are like, sturdier? Would that not fix it? And she's like, well, we we don't even pick up our own recycling anymore. Now we're like, we're contracting it to someone. I'm like, Oh my God, you're paying someone to pick up your recycling, and they're not doing it for you, and they told you that you have to go back to us, our residents make our lives harder so that you can pay them to pick it up. I was like, you don't feel like you're being taken advantage of a little bit.

Cheyenne 1:12:59
This is it. This is all a conspiracy by big trash to throw away more trash. They're just like, here, you throw this away. No, you throw this away. No, you throw this away.

Scott Benner 1:13:08
Very nice to her. First of all, I said, I said to her, I'm like, I know this is not you. You're not the decision maker in this situation. I was like, but I would like it if you'd pass on to somebody two things. A, I don't appreciate having to have 1000 little cans all over my property. I was like, B, for what I pay in property taxes, maybe you could come get the goddamn stuff more frequently than every 14 days. And C, hire stronger people to pick up the recycling. I think that's your fix. Like, not like. So basically, someone said, this hurts my back, and they change the way the entire thing's done.

Cheyenne 1:13:41
And I was like, Oh, sure, that simple for everything

Speaker 2 1:13:45
else, but, but my point is, is that the post office, the tires and the recycling have all happened in the last three weeks. I get that. And I'm like, I get that. So my friend who said to me, like, I think everyone's trying to make me crazy, I might be agreeing at this point, like, like, every time I leave my house, I'm bombarded with the dumbest thing handled in the worst way, and I'm supposed to just go, Okay, thanks.

Cheyenne 1:14:12
I have a theory that I was probably either Mussolini or Hitler with past life getting paid based on what has happened to me, and everyone around me who is around me for more than 10 minutes at a time will agree. Like, my first day of work at this new company, I got stuck in an elevator,

Scott Benner 1:14:33
elevator. That's so funny. Stuck

Cheyenne 1:14:36
in the elevator. Who does that happen to oh, I don't know me like I just you have diabetes. Oh, by the way, you're also stuck in an elevator. Hope you don't have to pee.

Scott Benner 1:14:48
Well, there's, I don't have all the details, so I can't really go into it, but I don't know if you've seen recently that Boeing has like sounded the alarm, that they think their Dreamliner 787, may come across in flight a. Part in flight because of structural flaws. And, you know, that

Cheyenne 1:15:03
doesn't surprise me. I my first boyfriend was an aircraft mechanic, and he would tell me, and this was like, 15 years ago, and I remember going into the hangars with him and the like, this was a frequent topic of discussion that, like, stuff was held together by like, duct tape. And like, it was just a constant topic of discussion that the planes were not put together.

Scott Benner 1:15:25
Well, this is the New York Times yesterday. FAA investigates claims by Boeing whistleblower about flaws in 787, Dreamliner, the whistleblower and engineer says that sections of the plane's body are being assembled in a way that could weaken the aircraft over time. Yeah, Boeing says there's no safety issue, okay? But then other people are coming out and saying that, in general, engineers are not nearly as well trained as they were a generation ago, and like so it's like, it's the whistleblowing is like tumbling. And my point is, I don't know if that's true or not, but I believe it, because it's impossible to hire a guy who changes tires, who knows to look for the tires before you take the tire off the car. So if rolls downhill, then I believe maybe that the engineers don't know what they're doing with the planes. And I'm scared now, is what I'm saying. Yes,

Cheyenne 1:16:15
you know, I have stopped flying for multiple reasons, but that is definitely one. Oh, and then the last time we flew as a family of my younger sister, her eardrum bursted on the plate again, literally, like I just I keep going.

Scott Benner 1:16:33
I think my bigger point is, is that I believe that someone should be able to competently manage a cannabis distribution set area without treating a person the way you were treated. Yeah, absolutely like that should be possible. And if we can't find people to do these small things, I think we have to reevaluate something, and I don't know what that something is, but I've now basically laid out you've laid out one thing. I've laid out three more. These things should not be difficult. No,

Cheyenne 1:17:02
definitely not. Yeah, should not be a difficult thing. And right? It was not only a difficult but a long, ridiculous process. But it did end Well, glad I got what I got. I mostly, actually, I'm I'm lucky, and I still have, like, a good 3k left over,

Scott Benner 1:17:18
and good, I'm glad, and you got a nice job that you're happy

Cheyenne 1:17:21
I'm doing pretty well. Yeah, I got a great job. Ended up with a lot more tattoos than I should. Ended up with a lot more things. So it's

Scott Benner 1:17:29
like, free time, weed and money and I got tattoos. Yeah, exactly. All right, you were terrific. I appreciate you sharing this with me. Hold on one second for me. You a huge thanks to a long time sponsor touched by type one. Please check them out on Facebook, Instagram and at touched by type one.org. If you're looking to support an organization that's supporting people with type one diabetes, check out touched by type one, you can use the same continuous glucose monitor that Arden uses. All you have to do is go to dexcom.com/juicebox, and get started today. That's right, the Dexcom g7 is sponsoring this episode of The juicebox podcast. Jalen is an incredible example of what so many experience living with diabetes. You show up for yourself and others every day, never letting diabetes define you, and that is what the Medtronic champion community is all about. Each of us is strong, and together, we're even stronger. To hear more stories from the Medtronic champion community or to share your own story, visit Medtronic diabetes.com/juicebox. And look out online for the hashtag Medtronic champion. If you're not already subscribed or following in your favorite audio app, please take the time now to do that. It really helps the show and get those automatic downloads set up so you never miss an episode. Thank you so much for listening. I'll be back very soon with another episode of The juicebox podcast. The episode you just heard was professionally edited by wrong way recording, wrongway recording.com, you.


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#1307 Five Giant Firemen

Scott Benner

Mark has had type 1 for over 20 years and he is an educator.

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DISCLAIMER: This text is the output of AI based transcribing from an audio recording. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors and should not be treated as an authoritative record. Nothing that you read here constitutes advice medical or otherwise. Always consult with a healthcare professional before making changes to a healthcare plan.

Scott Benner 0:00
Hello friends, and welcome back to another episode of The juicebox podcast.

So Mark has type one diabetes. He's got a couple little kids, and he's an educator. My note here says that at some point, Mark just went off about the education system, and I went with him. So apparently that's about to happen. Nothing you hear on the juicebox podcast should be considered advice medical or otherwise, always consult a physician before making any changes to your healthcare plan. Hey, listen, if you have type one diabetes, or are the caregiver of someone with type one and you're a US resident, I would appreciate it if you went to T 1d exchange.org/juice, box and completed the survey, that's it. You're going to help. It's going to be easy. T 1d exchange.org/juice, box. You can help type one diabetes research to move forward right from your house. Don't forget to save 40% off of your entire order at cozy earth.com All you have to do is use the offer code juicebox at checkout. That's juicebox at checkout to save 40 percent@cozyearth.com when you place your first order for ag one, with my link, you'll get five free travel packs and a free year supply of vitamin D drink, AG, one.com/juice box.

The episode you're listening to is sponsored by us Med, usmed.com/juice, box. Or call 888-721-1514, you can get your diabetes testing supplies the same way we do from us med. This episode of The juicebox podcast is sponsored by the Eversense CGM, an implantable six month sensor. Is what you get with Eversense, but you get so much more exceptional and consistent accuracy over six months and distinct on body vibe alerts when you're high or low on body vibe alerts. You don't even know what that means. Do you ever sense cgm.com/juicebox? Go find out. This show is sponsored today by the glucagon that my daughter carries, gvoke hypopen. Find out more at gvoke glucagon.com, forward slash juice box.

Mark 2:26
My name is Mark Picardo. I have been a type one diabetic since October 30, 2003 so that is over 20 years now. And beyond that, I am 33 years old. I have a small family, my wife and my my two children. I am an educator. You know, I'm really, I'm really excited to be here. And one, you know, something I'm passionate about is just bringing my experience and awareness with type one diabetes and being able to share that with the community around me and be able to help, you know, especially kids in my schools who are diabetic, looking for somebody who could be a mentor and just a shoulder to lean on.

Scott Benner 3:03
I'm going to pick through all this with you. Tell me how old your kids are.

Mark 3:07
My son, Angelo, and I don't mind sharing their names, he is four. He'll be five in June. Nice. And then my daughter, Alessia, just turned two in February. Wow.

Scott Benner 3:16
Oh, good for you. Congratulations. Have you not been married long? Or did you just get started with the kids? We

Mark 3:20
got married in 2016 so and we, my wife and I have been together for

Scott Benner 3:27
not a good look. Mark, if you can't come up with a quick 1414, years, very nice 14 years. Been married about eight he got two nice little kids. Okay, any other autoimmune in your family or with you. There is

Mark 3:41
no history of diabetes in my family. There's no history of autoimmune disorders in my family. Is it is just me. I am the special one, and

Scott Benner 3:49
just type one for you. Just type one. Okay. Well, I appreciate you coming on and spending the time with me very much. I feel like when I saw you for a little bit this morning, it looks like you're actually at a school right now. So I am

Mark 4:02
in, so I am in a classroom. I with my door shut, locked in, a sign on the door that says, zoom, meeting, but, but, yes, I am at a school. One of the good things about my position is having having some of that flexibility to be doing some other things, very nice, along with, yeah, yeah.

Scott Benner 4:19
Excellent. Okay, so let's see, how did you how did you find me? I'm going to start there today.

Mark 4:27
So I guess that would be a good opportunity for me to just talk a little bit. So during during covid, 20, what are your 2020? Feels like it was, yeah, yeah. It feels like it was forever ago. I wanted to start an Instagram account for myself that just focused on diabetes. I ended up creating a brand called type one wellness. And through my Instagram and through the social media i i was able to just honestly stumble upon a community that was much larger and much bigger than anything that I had imagined. And a lot of. Of the people that I had been speaking to and networking with and learning from, you know, so many people reference the juicebox podcast as a place where they learn quite a bit from and really appreciate the awareness that you're bringing. And in addition to that, you know, it's, it's, obviously, it's, it's good entertainment as well, because it's something that you can relate with. I appreciate that. And then last year at my at my old school up in New York, I had a teacher who has a son with type one, and she was on your show, I want to say at least once, maybe, maybe a couple times she had, she had mentioned to me, Hey, you should just reach out. Because one thing she one thing she brought up was that there's not very many men who who talk about, you know, what it's like to be a father, to be a male, to be a man with diabetes, and what that's like. And she thought there would be some value. Yeah,

Scott Benner 5:54
I appreciate. Tell her thank you. And I She's not wrong. It's a little more difficult to get men, and even then, when you get them, it's sometimes difficult for them to emote and like really connect while they're talking, so sometimes they feel a little stiffer while they're sharing. But, yeah, but it's, it's, it's definitely something I want to do more of. So would you say that you went to Instagram to learn something for yourself, or did you feel like you had something to share?

Mark 6:22
I think a little bit of both. I would say my initial purpose was, hey, you know, this is what I do. This is my management. Maybe I can share. And I think a little bit selfishly too, I said, Hey, maybe I could turn this into something that might be a another career path. What I didn't realize was that within even just a couple of months of creating my account and then just following, you know, a lot of people within the community, how much I would learn and how much it would impact my my personal management and the way that I approach diabetes, and since then, I've pivoted, and I use it purely Just for awareness and to share my story, and really honestly, again, selfishly, to learn from others. I come from a really supportive family, and so being diagnosed at 13 years old, it was necessary to have parents that were supportive, and my management has always been fairly Okay, fairly good. I would say, within the last two, three years, it has gotten to another level, something that I'm really proud of. My family and I, we moved from New York to North Carolina last July, and so I went in and saw the end though for the first time in February, and my first A, 1c since the move was 5.70 good for you. And I didn't, and I'm like, wow, with with the amount of stress and the amount of anxiety and this and that, with the move, and just to be able to still keep that management, and that's not me tooting my own horn. That's just it's something that I'm proud of.

Scott Benner 7:52
Is it fair to say that you think that in the past, in that scenario, you would have seen a rise near a one say, if you take insulin or sulfonylureas, you are at risk for your blood sugar going too low. You need a safety net when it matters most, be ready with G Vogue hypopen. My daughter carries gevok hypopen everywhere she goes, because it's a ready to use rescue pen for treating very low blood sugar in people with diabetes ages two and above that, I trust low blood sugar emergencies can happen unexpectedly and they demand quick action. Luckily, jivo kypopen can be administered in two simple steps, even by yourself in certain situations. Show those around you where you store GEVO kypo pen and how to use it. They need to know how to use GVO kypopen before an emergency situation happens. Learn more about why GEVO kypo Pen is in Arden's diabetes toolkit at gvoke, glucagon.com/juicebox, gvoke shouldn't be used if you have a tumor in the gland on the top of your kidneys called a pheochromocytoma, or if you have a tumor in your pancreas called an insulinoma, visit gvoke, glucagon.com/risk. For safety information.

Mark 9:12
I 100% Yeah. I mean just every, everything that so the the lift. I don't know if you've ever Scott, you know, moved, moved moved across states or this, but finding a house, finding a job, finding an area that you want to be happy in, moving your family, driving cross country with two little kids, it's beyond anything that I would ever imagine, that it's something I never want to do again when you add in the complications of diabetes, yeah, I would never have predicted that I would have been able to keep my management as strong as it has been.

Scott Benner 9:48
So what would you say, hearing from, hearing from you're not hearing from them, right? They have Instagram accounts. You have Instagram accounts, so you're seeing their life, what they're sharing, of it reflected back and forth. Of you, maybe you read a little blurb or something that they've written, and are you actually interacting? Are you commenting on people's things? Are you having personal relationships, or is it just the the act of receiving what they're putting out? I have

Mark 10:14
established some really great relationships with people that I've never met in person, strictly through the diabetes community. I have relationships with someone in Australia. I had a relationship with somebody in Dubai, people that I would consider pretty close friends, that you know, we talk, we talk on a consistent basis, and not just about diabetes, just you know, about our lives. And I think that's something that's a really great part of the community. And in a sense, social media, you know, all the negativity that comes with social media, it can be hard, but I think there, there, if you approach it the right way, there, there are some positives. And, you know, for me and some of these people, it's okay. Do you have a common ground? Do you have something that you can share, you could be vulnerable with each other? And it's much easier to break down those barriers and create relationships based on something that that is meaningful. And, you know, there's also, there's all. There's always going to be some people that you're that you're following and talking to, that it's just, you know, you're commenting or watching or this or that. But I was, but where

Scott Benner 11:15
does the value come from that actually impacts your A, 1c, so,

Mark 11:20
so for me, you know, and this is not in any way, shape or form, trying to downplay the significance and role of what my doctors have provided me and what doctors continue to provide with other people with this condition, but I have learned it's those little, intricate things that people share Just from their experience that I was never told in a in a doctor's office something as simple as a pre bolus. And that might sound crazy to you, because I know you talk about it quite often, up until I started my like, nobody ever told me, Hey, you should pre bolus for meals. Mark

Scott Benner 11:55
and I said, Have you ever heard, have you ever heard Erica on the podcast, like in some of the more like mental health stuff. She's a therapist. I

Mark 12:02
have, you know, I've listened to quite so it's hard to keep them, No, I

Scott Benner 12:07
know. Listen, that's, that's my fault. I make a lot of stuff. But Erica is like, Erica's had type one diabetes for, I think, like, 35 years. She's on a recent episode where she said, I think I heard about pre bolusing from descott, and she she grew up for, I mean, three decades, and had a brother with type one on top of that, has a brother with type one, and she's still, like, saying, like, I think I heard about on the podcast. I mean, it's hard to call even pre bolusing a building block of managing yourself. It's, it's a fundamental, it's like putting gas in your car. Like, we don't think about that as being part of the process to drive. You have to do that part. And it's fascinating that that the timing of the insulin is not spoken about between doctors and patients very frequently.

Mark 12:51
It floors me thinking about some of the times of the way that I personally manage. And then, I mean, to be completely honest, like sometimes, you know you go into the Enter college's Office, and you have to tell them what they want to hear, and then you know you're going to walk away whatever, whatever it is that you talked about, it's not it's not even what you're doing. Because so for me, for example, I was at a pump within six months of being diagnosed, and I was on a insulin pump from 2003 just until 2017 I wouldn't say I had. I had an incident in December of 2017 where I was unresponsive in the morning, my wife woke up and was not able to to wake me up. I think my blood sugar was like a 13. I finally came to I had five gigantic firemen in my bed, and I was fighting, fighting out of them, but, and that was the one and only time I've ever had, I had a complication that's severe, but I I had so I ended up switching to MDI shortly after that, and then I also switched over to the Dexcom shortly after that. And I tell you what, I will never go back on a pump. And, you know, maybe that's a too concrete of a statement to make, but for me, this is just what works. And I think, you know, I talked about the finite details that I've learned through social media in the community, but I think the biggest message that I've taken away. And this is something too that I try to share as well, is that everybody has to figure out what works for them. And I wish there was a little bit more of that mindset at a doctor's office and with the endocrinologist. And I'm actually really, really lucky, because I do feel as though my current one down here in North Carolina does support that idea of, hey, if this is working, you know, don't break it, or don't, don't fix it, yeah. But, you know, I would go to my old end though, and I was at MTI, and, you know, my, my ANC was maybe low six. And every time I go, it's, Hey, I really think you should try this pump. Hey, I really think you should try this pump. Actually, probably a year and a half ago, I did, I tried an OmniPod, and I tried the T slim. And for some people up. Sure they're absolutely phenomenal. And I think, you know, in a in theory and in a perfect vacuum, the idea of the closed system and the closed like is wonderful, but for me, it just it didn't work. And my my management was worse again, and I ended up, after about six months, going back to shots. And okay, you know, not everybody

Scott Benner 15:20
your MDI right now with the CGM

Mark 15:22
I use the Dexcom g7 and then I use FiOS for my short acting. I use tracebo for my log acting.

Scott Benner 15:29
Nice. Well, that's great, Mark. I'm going to need you to say something very, very interesting in the next 45 minutes. It stops me from calling your podcast episode five giant firemen. So

Mark 15:42
that's absolutely fine,

Scott Benner 15:45
because right now that's far and away my winner. It's the way you said it, like I woke up with five giant firemen in my bed, and I was like, that's hilarious, absolutely terrified,

Mark 15:54
like, like, and I mean, and I'm not, I'm not a really big guy, but I had at least three or four of them had to keep me down because I was fighting like no other.

Scott Benner 16:05
Did you flip out because you opened your eyes to five people or because your blood sugar was still where it was so,

Mark 16:12
so my blood sugar was my brother. Trigger was, whatever 13 I thought I was, I was sleeping. I thought I was dreaming. And like I recall, I recall, in that moment, trying, like, I wanted to wake up. I wanted to wake up. So they were trying to get the IV in me to administer some sort of, some sort of glucose, and I was fighting with that. And, I mean, I think it might have been just, you know, part of that reaction, that fear. And, you know, it's

Scott Benner 16:42
weird when your blood sugar's low and a dream state and that, listen, I fell asleep with my headphones in last night, and for two hours I thought I was Billy Joel. Billy Joel playlist on. It was like in my dream, I was just singing Billy Joel songs. And when I woke up, I thought, I wonder if I was singing in my sleep, but Kelly was asleep, so I couldn't ask her, that's, that's hilarious. How long did you try pumping for? And how long have you been off it?

Mark 17:06
So my first experience with pumping was with various Medtronic systems, and that was for almost 15 years. And in a lot of ways, again, a lot of ways, it was, it was good, but my, my biggest problem was, in my opinion, even though I've been told I'm wrong, was my scar tissue in sites I had towards the Scott towards the end of my use of Medtronic. There was days where I was using 678, different site changes because, you know, I I insert a site, and you know, my number would be, I don't know, say, 102 hours later, I'm at 350 and I'm bolusing and I'm stacking and I'm bolusing and I'm rage bolusing, and it's just not coming down. And I think absorption was your issue. Absorption was 100% my issue. And you know, I would go to the doctor. And I would, you know, I beg. I say, what like something is, is wrong? What do I need? So we tried different types of silhouettes. We tried, you know, and I was always fairly good about rotating my sites. Again. I'm not a big guy, you know, I I'm an I work out. I'm athletic, so it's not exactly like I have an endless amount of of areas to try, but I did the best I could. I tried as hard as I could, and it just it was so unsuccessful and so frustrating. And you know, I would drive like, I would literally drive around my car with my car, and I would have multiple boxes, not just like individual sites, boxes of sites. Because at any point I knew that there could be a failure thinking about, like packing to go on vacation, I would probably pack, like, a six month supply, because of sometimes, how often I would have to change, and how how frustrated it was. Oh,

Scott Benner 18:58
my God. And you did fight through that for a decade and a half, you try. So,

Mark 19:02
I mean, for the first decade, it was probably, you know, great, you know, be brand new. But then I would say the last four or five years on it, it was tough, and then it was progressively worse towards the end, okay, by the end, it was like, this is not even it's, this isn't functional. And, I mean, ever since switching to shots, it's just been, it's like a brother. It's like a breath of fresh air. That's great. I'm glad you found what works. Yeah. And, and I tried, you know, because I've always been open minded, and I did try the OmniPod and T slim, and it was the same thing. It was, it was the absorption again, was just, it just didn't work for me. Have you considered

Scott Benner 19:40
getting an in pen so you can get a little bit of the functionality and the math behind pumping

Mark 19:46
so that's the one that communicates right with your Yeah, with

Scott Benner 19:49
an app, and it's sort of like it helps you with

Mark 19:53
that's a great That's a great thought. I haven't really thought of about that I was presented with the with, I. First I was using the geo or with the refillable cartridges. And then, since I've just been getting the straight the FiOS pens, as they are, yeah,

Scott Benner 20:09
I was gonna say, I also don't know if in pen and fiasp go together or not. But anyway, I mean, it's neither here nor there. That's something for me to definitely Note, though. Yeah, you can look into it, if you like, just to go back so that people can hear it clearly when you were on a pump and it wasn't working for you in the end, this wasn't you ignoring your settings. It wasn't you not bolusing like you were doing all the things that you had been doing prior, and it just kind of stopped working for you as you wore it longer and longer.

Mark 20:37
Yeah, I mean always, to the best of my ability, you know, there's never, there's ever a perfect scenario, but, but yes, with, you know, with, with trying to do all the right things, and rotating sites, bolusing, increasing my basal, you know, talking to my doctors, and it just, I would again, like I would insert a site, and it wasn't like it was bleeding, it wasn't, you know, any of those types of things. You know, the pump was was good, and, you know, I'd be 400 before you knew it. And okay, I'm trying to pull and it's not coming down. And then I would change the site and give myself a correction, and I would see some progress. It starts to come down, but then again, it starts to go up. It's and it's like, What am I, you know, you mean, you can't help but think, what am I doing wrong? What? What is this? You know, what am I not? I'm clearly not doing something right. And I think circle back to, I wish somebody would, would have told me 10 years ago, or, you know, maybe less, but you know, you don't have to use a pump. You could, you could try something different.

Scott Benner 21:40
It felt like an imperative, and you were failing, because how long they hocked you about getting on a pump, correct? Yeah,

Mark 21:46
it felt like this was my only, my only option,

Scott Benner 21:50
right? And you weren't doing a good job at it. And that's correct. Then you have that pressure on top of everything else. Yeah, absolutely, yeah. Hey, listen, just I'm not pushing you, but Humalog, Novolog and fiasp cartridges are accepted by the impen. Okay, I'm definitely gonna look at not a sponsor anymore, but Medtronic. I'm doing some ads right now for the Medtronic community stuff. But in pen, used to be a sponsor. They're they're not anymore. But yeah, I mean, I've just seen a lot of people use it and get something out of it. So definitely look into it. Yeah, when you decide to have kids, do you think about diabetes when you're making that decision, or does it not come to mind? How does that happen?

Mark 22:33
Diabetes factors into every part of your life. That is, that's for sure. But something an approach that I've always taken is that, yes, it's a part of my life and it's a factor, but it's, it's not going to be a deciding factor in anything that I do, if, if anything, I would say the biggest part of the thought process was, okay, my children have a 5% chance of getting diagnosed. And, you know, that's that scares the hell out of me, because I just would never want my children, or really anybody, to have to deal with the everyday struggle that you, that you, I know you as a father. You see that firsthand, and so but, but no, that that never deterred me to anything. Everything that I do is for my children. When I wake up at four in the morning and go work out and, you know, race to get home. And you know, when I try to take care of myself and keep my a 1c under six, that's not immediate. Is for me, but it's for them, because I want to be the best, the best parent and the best father that I can be for them. When I was growing up, it's actually funny. So we were having a conversation with my son yesterday, and we were just kind of joking around because he's going into kindergarten this year, and so, hey, what do you want to be when you grow up? And he goes, I want to be a daddy. And it's funny, because what I had the hardest time figuring out what I wanted to do professionally, and I still, honestly, I still really don't know what I want to do professionally, is for my the next 30 years, but I always knew that I wanted to be a father. Oh, that was always a driving point for me.

Scott Benner 24:07
Yeah, I can tell you, I, from a young age, knew I wanted to have a family, and so

Mark 24:13
it's a special, I mean, it's just, it's a very special thing, and I think that's a lot of the reason why I went to education, too, because, you know, I see, I see these kids, in many ways, as my own, but I just think about parents and the impact that they have on kids, and how meaningful it can be and and when I see that, when I see the flip side, and the parents who choose not to do that, it's hard, it's a hard pill to swallow. And so I enjoy being that person for for some of these kids who who don't

Scott Benner 24:43
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Mark 27:38
Yeah, absolutely, absolutely.

Scott Benner 27:41
If you don't want to answer this, that's fine, but because you've used your name so like clearly, and we've belabored it over and over again. But what? What is it? Is it? Is it apathy, drugs, bad upbringings, intelligence, like, what? When you look across the desk and you see, you see who they are, do you know? Oh, I know how this is going to go already, because of, like, what's your generalization that makes you think it's going to happen, that you're going to be talking to a person who's not that involved or doesn't care so much? That's a loaded question. I know that's why you don't have to answer it if you don't want to. No, it's okay. I

Mark 28:16
don't I don't mind, because I believe in it and I'm transparent about it. I think, to back up a little bit, I think we have a and I don't, you know, I know this isn't necessarily political show, and this is a much bigger topic. We could probably go on for hours about this, but we have an enormous problem with our system. And I always say this is that when you go to a hospital, say, you you know, the absolute worst thing happens to you. You have, you know, a tuber in your brain. Imagine if your brain surgeon was getting paid the salary that a teacher makes,

Scott Benner 28:50
and you'd be upset.

Mark 28:52
You probably, you probably think, think twice, and I just think, how are we valuing education to such a minimal extent. You know, I would say just in my in my building here, you probably predict maybe 50 to 60% of the teachers have have second jobs, Second Incomes, because you can't live off of a teacher wage. And so when you go back to your question, so, what is it? So, I think it's a couple of factors. Number one, I think the my from my personal opinion, the institution of family is crumbling. And I think when you turn on the news and you see, you know, a lot of what we stand for as a country, I think it's really easy to see why. I think that the kids who are most successful are the ones that when they go home, are getting that support. I could be the greatest teacher on Earth, and I could sit here in the classroom and I could, I could speak the I could speak from, from the Lord. And what I'm saying is going into your brain, your alert, but then the minute they get off that bus and walk into that house, everything can be undone within seconds. You know, if you're trying. Into, you know, just is as simple as this. I want to teach my children about or I want to teach my my students about respecting each other. And they go home and Scott, you tell your your kid, you don't need to respect them. We don't like these kinds of people. Well, your word is much more meaningful than anything. And I'm going to say as a

Scott Benner 30:15
teacher. And so how do you think teachers are seen by some people?

Mark 30:18
I think teachers are very, very undervalued. I remember during covid, there was, like this one week where I was at home working out, and I had the TV on, and I saw like this commercial that said, thank you teachers. I said, Oh my God, I've never seen this before. And then, and then the next week, it was, we hate teachers, and they suck, and they're teaching critical race theory, and they're trying to indoctrinate our kids. Oh, I

Scott Benner 30:43
see. So that was quick. Okay, so if a news story blows up, then it's everybody,

Mark 30:50
yeah, I got it, yeah. But it's the same with, I mean, you know, there's always gonna be some bad teachers, but there's always gonna be some bad cops, there's gonna be some bad giant firemen, and there's gonna be some bad podcast like, there's always bad seats and everything that you do, but it you might get a bad average size fireman. Even you might get a bad average size and let me ask a difficult question

Scott Benner 31:10
about the that. So, because that's a pretty common response, you know, you're not paying teachers enough, what do you expect? So does that mean that, because of the salary, it's not attracting the best candidates. Where does 1,000% if

Mark 31:26
you had so it and again, it's multi best and multi layered. But I think about this. I think about it during my experience in administration, how challenging it's been over the past couple of years to try to try to hire. And you know, we have vacancies left and right. We have special ed vacancies. We have classic teacher vacancies. We had at my school last year we couldn't hire a music teacher, so we had to cut music programs. And so I think about this when I'm an 18 year old, graduated high school, and I'm going to go to college, and I'm going to think about what career I want to go into. There's two things that you think about, hey, what interest? Interests you? And am I going to make money? And it's just this is hard to say. But I would not encourage my own children with the current state of things to go in education, because I want them to be successful, and I don't want them to have to deal with the things that I deal with day to day, to still not feel comfortable.

Scott Benner 32:21
Are there other impacts, though, like, Could I be getting a good candidate who is just maybe working a second job or feeling undervalued, and that impacts their performance?

Mark 32:32
Yes, okay, so, so I think there's, there's lots of those things. My take is on this. If you my buddy and I actually just a couple weeks ago, he's another he's an administrator as well. We were having this conversation because he's seen conversation because he's seeing the same things. In theory, say that, say the minimum starting salary for a teacher was 75,000 which is a very good amount of income from my opinion. I think you could live very comfortably off of that. Sure, you would have people lined up out the door to try to, number one, enroll in teacher education programs to try to get jobs. When I first walked into education, you know, there was hundreds of people applying for a specific job. We just hired something, you know, a few weeks, two weeks ago, there was like, three applicants, and we didn't hire any of them, because not one of them was little bit of effective. And there's so many things that would come with that is that, number one, you're to attract more quality people. Number two, you could hold the standards much higher, because if my teachers are making 75,000 and I see Scott, who's teaching first grade, and he's showing up late and he's not following curriculum, and he's not assessing the students, you know XYZ. And I could say, Scott, you know we value and we appreciate you, but I have a line of teachers outside the door who would be happy to take your role, and so you need to live up to those expectations and

Scott Benner 33:52
do the job. I'll replace you. And, yeah, and that's

Mark 33:54
not I mean, and that's, you know, that doesn't that comes off in a very cold

Scott Benner 33:58
No, no way. I don't think it sounds cool. You're misunderstanding how I think, yeah, no, no, yeah, I'm good with it, and not just in teaching. And listen, Mark, no lie. Okay, so this happened to me in the last two days. I needed tires on my car, and I called a couple places. I found a good price, and I asked them, please order the tires. And they said, Oh, absolutely, come in on Thursday at excuse me, Tuesday at 4pm and we will put your tires on. I was like, that's great. So I showed up and parked my car. I went inside. I said, Hi, this is my name. I am here for my 4pm appointment to have tires put on that you ordered for me, and they take my car in, they pull the tire, first tire off, they deflate it, take it off the wheel. And, you know, I'm watching it. It's a very nice day, so I'm kind of outside, like I'm always inside. So I just kind of stood out front the sun. I had a drink, and I was just. You know, enjoying being outside. I wandered back inside to ask a question, because I thought I they weren't able to get me tires for the back just the front. And I was like, I'm going to try to order them online, would you you know, I went in to find out what that would cost to have them put on. And so I walk in there, and now suddenly, the manager and the guy who's working on my car are next to each other behind the counter, and they're talking. As I approach, I get up there, neither of them address me. I look at the one guy and he goes, you know, like I see him take my key, and he heads back to the car, but he doesn't say anything to me. And now I'm standing there because I want to ask my question of the other guy, but he's doing something. And so I very kind of, I take a half a step back. I don't want to pressure him. He's busy, like, you know, he does not acknowledge me. It goes on for three or four minutes where we are four feet apart, and he has not acknowledged me yet. So I say, Hey man, and he looks up. I

Speaker 1 36:00
go, when you have time, I have a question. He goes, Oh, you can ask me anytime. And I'm like, okay, so I asked my question. I end up having two questions. He answers both of them. I don't feel very confident that he understood one of them, but okay. I walk outside, go back in the sun, and my car is backing out of the garage. And I'm like, so I kind of walked towards the guy, and I put my hands up, and I'm like, hey, hey, hey. And he puts the window down, and he goes, What's up? And I said, there's two tires like you, you only did one. And he looks at me like, I have six heads. And he goes, did the guy inside not talk to you. And I said about what. He goes, your tires aren't here. And I'm like, wait, the tires you ordered me that you told me would be here and I should come here on Tuesday at four o'clock they they're not here. And he goes, No, the guy inside didn't tell you. And I went, No. So he talks to me for a couple of seconds, and I just leave. They just leave because I'm going to murder somebody if I stay. And I'm just like, I'm fascinated that neither of them looked at me and went, Hey, man, I can't believe this, but we don't have your tires. But as I'm driving home, I get past that, and all I can think is, you put tires on a car. The first thing you do isn't to check to make sure you have the tires. It's pull the car in, take the wheel off, Jack it up, rip the rubber off the wheel, and then go check to see if you have the new tire. Like that's can't be, right? And you do this all day long. And I thought, oh my god, we're all gonna die. And then, and then you tell me that we're hiring teachers that aren't qualified, but by the way, the parents don't trust the teachers, but maybe they shouldn't in some situations. And so now we're in a perpetual circle. And then I get home yesterday, my wife tells me about a news story about one of the major airline manufacturers who's saying that their new generation of engineers don't seem to know their job as well as the old generation. And I'm like, Oh my God, my car's gonna explode. I'm gonna not learn anything, or a plane's gonna fall out of the sky. What's the through line? It seems like people don't take their jobs very seriously.

Mark 38:23
I think part of that is accurate. I think the other part too is it's just that we live in this state right now where it's a opinion is more important now than fact. And again, that's a that's a but we just, we live in this, in this, in this situation where all of our values and all of our moral like, everything is just upside down, people, it's, you know? So when I was in college for my undergraduate, I was a sociology major, and I did a lot of work about the difference between a collectivist culture, which means people who live for each other, not necessarily socialism, but like people who you know, like a family, for example, is an example of a collectivist culture versus an individualistic society, where everything is competition and everybody is going up against each other. And when you look at the difference between, for example. A very strong example is the America versus Europe. When you go into European culture, it's, it is a collectivist culture. People bring each other up, people, it's not necessarily competition. It's it's, how can we do better together as a society or as a country? Whereas here it's, and it has been extreme. It has been an extreme in the past eight years. It does not matter what the person next to me is doing. It does not matter. It is what only matters is, am I getting what I want? Am I Am I winning? Yes, but if that makes sense,

Scott Benner 39:56
it's not winning through good work. It's just winning. Yeah. It's

Mark 40:00
just winning, right? Yeah, it doesn't matter. It's ladder climbing, right? Yeah, right.

Scott Benner 40:05
So I'll add my my opinion. I feel like it's possible that life is too good at this point for a lot of people, there's too many options of things to do to capture your attention, like cool things. But seriously, Mark from, like, I don't know, 83,000 different streaming services, yeah. And you know, you've got your computer and your phone, and you have an iPad and you have you could go outside. You could go for a ride in your car. Everybody has a car. Now, you know, like, you could used to be, everyone didn't have a car. You couldn't afford it. You didn't get one, and that was it. But now, but now, you know, you can get a loan without a job, and so, like, like, so now, everybody listen, there are some people who are broke. I'm not saying that. What I'm saying is the Mendoza line for that has gone down and down and down and down. And there are more and more people who, I think, have access to things that are just, frankly, a lot more fun than working or being excellent at your craft or that kind of thing, like so when you have it used to be, you got up in the morning and you had an egg and you got in your crappy car. I don't know if people remember cars from the 80s, but they weren't a pleasure to drive in. And, like, now a car feels like a comfortable living room, like, you know, like, and so, like, you drag your ass to work and you do something that you if you weren't great at it, somebody was gonna fire your ass, and you needed to be great at it. So you were, and then you got home, and you'll, like, you know,

Speaker 1 41:40
I don't know what people used to do, stare at a wall, you know what I mean, and then probably read the newspaper. Yeah, he probably banged one out, went to bed at 830 Right? Like, so, like, That's it, over and over and over again. You couldn't go home and watch a guy play Twitch for 13 hours on your phone. You couldn't go play a video game that looked like you were in the middle of the goddamn Iraq War. Like, like, you don't even, like, there's so much going on now, I don't think anybody's got time to think about their job even

Mark 42:10
Well, there's a lot, there's a lack of urgency, because, because people, because of exactly what you said, there's, there's this great amount of privilege. And I think a lot of what it boils down to, too, is we just, we lack a sense of appreciation and a sense of reality. People don't, I don't think people understand how good in a large sense. I mean, yeah, everywhere you look there's people

Scott Benner 42:33
struggling. You've seen the first generation of kids whose parents lives were pretty easy. Yeah,

Mark 42:40
right. And so I'm a, I'm a big fan of Howard Stern. I don't know if you are, but he's one of, one of my most favorite things that he's has said recently is, you know, they go play tapes of, hey, we want a dictator here in America, or we want this or that. And it's like, Listen, if that's what, you go, go, move to Russia or go, and I care, you won't last two seconds and see what it's like, and people don't realize the opportunity that they're in. And I think a lot of what you're boiling down to is, you know, you said a plain, we're missing opportunity. And would you look at, you know, if you look at statistics, and see where we are as a country, as far as the, you know, what are we producing that's been exported. Where are we? Educationally, where is our? Where is our? Our economy? It's not the top 10, not in any of them.

Scott Benner 43:30
I would say, like, like, political stuff aside, if anyone is looking to be led instead of leading, I think that is, to some level, like an indication of, it's like laziness. It's like, I'll just let a person tell me what's right, and then empathetic, yeah, that's another thing I don't have to think about, you know, and, and I, honestly, I'm being serious, like taking any, like, left or right leaning ideas away from it. If you're in a position, in any spot in your life, forget politics, where you're just like, oh, I'll just go with what's being said. That, to me, feels like you don't want to think about it. Yeah, and yeah, so, but, but my, I guess my greater point is, is that I think it's possible that the guy at the tire shop is not qualified to be a guy at the tire shop,

Mark 44:24
and how it's pretty that's pretty challenging. How is

Speaker 1 44:28
everybody failing up? Is what I don't understand. Like, like, you know what I mean? Like, what happened? Like, did the manager at the tire shop stand in front of that guy one day and think to himself, I can't believe I gotta hire this guy, but I do. And by the way, the other guys that weren't like didn't have I went later in the day. Obviously, there were two guys there who were watching YouTube videos on their phones, like sitting in the garage, just the place wasn't perfect. It wasn't clean. There were stuff to be put there's stuff to do. Yeah, they were. Watching YouTube videos on their phone. One guy I tried to just like, say hello to, and he looked through me like I didn't exist. And I was like,

Scott Benner 45:09
Oh my God.

Mark 45:10
Like my what my experience is is that's a that's a lack of leadership. I think, I think in that instance, yeah, you have an employee who didn't change the tires and it was back. But he, as far as from my understanding, if I'm interpreting this right, he looked at you like my manager didn't take the time to explain to you why I couldn't change the tires, because he made this and and you know, you, if you have employees that are sitting there watching YouTube and not that comes down to the leadership, and that comes down to a top, from top from top to bottom, approach, right? There's no pressure. What am I teaching my employees and what is my expectations? What is my structure? Yeah,

Scott Benner 45:47
there's no onus on let's do let's all just do a good job while we're here. Yeah, yeah, yep. I worked, man. I worked in a sheet metal shop for years and years and years, and I got in there and I hit that time clock and I went for eight hours, you did not stop. You were happy if you had to take a in the middle of the day, because it was five minutes where you could just like, sit there and go, Oh my god, I can't believe how hard I'm working. And I made $4.75 an hour, and I'm still not sure I'm not going to get lung cancer one day from what I lived through and and I never went in there and thought they're not paying me enough, and by the way, they weren't. But I never thought this job sucks, which, by the way, it did. I never thought I deserve more. Like, I just went and I took the job and I did the job like I said I was going to do it, and I did it like, that was it. I don't understand the rest of it like, and I don't know if I sound like an old person at this point like I really don't, but you're gonna see a collapse of everything if everyone isn't working hard at the thing that they're being asked to do. And I think your point earlier, no one sees their job as their goal. They see it as something they're stepping on to get to their goal. You know, I don't know. I've seen it in a lot of different areas, like, forget guys in tire shops, you know, I know professional people who work with people who all make hundreds of 1000s of dollars a year, and they put about the same goddamn effort into their job as the guy at the tire shop does. So everybody's just like, I want to, you know, I'm trying to get to the weekend. I'm trying to buy a house. I'm trying to, like, go on vacation. I want this. I want that, like, and by the way, I want to back up from it for a second. Mark, you should enjoy your life, yeah, and you should be a focus. And you should be working towards all the things that you want and feel like you need, or whatever. Not if the planes are going to fall out of the sky. Like, you know what I mean?

Mark 47:45
Like, you know, there, there has to be some of that intrinsic motivation to sadatmos. I'm a tire shop, you know, mechanic, but I'm going to be the best, I'm going to do a

Scott Benner 47:57
really good job at this mechanic that I could possibly be. That's how I'm gonna get out of this one day. If I don't want to be here,

Mark 48:02
there's a lack of pride, and people don't. It's just, I mean, you, I think you hit it. It's just very people are very apathetic, to an extent, and

Scott Benner 48:12
it's not everybody, and I'm not, I'm certainly not saying it is, but I'm saying that when it happens, it's so obviously this thing right here. Yeah, you know, and I don't know, it's just fantastic. It's crazy to me. Somebody said to me the other day, do you make a living talking to people? And I said, I do. I was like, I don't know another way to put it, like I do. I sit down, I have a conversation with somebody, I draw out their thoughts, I add my thoughts. It is popular enough that people want to buy ads on it. That's how I make a living. And they, they were really perplexed by this. I and I know them personally. I said, That's so interesting. Like, so, so they're like, so you just talk. And then they kept getting stuck on it and and then the conversation went towards, you know, do you ever think you'll have a real job again? And I said, this is a real job. Like it was like, I said, I know what you mean, though. Like, you mean, am I gonna have to pick something up or hit something or carry something nine to five? Yeah, yeah. And I said, I don't know. Maybe, you know, I'm sure this could all fall apart. And then I you know, I'd have to go back to work doing something else, just to watch their heads spin about it. And I think in their minds, I'm part of what I just described,

Mark 49:27
yeah. And I yeah, I could see that, yeah, that was

Scott Benner 49:30
so that was really interesting. And I so I start talking about how it helps people and their health. And I even said, like, I have a an image of my mind, of a triangle with, like, three points, obviously, because it's a triangle. Can you imagine if I had a triangle with four points? Because what I would have

Mark 49:48
is a square, but quadrilateral?

Scott Benner 49:52
Oh, could I smush it around a little bit? I didn't really pay attention to geometry, from what you're telling me, it's not my fault. I didn't have a good teacher. But I said, like, I have. Something that I feel like I'm good at and I'm it pays my bills, and it helps people, and I feel very lucky to do something that touches those three points every day. And as I tried to explain how it helped people, what I could see in their face was they don't have a medical issue. They don't have this thing that they nobody's given him all of the details for, and he didn't understand why the value was there for people listening. And I thought to myself, I didn't say it to him, but I thought to myself, I hope you never know why this podcast helps people, because that's going to mean that you're having a pretty significant health issue. Yeah, you know. But he, he couldn't, like, make sense of it,

Mark 50:43
yeah? And I think it's, it's hard when you, when you are struggling to communicate a message and but people aren't open to understanding it, or even wanting to understand, oh, this is different, and it's okay that it's different. Let me, let me. Let me take meaning from it in my own way, doesn't matter that it's helping hundreds of 1000s of other people, but if it's not helping me, then it's worthless. Yeah, listen, before we I want to back up for a second and go so go ahead and so just to go back on teachers. And I just want to make sure my point is clear, that I think that teachers are the most wonderful, like some of the most wonderful people in the face of the amount of work that's done for for the turnaround, the income that's given is incredible. And I think if we didn't have teachers, you would have some serious, serious issues. I mean, not beyond the fact that we have education, but the teachers do what they do, not for the money, because of the passion for the work, and what I was just a circle back. And my point is this is that imagine how much better it would be if our teachers felt valued and were and were actually being paid something that matches the work that they put like it goes. You know, are we? Why isn't education valued? And just how incredible our teachers would be in the schools would be if they were funded appropriately. And yes, that what that does turn into is that you have people going to education because it might be a backdrop, or it might be it's not their first choice. And yeah, so the quality of what we're seeing and the people coming in is maybe not what we had hoped for, but it's not necessary. I don't think it's on the fault of the teachers. I think it's on the fault of the system. And I would say

Scott Benner 52:27
that just assessing your comp like your input, I would say that it doesn't really matter if it's money or what the reason is that it gets sideways, like, is it that we're not attracting the best people? Is it that they don't feel valued, so they don't give a full effort? Is it because they're working a second, it doesn't really matter. What matters is, is that that is that's the prevalent vibe, which is, teachers are very important, but we don't value them enough to do all these other things for them, and so that just has to be what's in your head. And I'm sure you come out of school. Listen, my guess is there's two different people that want to be teachers. There's people who want to help people, and there's people who don't want to work in the summertime. I'm going to guess that coming out of college, like, that's like, where you get like, that's probably the buckets that people come out of. Like, mainly, I'm sure there's others, but I'm obviously generalizing. And so the people who just want the summer off are probably not putting in a full effort to begin with. You probably were never going to get it out of them and and, God bless, like, whatever. You know, they still went and got their degree and everything. And then the people who were there to be like, I'm going to change the world six months into it, when they realize there's no way I can change the world from here like that probably weighs on them, that that's probably burnout. You probably get burnout. Yes,

Mark 53:47
oh yes, yes, yes, absolutely. You want to. You come because you want to save the world, and then you realize you can't even save the 20 something that are in front of you,

Scott Benner 53:57
and 15 of them don't want to be saved, by the way, yeah, right, yeah.

Mark 54:01
It makes you, it makes you reflect on what you you know, how can you serve that same purpose, and are you gonna be able to fulfill that, you know, doing what you're doing?

Scott Benner 54:09
It's interesting because you're describing, if you've heard any of like, kind of the Grand Rounds and cold wind stuff I've been doing this year where we basically, there's been a number of doctors who have said, look, at some point you can only say something to somebody so many times before you start thinking they're not going to listen to me. And you can see how it like, drags them down. And now I'm hearing that in this conversation about teaching, and I so I think it's not about the it's not about the specific job you're trying to do. I think it's just, again, it's just a human thing. You know what I mean? Like, like, you can't ask somebody to beat their head against the wall forever and expect that they're gonna willfully smash it into the wall forever. And, yeah, you know. And so is that not again, the problem of the person on the other side, whether it's the patient or the student. Or the family, or, you know, whatever, like, if you're not receptive to what's being given to you, you're just taking the ass out of the person who's trying to help you, and then at some point they're going to give up, and then you can't go, well, it's their fault. They didn't help me. Like, you know, yeah, yeah. A tough, a tough circle that I think we get caught in all the time. Yeah, and I think if we sat back and thoughtfully went through a lot of other parts of society and life, I certainly think we would see that happening over and over again.

Mark 55:32
It's as simple as just identifying the fact that I'm not perfect, and if I'm this, I always say this, if I'm the smartest person in the room, that's a problem. You know, I want to surround myself people with people who are smarter than me and who can, who I can learn from. And if I'm, if I'm closed off and refusing to take input and learn from the people that are around me, whether it's through education or through medical situations or whatever, then what's, what's the point? Like, I'm not, you know, that's your are you so that egotistical? Are you that self centered, that you think that you have nothing to gain from from others? And I just, I think, I think that's something that's helped driven me, is just identifying that I want to, I want to be a sponge and just soak in as much as I can for the people around me, whether it's type one diabetes or teaching or fitness or mental health, you know, whatever.

Scott Benner 56:28
I don't know if this is going to feel one to one at first, but when I my first real girlfriend, somebody who I dated for a stretch of time, she came from a family that was messed up, and my parents were divorced, and so I remember having this conversation one point when I said to her, I don't know really how to be a good like partner in this because I have no like, no experience seeing it firsthand, I said, but I think if we started with I'll put you first, and you put me first, and then we'll see. Like, I think if I have your best interest at heart, you have mine, we should probably do better. Do you know what I mean? And like, that's it's where we started, because we were young and we didn't know what we were doing, and neither of us had a good example. And so I still, I think that about this, about, like, life and and working and society, like, if, if you just realize that you're a small piece of a big thing that won't work as well without you, I'll put it first. And I don't mean you know that the first 90% of my effort goes out to society and, like, I don't care about myself, just when you're making decisions, you know, start there, like, just start with the greater good, and then, you know, get to you, I don't know, 10%

Mark 57:53
later, part of contributing to the to the bigger picture, sometimes, is just as simple as doing, doing your part. Yeah. I mean, you think about any sports team, and how many times do you see the pregame speech and the captain or the coach, it's just like, do your part, do your role, do your part, and the team will come together. Yeah,

Scott Benner 58:12
I've never seen the right guard of a football team interviewed once in my entire life. But you know, they got through a whole game and nobody got sacked on that side, or they ran through that hole. No problem. All day, I've never seen anybody put the right guard on television and go, Yo, man, you were blowing holes open left and right. Yeah. VP, yeah, yeah, you're gonna, you want to go to Disney World, baby? It's you. Yeah. No, they're gonna give it to the guy that ran through the hole you made and and that has to be okay to some degree. You know what I mean, like, if you're going to be a good right guard, you have to know. No one's going to know my name or give a crap about what I do. I'm just going to do this thing quietly, and if I do it, well, I get to keep doing it.

Mark 58:50
Everybody wants to be the quarterback, yeah, but not everybody can be the quarterback, unfortunately. Well,

Scott Benner 58:55
no, almost nobody can. Actually, some of the quarterbacks can. That's how hard it is, yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't know what we've decided here today, Mark, but I think we've done it well. And I'm going to ask if there's anything we haven't talked about, and I did not answer you, and I did not want, I didn't mean to not answer you. I've been listening to Howard Stern since I was a sophomore in high school. Okay? He came to New York. He was in New York in the 80s, right? And then he expanded into Philadelphia, and I used to, I saved up to buy a Walkman that had an FM receiver in it, and I would walk out my front door in the morning, put on my little metal strap with the two foam things on my ears, and I would, I'd listen to Howard Stern on the bus walking into school as long as I could every day, we would set up double sided cassette tapes to record as much of the show as we could so we could listen to it in the afternoon. Noon. I was at the de Bella funeral in Philadelphia when John de Bell, when John de Bella fell out of number one. I was at his first book signing in Manhattan. I've met Artie Lang. I once flew in a private plane from Philadelphia to upstate New York with stuttering John

Mark 1:00:20
thanks. He's in Buffalo, right?

Scott Benner 1:00:24
So do you want to know how that happened? Before we go, I do want to know that my buddy worked at a little private airfield in Northeast Philadelphia. We were all hanging out one night after midnight at a movie theater where all my friends worked and where I met my wife, and guy comes up screaming up in his car, and he's like, Yo, you guys want to meet stuttering John from the Howard Stern Show. He's going to fly out of the the airport tonight, and we could, we could meet him. And I was like, I'll do that. So it's like, one o'clock in the morning. We drive to the airfield. We're waiting in the office. This car pulls up, and John Melendez, who most people aren't going to know, was eventually the, I mean, I think he was the announcer on The Tonight Show with Jay Leno for a little while. And he comes up, he had been playing in a band in Philly somewhere. Howard Stern was in the middle of a radio stunt where he was running for Governor of New York. Yeah, and he could have won, probably, he was polling really well, right? Yeah. And so he was going to announce his I know there was a big announcement, I think in Buffalo, right? Is that right? Buffalo? I

Mark 1:01:32
think so maybe.

Scott Benner 1:01:33
Okay. So anyway, John and his friends show up. We chat him up for a little bit. It's two o'clock in the morning at this point, and we actually wander out on the tarmac with him, and we're still talking to him, and he goes up. It's a twin prop plane, like, I want to tell you, it's like a it was like the pilot, the co pilot, and four seats, okay? And so we climb up, and he climbs up on the plane. He turns back to his buddy and realizes that his buddy is not getting on the plane with him. He goes, Yo, man, what are you doing? He goes, doing? He goes, I can't go with you. I have to go back to the gig and clean up. And John goes, I don't want to fly on this plane by myself. And he looks me in the face, and he goes, you want to come with me? And I went, yup. And so I just I walked away from my friends. I was like, five or six of my friends with me, my best friend in the world, Mike and some other guys I'm very close with. I didn't even think for a second about them. I was like, you guys can compound sand. I'm doing this, right? So, like, I start walking forward, and I look at my friend, Mike and Brian, and they look like puppies. And I said, Can I bring some guys with me? And he looks at the pilot, he goes, can we how many people can we put on this plane? He goes, you can bring that guy in one more. And I did turn around and pick somebody. I picked my friend Mike, and we get up on the plane and we're just chatting, and he's, like, I really appreciate it guys. Like, I'm nervous to fly by myself. Blah, blah. He goes, You can hang out when we get there if you want. Or I can. I'll have the pilot bring you back. Like, I didn't even have that much thought when I got on the plane, like, how am I gonna get home? Like, oh yeah. Didn't even think about it. And so, you know, I'm about 19 years old at that point, and I led a fairly sheltered life. I grew up pretty broke. So that's important, because as we're taxiing down the runway at 230 in the morning with stuttering John and some guy flying a plane, I don't know, the plane that feels like a goddamn car with a propeller on it, and it's getting ready to lift off the ground. My buddy looks at me, and he goes, you've never been on a plane before. And I went, oh my god, I haven't. And John goes, what I said, I've never flown before. And then the plane just picks up off the ground and goes. And then we talked about the show and music and stuff for, I don't know, maybe two hours for the flight. And we landed at four o'clock. The pilot's like, I gotta go to the bathroom before we go back. And that's when me and my friend were like, what do we do? And John goes, Listen, you can sleep on my hotel room floor if you want, but I don't know how you're gonna get home. And we were like, and the pilot's like, I gotta fly back. You can come and so we climbed back on the plane and flew home. And then we, of course, arrived at 6am our no there was no car there. So then my buddy and I walked for like two hours to get home. After that, I got home at like, 830 in the morning, and then I kept in contact with John, and I think I saw him a couple more times. I actually did spend the night in this hotel room once when he was playing a gig somewhere. And anyway, that's, that's my stuttering John story. I'm

Mark 1:04:37
pretty floor that stuttering John as a private jet, or I was able to get access to a private

Scott Benner 1:04:41
plane. Yeah, I'm assuming the show like they wanted him there. So I'm so assuming the show paid for it to get him there.

Mark 1:04:47
I so my quick two cents about Howard Stern. I mean, obviously all the antics and everything is hilarious, and it makes for great listening. But I I think. In our generation. He is one of, if not the best interviewer. And I don't know how many people that he has in the show. I think you know, one example for me is and for whatever reason, just because I'm an idiot, like Lady Gaga, I never liked Lady Gaga. I don't know why. You know, she's phenomenal. He has her on the show in, I don't know what the first time was, 2018 maybe, and I fell in love with her because of just the way that he, he conducts the interviews and pulls out the information about these people and gets down to their core and makes them vulnerable. And you know, beyond her, how many other people I've listened to him interview, and it's like, holy, I didn't know that about this person. Or, you know, he had during the election or after the election. He had Hillary Clinton on and and just to hear about her story, and whether you support her, don't support her, like or don't like her, but you have to appreciate her as a person, interesting

Scott Benner 1:05:50
story. Yeah, so Mark, can I tell you something that's there's a couple of ideas in there that I employ on the podcast. Yeah, I so mimic what you're saying that I can tell you that I know that Lady Gaga sang a song called I Am My hair during that interview, and I remember she started singing. I thought, What the hell are we doing right now? I still like that song. I don't know if the song's any good. What I know is, is that he introduced me to ideas from her head that I would not have gotten anywhere else. And I will tell you that you and I started talking before we were recording, and you said something about, like, you know, I appreciate you having me on. Like, a lot of these podcasts won't have you on unless you have, like, some big social media following. And I said, I prefer people who have no like, like, even once about that, because I like to talk to regular people, because I think they're more forthcoming, I think they're honest and they're not guarded, and all of these other things, and everyone's story, the part I didn't say to you back then is I think everyone's story is incredibly interesting, and the reason I know that is because in the 1980s I heard Howard Stern interview a porn star, and never once asked her about porn. And, like, just talk to her about her life and and that's kind of how I do this. Like I lead with the idea that you all have something really incredible, but you don't even know what it is like, you need me to, like, lead you through it so that you can let out the parts that are interesting. Because if you ask people about themselves, they say the same banal over and over again that nobody cares about, because that's how they see themselves, but they don't see the part that I see. And so, like, I think that that's why, that's how I do it. And if I'm going to be honest, I learned that from Howard Stern like that everybody has a story and it's interesting. I

Mark 1:07:46
mean, I think that's wonderful, I think, and I think your guests will appreciate that too, because, you know, just again, from my experience today, and you know, when I listen to it's it's important people want to feel valued, and that's also what makes a great content, is when people feel comfortable enough to open up and share, and you hit the nail on the head is that everybody has a story. Some are some might be much more fascinating than others, but everybody's story is important, and everybody needs an opportunity or an outlet to tell it, and you never know what might come from it, and you never know also who might resonate with it. That's

Scott Benner 1:08:19
the most important part. Like, it's nice for you to tell the story, but it's the people who pick up the tidbits on the other side that's important. And it doesn't matter if I agree with you or I don't agree with you, you would never know. While I was talking to you, you just you mentioned your experience listening to Hillary Clinton be interviewed. I have an opinion about that. I'm not it's not important. Like, you know what I mean? Like, my opinion, one way or the other is not important. It's, you know, it's, I mean, I could hear some like, you know, in your conversation today, there were some like, politically, like, marked things you were saying. But I didn't care where you got the idea from. I cared about the concept behind the idea. And also,

Mark 1:08:57
Scott, and if I, you know, I don't, I don't know you that well. But if I could make an assumption too, is that you and I, if you know, if you and I went to a bar and had a drink, we don't have to agree and and I think that that's another piece that we're missing, is that it doesn't matter if we agree. But can we have a discourse about it? Yeah, can we have a conversation about it? It doesn't have to be not everything has to be so volatile. I would find

Scott Benner 1:09:19
it more interesting if we didn't agree. Honestly, yeah,

Mark 1:09:22
let's have a conversation. Let's talk about why you feel that way. Let's but, and that's what our country was, was based on. And I wish more people would be willing to have that conversation. Have a conversation even

Scott Benner 1:09:33
when I end up doing the the stuff with Erica that I mentioned earlier. It's mainly about me trying to figure out how people's minds work. Yeah, like, that's the part I find fascinating. Even, like, moderating the Facebook group, like, like, I like that at this point I can tell which way something's gonna go, like, like, like, it's interesting how people fall into lanes and they don't know it. They think they're being very unique, and they and, and I'm like, oh, no, this is. Gonna happen, and then that's gonna happen, and then this is gonna like, I had a woman yell at me the other day online, and so she was being very unpleasant to people on Facebook, and let's call her Karen. Well, he called her Karen. I might call her something else, but she's being very unpleasant. She had a particular point of view, which I didn't I didn't agree or disagree with. It didn't matter to me, like she could have gotten out her point of view without being horrible to people, right? Yeah, so I removed her comments because they were horrible, not because of the content, not because of their their opinion. And so I hope that people can take me at my word. I don't. I didn't care what her opinion was or her perspective was. I cared that she wasn't being kind to people. I took it out. Well, in my mind, I was like, I'm going to get a direct message from this woman in 5432, here it comes, just because blah blah, blah and blah blah, and I'm not going to, like, sit by while you, like, push this liberal agenda. And I'm like, I'm like, All right, here we go. Like, I don't have it. Here's the agenda I have, lady, I want everybody to be nice to each other, yep, just be that hard be nice and have your incredibly conservative opinion about this, and that's fine. Or listen in getting away from that, go rant and rave at people about how great it is to eat Twinkies, or how great it is to not eat any carbs or anywhere in between. Like, I don't care, just be nice about it. Yep, right? Like, and I have, I have a thread I have to go back and look at after I'm done with you here where a woman is not being nice about it, and I'm gonna have to say, Hey, listen, you need to be kinder, and then 54321, Mark, she's going to do exactly what the last person did. She's going to send a nasty message and suggest that I don't agree with her, and that's why I'm doing this. And then I'm going to give her back a very reasonable response, that she will ignore every reasonable aspect of it, and then call me names and then leave the group. It happens every time it happens.

Mark 1:12:04
And honestly, in my opinion, good riddance, yeah, but, but

Scott Benner 1:12:08
the point is is, like, I don't have an opinion about you, like, just be a cool person and have your opinion. It's great. Like, it's fine. But my point is that the next five steps they take are always the same, yeah, and it's always in the same order. And then every once in a while, I get a save at the end where they'll go, You know what? I don't know why I'm doing this. I'm so sorry. And like, please, I'll, you know, I'd like to forget this happen. Yeah, those people are never a problem again, yeah? But like, if I read to you, like, the horrible things that this person said to me the other night, like, like, it went from like, and you can go back to their posts. Oh my god, this podcast is amazing. It saved my life. This helped me. That helped me. My a one sees better, my kids healthier. Blah blah blah, blah, blah, blah blah. This thing is Mecca for me, blah blah blah. And then five seconds after I disagree with you, you're a asshole, Scott, and you're blah, blah, blah, and you're, then I'm like, oh, which is it, did I save your life? You die? Yeah. Oh, my God, oh, very close. Mark, like, you know, like, like, so which is it, did I save your life, or am I a prick, like, you know, like, and by the way, if I saved your life, who cares if I disagreed with your point? Which, by the way, which, by the way, Mark, I didn't the irony is, agreed with her.

Mark 1:13:26
It's be it's people can't communicate and people can't

Scott Benner 1:13:35
think thinking is hard. Mark,

Mark 1:13:37
thinking is hard, and thinking for yourself is hard, and having a unique opinion is is difficult, and it's much easier, as you said before. It's much easier to let other people lead and and go along with the loud crowd than it is to say, You know what, I don't necessarily agree with one one piece. And I'm going to just tell you why. The

Scott Benner 1:13:58
point here, in case she's hate listening and still listens? Is that?

Mark 1:14:01
Oh, she, oh, she 100% is, yeah, there's a lot. I he might not be listening to get to my episode, but she's 100% still listen. Yeah, there's,

Scott Benner 1:14:10
there's just a few hate listeners. That's fine. I'll take your downloads. The point is, is that I agreed with her, like, personally, I agreed with her, but as the moderator, I can't let her be unkind to people while she's making her point. And also, those people have a point, which, if you thought about, you could find a way to agree with also, because it's not a black or white situation that we were talking about, and there's a lot of gray in it. But if you ask me, personally, I lean towards the person who was calling me all kinds of names, hoping that I exploded, and, you know, said I was pushing a liberal agenda. And by the way, I have a lot of liberal leanings. You're a teacher. I'm sure you do too.

Speaker 1 1:14:52
I also have, like, a lot of conservative ideas. And I have ideas all over the place. If you talk to me, I'd be a quite. Complex little person, which I think most people are, yeah, but there she was. She's like, I know what you're doing. I'm like, I don't know what voice in your head you're

Scott Benner 1:15:07
arguing with, but it's not me. I just happen to be the focus of it at the moment. So anyway, between you and me, Mark and no one else, I think she's out of her fcking mind.

Mark 1:15:19
I'll bet I'll make sure that tell anybody

Scott Benner 1:15:21
I think she's crazy. Don't

Mark 1:15:23
worry. You don't have to worry about anybody.

Scott Benner 1:15:26
She's either nuts or she was drunk. I don't know which one it is. I don't actually care.

Mark 1:15:29
I always, I always wish to, like, I wish I had that much time to, I mean, I don't have, I barely have enough time to give myself a shot of insulin, let alone sit and just troll you on a Facebook thread. Like, holy, if you're if you're that bored, go get another job. That's

Scott Benner 1:15:47
the other thing. Guess what? A lot of people need employees. Oh, Mark, that's the other thing.

Speaker 1 1:15:53
It's quarter or 12 at night, and I'm like, I just want to go to bed like I don't I, but I can't let this fester overnight, because I can tell her crazy doesn't sleep. So I'm like, she's going to be up all night picking at these people. And I can't wake up in the morning to a bloodbath of people who, by the way, just want to know how to pre bolus their goddamn insulin, aren't looking to have some existential conversation with her. And whatever it is she learned on whatever news organization she listens to, or person at work that she listens to, or whatever she got her ideas from. Like, I can't let that turn into that. And by the way, this is a very infrequent I'm being genuine. Like, this happens very infrequently on my Facebook group, because mostly people know I'm not up for these stuff, you know?

Scott Benner 1:16:36
I mean, like, I'm not okay with this. But it's fascinating how many times people have told me you don't have to, you know, blah blah blah, just because you disagree with me and I want to respond back and go, No, you idiot, I do agree with you. You're just an asshole that I can't do that. So I just go, you know, I tell my down the story, down the middle, like I'm doing this to protect everybody. Everybody has an opinion. Blah blah blah, you know, people need to feel safe while they're talking, etc. People come here for community not to be told that they're wrong. You know, you were very unkind in the end. You just, you broke rule number one of the group. You just, you weren't kind when you did this. It

Mark 1:17:13
takes minimal effort to just say, you know, at the end of the day, I'm gonna walk away from this conversation and know that I treated that person the way they expected it or deserve to be treated. Yeah, not important enough to make somebody else feel belittled or like shit. It's fascinating

Scott Benner 1:17:31
when people feel like they're saving the world three posters at a time. I'm like, you know, if you put this much effort into something that could actually help your idea, you might actually get somewhere, but you're trying to talk Marcy, me and three other people into it. I made up that name, you know what? I mean? Like, what? Then again. And have you ever ranted at someone online and had them go, Oh, my God, thank you. You've changed my mind.

Mark 1:17:56
I feel enlightened. Yeah. Oh, wow. Oh, thank

Scott Benner 1:17:59
you so much. Yeah, before I thought this, but now I see that you're right. I don't know. I don't know why everybody's so dumb sometimes. No,

Mark 1:18:06
I gotta make sure I join that group, because it sounds like there's some great things happening, as well as some good entertainment. My Facebook group is fantastic. It's got 50,000 people in it. Okay? I might already be a part of it. If I'm not, I'll definitely make sure I join Well,

Scott Benner 1:18:21
listen, I'm glad we ran out of time here. I would tell you about the Etsy seller who couldn't figure out how to send the thing to me now and now suddenly isn't responding anymore to my notes.

Mark 1:18:31
We'll save that for next time. Oh, yeah, yeah,

Scott Benner 1:18:32
don't worry. She's gonna I, you know, oh, it's on its way. It's blah, blah, blah. Then, you know, the the UPS the post office is like, I don't know where this package is. Like, it's somewhere, but it's going, Yeah, we don't say it. And, you know, like, I reach out to her, and I'm like, all of a sudden, she don't know how the messaging function works anymore in Etsy. She forgot how to message me back, but

Mark 1:18:54
she can, but she can accept your payment. I

Scott Benner 1:18:58
do think she's going to take my $100 and do do whatever she wants with it. Yeah, unbelievable. And she has something I really want, which she it's not her fault that it's not coming. But like, as soon as it turned into a thing, like, she suddenly, like, became non responsive about it, oh, off the face of the earth. Yeah. Everybody sucks, except for you and me. Mark, we're terrific. Okay, we're cool. All right, I'm still calling this one five large firemen, or whatever you said,

Mark 1:19:24
Five, five giant, five giant firemen, five giant firemen. And in the moment they seemed like like giants. I

Scott Benner 1:19:31
might say five giant firemen in my bed, but that seems very long. That's

Mark 1:19:35
it's more it's more descriptive, though it really is. All right, I'll

Scott Benner 1:19:38
figure it out. Mark, thanks. Hold on one second for me, a huge thank you to one of today's sponsors, GVO glucagon. Find out more about G vo hypo pen at gvoke glucagon.com, forward slash juice box. You spell that, G, V, O, k, e, g, l, u. C, A, G, o, n.com, forward slash juicebox, I want to thank the Eversense CGM for sponsoring this episode of The juicebox podcast. Learn more about its implantable sensor, smart transmitter and terrific mobile application at Eversense cgm.com/juicebox. Get the only implantable sensor for long term wear. Get ever sense the conversation you just enjoyed was brought to you by us. Med, us. Med.com/juice, box, or call 888-721-1514, get started today and get your supplies from us. Med, okay, well, here we are at the end of the episode, you're still with me. Thank you. I really do appreciate that. What else could you do for me? Uh, why don't you tell a friend about the show or leave a five star review? Maybe you could make sure you're following or subscribed in your podcast app, go to YouTube and follow me, or Instagram. Tiktok. Oh gosh, here's one. Make sure you're following the podcast in the private Facebook group as well as the public Facebook page you don't want to miss. Please do not know about the private group. You have to join the private group as of this recording, it has 51,000 members in it. They're active, talking about diabetes, whatever you need to know there's a conversation happening in there right now, and I'm there all the time. Tag me. I'll say, hi, hey. What's up everybody? If you've noticed that the podcast sounds better, and you're thinking like, how does that happen? What you're hearing is Rob at wrong way recording, doing his magic to these files. So if you want him to do his magic to you, wrong way recording.com. You got a podcast. You want somebody to edit it. You want rob you.


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