#1522 Tired Uterus

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Josalyn is a labor and delivery nurse and mom of six—her youngest, was diagnosed with type 1 at age 5. This episode dives into the challenges of parenting a big family while managing T1D.

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DISCLAIMER: This text is the output of AI based transcribing from an audio recording. Although the transcription is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors and should not be treated as an authoritative record. Nothing that you read here constitutes advice medical or otherwise. Always consult with a healthcare professional before making changes to a healthcare plan.

Scott Benner 0:00
Hello friends and welcome back to another episode of The Juicebox Podcast.

Jocelyn 0:14
My name is Jocelyn. I have six children, and I'm a nurse.

Scott Benner 0:19
Nothing you hear on the Juicebox Podcast, should be considered advice medical or otherwise, always consult a physician before making any changes to your healthcare plan. AG, one is offering my listeners a free $76 gift. When you sign up, you'll get a welcome kit, a bottle of d3, k2, and five free travel packs in your first box. So make sure you check out drink AG, one.com/juicebox to get this offer, don't forget to save 40% off of your entire order at cozy earth.com. All you have to do is use the offer code Juicebox at checkout. That's Juicebox at checkout to save 40% at cozy earth.com the podcast contains so many different series and collections of information that it can be difficult to find them in your traditional podcast app. Sometimes. That's why they're also collected at Juicebox podcast.com go up to the top, there's a menu right there. Click on series, defining diabetes. Bold beginnings, the Pro Tip series, small sips, Omnipod, five ask Scott and Jenny. Mental wellness, fat and protein, defining thyroid, after dark, diabetes, variables, Grand Rounds, cold, wind, pregnancy, type two, diabetes, GLP, meds, the math behind diabetes, diabetes myths and so much more, you have to go check it out. It's all there and waiting for you, and it's absolutely free. Juicebox podcast.com Today's episode is sponsored by the tandem mobi system with control iq plus technology. If you are looking for the only system with auto Bolus, multiple wear options and full control from your personal iPhone, you're looking for tandems, newest pump and algorithm. Use my link to support the podcast, tandem diabetes.com/juicebox. Check it out. The episode you're about to enjoy was brought to you by Dexcom, the Dexcom g7 the same CGM that my daughter wears. You can learn more and get started today at my link, dexcom.com/juicebox,

Jocelyn 2:22
you My name is Jocelyn. I have six children, and I'm a nurse.

Scott Benner 2:27
Holy hell. You know how you must listen to the podcast

Jocelyn 2:33
a few times a week. Yeah, okay. But

Scott Benner 2:34
I mean, you start with six children, you know where we're gonna start. Everything's okay. Your parts are okay. You feel all right.

Jocelyn 2:40
Yeah, no, I'm good. I survived. How long of

Scott Benner 2:44
a time frame did you turn those six out in 10

Jocelyn 2:48
years? No kidding. Yeah, three boys, three girls.

Scott Benner 2:52
Did they come out in order? Like, boy, boy, girl, girl. Did they come out? Boy, girl, boy, how did it happen?

Jocelyn 2:57
No, it's girl. Boy, boy, boy, girl, girl, girl, boy,

Scott Benner 3:02
okay. Now, you know, my next question, are you making an army for Jesus? Are you? What are you trying to do? What are you trying to do? Exactly,

Jocelyn 3:08
no, I get that question a lot. I always wanted a big family. I was just around big families growing up. I just love that dynamic. And my husband comes from a big family, and so when I told him, You know, I think I wanted 12 when we first got married, so he knew what he was getting into, and he was mostly okay with it. I think he wanted to stop around kid four. But, you know, here we are six kids. You were like, I want more kids. Yeah, pretty much.

Scott Benner 3:36
Yep. Where do you live that you can keep six children, plus yourself, your husband, and I'm guessing, with this drive to be kind of thing, six cats and a dog and a parakeet, like, how are you keeping how? Okay, how many pets do you have?

Jocelyn 3:49
So we just have one.

Scott Benner 3:51
Is it a dog?

Jocelyn 3:52
Yes, yeah. I mean, we, in the past, we've had, you know, chickens and pigs and stuff like that. But currently, we just have a dog who's old and she's he's great, but, yeah, no, cats. I'm not a cat person. Oh,

Scott Benner 4:03
chickens and pigs. Do the kids live in the house? Yeah, they are allowed in the house. That's awesome. Yeah. I mean, you don't have to tell me where you live. I know, as we were, by the way, as we're setting this up before we're recording, I'm like, There's no way where you live will come up. But just in case, like, what's the community? Like, I don't like, if I don't know, I'm very baffled, as you can tell, yeah, I don't know people that have more than three children. Local to me,

Jocelyn 4:28
yeah, no. We live in the Northeast, and it's definitely a very expensive area, but I, you know, work more than full time. My husband has his own business, and so we just, I don't know, we've been doing a long time. Actually, we're on the kind of the decrease right now, because two of our kids are really kind of grown and self sufficient. So we're, it feels like four kids is nothing, you know.

Scott Benner 4:50
So you're, and I don't mean to pry, but your husband's wealthy. Is that what we're talking about here? I don't even

Jocelyn 4:55
say wealthy, because you know how it is. You get to the end of the year and you're like, we made how much? And we have how much, but we always, you know, we've done well and just kind of okay, you know, been really blessed. Yeah, you think those

Scott Benner 5:06
kids are going to college, all six of them, so, no, I think

Jocelyn 5:10
some of them are not inclined, and we will help them, like, that's what we have done with our oldest two. They're out of the house, but I definitely don't think all of them will go to college, and we definitely won't, you know, pay for all of it, that they're gonna have to ante up a little bit if it's something they really want. Good luck.

Scott Benner 5:25
Yeah, I know. So your husband came from a large family. How big

Jocelyn 5:29
he's the youngest of seven? No kidding. I'm sorry. Are you Catholic? Nope, nope. Just love kids. I know. Like just, I just wanted a bunch of kids. I loved being pregnant. I love, I love, love birth. That's what I do for work. So, yeah, I just something that I found came easily to me. Do you collect other things,

Scott Benner 5:49
like, if I came, if I came in your house, would I be like, Why do you have all these figurines or anything like that? No,

Jocelyn 5:55
no, I'm a very like minimalist. I like open spaces. I'm not a collector of pets or anything, just, just children. Interesting. That's

Scott Benner 6:03
so interesting. I mean, when you said you had six kids, I was like, Oh, the Mormons are back. But it was not what happened. No, about that, look at you. Just a regular old white lady churning out a bunch of kids over there.

Jocelyn 6:14
Yeah, it happens.

Scott Benner 6:20
Awesome. And what are the ages of the kids now? And how old are you?

Jocelyn 6:22
Oh, I'm 40, and my oldest is 20, and my youngest is 10. So that's our diabetic. Wow.

Scott Benner 6:28
Oh, look at you. Really Are there other autoimmune issues?

Jocelyn 6:33
My dad had hyperthyroidism, so, you know, he had his thyroid removed and is on Synthroid. My sister also had hyperthyroidism, and she, let's see, so she's on medication because she had, I can't remember what she had done, but she was diagnosed as a teenager. But besides that,

Scott Benner 6:53
not really, no, and you don't have any ailments or anything, nope, healthy as a horse. How about that? Then childbirth doesn't give you hyperthyroidism, that's it. No, no, no. I thought for sure you were gonna have that. I was like, Oh my God, no, wow, wow. Okay, so you were 20 when you had your first about because you're 40 now and you have a 20 year old, your youngest, who has type one is how old right now? She's 10. She's 10. Okay, yeah, yeah, okay, all right. And how old was she when she was diagnosed?

Jocelyn 7:22
So she was five. So we've been doing this for this is our fifth year, one

Scott Benner 7:26
more year, and you'll have as many years with diabetes. You have kids,

Jocelyn 7:29
that's right, yes, just the same, just, but just put

Scott Benner 7:33
sixes everywhere. Yeah. What's your remembrance of the time? Do you remember how you figured it out, or what your first inclination was.

Jocelyn 7:42
So I have also been a nurse for about five years, so I had just graduated from nursing school, and, you know, kind of had learned a lot about diabetes. The funny part was, I tried to go to nursing school when, before I had my kids, like, like, what same people do go to nursing school right out of high school. I just hated the idea of hurting anybody, like poking them, like so I could not get over giving people shots or taking blood or any of that stuff. So I stopped. I had all my babies, and then I started working in a hospital as a as a tech, and I just loved it. And I thought I want to try to go back to school. So I got over my fear of needles. I, you know, took blood sugars, kind of got around that fear, went to nursing school, graduated, and then, you know, Abby was five years old, so she wasn't in school yet, but we were preparing to move down south to a different state during COVID, which is, I don't know, I got a job down south. And my husband did too. So moving across country on the drive down there, very, very long drive, she started having to pee a lot, you know, classic type one symptoms. And with all my, you know, brand new nursing knowledge, I started to think on the drive down there, I hope it's not type one, you know. And I'm like, no, no, she's gonna get a fever. She's, you know, she started throwing up, and I thought just, it's a virus. Okay, we're gonna keep going. We get down to our new house and a big, huge new city. Don't know who our doctor is going to be. New hospital. We have an awesome pool in our new house. The kids are all playing, you know, she's and she just could not get over this. What I thought was a virus. Well, what I was hoping was not type one, right? One morning must have been the beginning of July, because she was diagnosed in July. We had been there for maybe two days, and she just kept sleeping in the morning. And, you know, I'm really it's COVID. I'm trying not to take her to the hospital. I don't have any resources there. We have no friends. She hadn't had anything to eat or drink the whole day. She had like a popsicle in the morning because it was hot. And I thought, well, I've really been worrying about this for a while, and I feel like I don't want to take her to the hospital if I don't need to expose her to COVID and all these other things, but I could just go get a glucometer at the. CVS. So I went down the road, got a glucometer, you know, figured out how to poke her finger, and it was 417 so then my, you know, like, obviously, then I'm like, okay, it is what I've been afraid of. So we ended up, I took her to the Children's Hospital. And it was kind of funny, because the nurse that took us in at the, you know, the intake, and this is a children's hospital. I said, you know, I my daughter, I believe she has type one diabetes. I just checked her sugar. It was 417 she says, Well, what did she eat today? And I thought, I'm like, it doesn't matter what she ate. Nobody should have a sugar of 417 like, like, if I had said, like, she ate five ice cream cones, they would have been like, Ah, you're fine. Go

Scott Benner 10:44
home. Yeah. So, yeah.

Jocelyn 10:47
So that was kind of like, that was the beginning. She'd spent a couple days in the in the PICU, and then, you know, in the regular unit. And then, you know, we've been, you know, this is our, like, I said, our fifth year. So just been rolling since then. Geez.

Scott Benner 11:00
What makes you want to come on the podcast?

Jocelyn 11:03
Well, I thought I have kind of a unique perspective in that I am a nurse, you know, I'm like, in the hospital, Nurse got a, you know, lot of labor delivery experience, and then just, I feel like, anytime I sorry,

Scott Benner 11:15
I'm sorry. I laughed. Because you do have a lot of labor and delivery experience. I do not even being a nurse. Yeah, personal. And honestly, if you walked up on a stranger having a baby, could you keep watching YouTube with one hand and deliver the baby the other

Jocelyn 11:34
my hands at some point you put

Scott Benner 11:35
the phone on the belly while you're doing it. Then, yeah,

Jocelyn 11:40
no, but I think I have a unique perspective of being in the room with type one patients, and being a type one mom, kind of having this level of knowledge that most nurses and honestly, a lot of doctors don't have, of like how this disease is managed day to day. And you know, the kind of, I guess, distrust of like diabetes care Yeah, that diabetes experience when they go to the emergency room or, you know, into the hospital or doctor's office or anywhere where they get medical care. Do you

Scott Benner 12:09
have any feeling for why this is, you know, it's obviously not some sort of rule. I didn't do a I didn't do a survey of 10,000 nurses or anything like that, but I've been around this for a long time, seeing people's kids diagnosed. A lot of their moms or dads are nurses, and nurses either handle type one diabetes like one way or the other, but when they don't handle it well, at first it's interesting, the reaction they have to it, almost like somebody told them diabetes was one thing, and now that they see what it is, it's confusing. Does that make sense to you? The Dexcom g7 is sponsoring this episode of The Juicebox Podcast, and it features a lightning fast 30 minute warm up time that's right from the time you put on the Dexcom g7 till the time you're getting readings. 30 minutes. That's pretty great. It also has a 12 hour grace period so you can swap your sensor when it's convenient for you. All that on top of it being small, accurate, incredibly wearable and light. These things, in my opinion, make the Dexcom g7 a no brainer. The Dexcom g7 comes with way more than just this, up to 10 people can follow you. You can use it with type one, type two, or gestational diabetes. It's covered by all sorts of insurances and, uh, this might be the best part. It might be the best part alerts and alarms that are customizable, so that you can be alerted at the levels that make sense to you. Dexcom.com/juicebox, links in the show notes. Links at Juicebox podcast.com, to Dexcom and all the sponsors. When you use my links, you're supporting the production of the podcast and helping to keep it free and plentiful. Let's talk about the tandem Moby insulin pump from today's sponsor tandem diabetes care, their newest algorithm control, iq plus technology and the new tandem Moby pump offer you unique opportunities to have better control. It's the only system with auto Bolus that helps with missed meals and preventing hyperglycemia, the only system with a dedicated sleep setting, and the only system with off or on body wear options. Tandem Moby gives you more discretion, freedom and options for how to manage your diabetes. This is their best algorithm ever, and they'd like you to check it out at tandem diabetes.com/juicebox when you get to my link, you're going to see integrations with Dexcom sensors and a ton of other information that's going to help you learn about tandems, tiny pump that's big on control tandem diabetes.com/juicebox the tandem Moby system is available for people ages two and up who want an automated delivery system to help them sleep better, wake up in range and address high blood sugars with auto bulk. Us,

Jocelyn 15:00
yeah. I think if you've done a lot of type two care, which is, you know, the bulk of it that you see in inpatient, it's hard to, like, comprehend the complete lack of insulin and, like, just the like, I think as soon as you get an idea of what this means as a nurse, you have like, a deeper understanding of like, oh, this is a lot.

Scott Benner 15:22
Yeah, I have to say, Jocelyn, you have awesome energy. Oh, really, do you not think that about yourself? I mean,

Jocelyn 15:29
I think I'm calm. I've been in a lot of really difficult situations, like personally and at work, and I just feel like I try to bring the calm. I try,

Scott Benner 15:38
did something happen to you as a child? Like, I want to know, like, I'm being if you had your first baby at 20, were you married and had a baby at 20?

Jocelyn 15:46
Okay, I've been married 22 years. Okay, so

Scott Benner 15:49
you, like, thoughtfully, got married when you were, like, 19 or 20 years old, right? I don't know

Jocelyn 15:54
if thoughtfully is the word, because, like, we were literally still babies. Like, I look at my 19 and 20 year old children, and I think either we were a lot more adulty than adults are nowadays, or we just really had to grow up quickly, because it was like, just, you know, hit the ground running and had a bunch of kids, and then had to figure out how to, like,

Scott Benner 16:14
take care of them. Yeah, but how do you get that's what I'm trying to figure out. Like, because, listen, I got married young, and you've got, like, five years on me. So like, Were you guys this, this is too personal. You'll stop me. But were you running from something like, did you and your husband, like, have like, bad upbringings? You're like, Let's go off and do this ourselves. Or were you just, like, met each other and we're like, wow, this is awesome, and got swept up in it and fell in love. And that's the thing. Like, how did it work? We were

Jocelyn 16:37
running from something like, we both came from like, I mean, I, I wouldn't say I had the warmest upbringing, like, I It's probably one of time to go into all my, like, weird issues with my mom, but I think, and she's not gonna listen because I haven't talked. But I think I wanted, I wanted warmth in my life. I wanted, like, close family connections. And so when I met my husband, it was just like, like, I felt that warmth and then wanted to just, I always wanted kids, and so I feel so blessed, yeah, to be able to have exactly what I wanted, like I literally, I have the job that I wanted, I have the family that I wanted, and so all the rest is just gravy, you know? I mean,

Scott Benner 17:14
even just going back to school to be a nurse, like, later, that's what I mean about that energy. Like you didn't just go, like, look what I did. I pushed these six kids out. I raised them. They're cool kids. Like, I'm gonna chill for a half a second. You're like, I'm gonna be a nurse. Now, you know what I mean? Like, that's like, a lot of like, you have a lot of good energy. Also, I unfairly know who you are, like, through the like, I can picture you like, I don't know. I somehow know that your husband's like, a just like a big, giant human teddy bear. Like, looks like an awesome guy. No, yes, because somehow I like, I don't normally do this, but your last name so weird, like that. I was like, Who am I talking to? So I went to the Facebook group to look, and then I couldn't find you. And I was like, but her husband appears to be here. And then the funniest thing about your husband's Facebook page is he's not even friends with you. It's awesome. It's like, it's the most guy thing I've ever seen in my life. So funny. He's got no Facebook friends. And I was like, really funny. I'm like, I'll just find her through him. And I'm like, Nope, he's not friended one person on this thing.

Jocelyn 18:17
I am his friend. I have a lot of friends, but I am his friend.

Scott Benner 18:23
He's busy working, paying for 90 people, I know. Yeah, so that's how I like I tripped through his account to yours, which is why I know what he looks like, yeah, yeah. I can envision like, two young, fresh faced people being like, hey, and he looks safe like, he looks like he could take care of it. You know what? I mean? Yeah? Oh, he does, yeah. He always takes care of it. Yeah, no. Like, if this was the Walking Dead, I'd be like, I'm gonna get on his side. Seriously,

Jocelyn 18:45
yeah, yeah, that's my vibe. He could carry us all to safety,

Scott Benner 18:49
exactly the vibe I got from him. So, yeah. So anyway, okay, so you're just looking, you were looking to build warmth and happiness around yourself, and you did it, and then you didn't stop. And then your kid gets diabetes. And then did you just take that same energy and drive and just put it into diabetes? Like, what did you like? How did you handle it? Because you have a nursing background, but not so much with type one. You're doing more labor and delivery stuff. So how does it all meld together? At the

Jocelyn 19:14
time she was diagnosed, I was in med surge nursing because it was COVID, and I just couldn't get in as a new nurse into labor and delivery. So I'm so thankful for it now, because I really, kind of got a really bigger understanding of, like, the whole of, like, hospital, you know, med, surg, nursing and and then I got to do what I love, but so no, I just kind of, when she got diagnosed, I had been suspecting it for a while. I did kind of hit the ground running when we were diagnosed, and I kind of had to, because I didn't have resources. I didn't have, you know, as COVID so even in person, meetings were really not a thing. So I was so thankful to have, like, at least a half understanding of what the disease was and what I would need to, like, what our new life. Was going to look like, but I still looking back on it now, like had so much to learn. And every year, you know, is more I gain more understanding that helps me help her more.

Scott Benner 20:10
Yeah, that's awesome. How did she handle it being diagnosed? She

Jocelyn 20:16
doesn't remember now, you know, like, I think, like, usually five are your earliest memories, so she doesn't remember what life was like before diabetes. She's very independent, like for being our baby. She is like, she does her own she uses an Omnipod, she uses her she does her own. Site changes a lot of times. By the time I'm like, have you done a site change, or it looks like you're low on insulin? She's like, I just did a site change, and she's, you know, she's really getting to be independent with that stuff. She handles it really well. I think initially it was hard, you know, the finger pokes, I think were the hardest part. And then the IVs. She is frequently incentivized. If she doesn't want to do something, or if her blood sugar's high, we have to bring it down. You're like, well, you don't want to go to the hospital, have to get an IV. She remembers that part of the hospital stay, Yeah,

Scott Benner 21:02
but you're saying day to day, she she manages herself pretty much. Are you involved with her insulin decisions or carb counting, or anything like that?

Jocelyn 21:09
I would say 5050, right now, as in, she is very independent with most things, but sometimes she likes to just check out of diabetes. And also, we have had a lot more issues over the last year or two with, I don't want to call it sneaking food, but like, she's not bolusing, yeah, and just kind of like food issues in general, just like, you know, finding lots of wrappers and stuff like that that you know that were, I think she's getting better at bolusing for it so that that part is eliminated. But I do sometimes get concerned with like, are we heading towards a food issue, you know? Like, yeah, not an eating disorder, but just kind of like disordered eating from feeling shame with eating when your sugar's high. So, yeah, that's kind of where we are with things. I mean,

Scott Benner 21:59
she's 10, right? So yeah, how do you talk about that with her? Or have you tried yet?

Jocelyn 22:04
Yeah, actually, I've met with, I can't remember her role is, but someone that was really helpful with talking about, you know, shame related to food. And I guess the frustrating part is that the best way to deal with shame is to kind of not talk about it, because it makes it so much worse. As in, like, did you eat that food? Like, I just found a chip bag, you know, like, Did you Bolus for that? But just kind of, like, treat it like anyone else, like, I guess, not like anyone else. Like my other kids walk by with the, you know, big bag of Doritos, and I'm like, don't eat all of them. We all want some or something like that. But with Abby, it's a little different, trying to, like, make sure that she's taking care of herself, because she wants to be independent, and that we're not going to see a blood sugar of 300 because, you know, she just sat there and ate and didn't Bolus for it. So I guess all that to say we try to, like, destigmatize it a little bit and just go like, Oh, hey. Do you think you know you might need to Bolus a little bit more for that, I don't even go into the, you know, the guilt anymore, and it's been helping.

Scott Benner 23:06
Yeah, it's interesting. I think about this a lot, actually, while I'm making the podcast. So, you know, I've tried to not in the beginning, the beginning of this whole thing. I just had my perspective, and I'm adding everyone else's as I go, but the number of people who would tell me how important that is, that food shaming or eating disorders are prevalent with people with type one, and you have to be careful, and it's just shaped a lot of the way that I've talked about all of this over the years, because you don't know who it's going to be or when it's going to happen. Yeah, yeah,

Jocelyn 23:41
we all choose to eat differently. Like, our families are really different. Like, I would probably cook a lot differently if I wasn't cooking for an army, you know. But, like, I just can't really picture myself, you know, making a big hunk of meat and, like, you know, two vegetables for my teenage boys that are eating us out of house at home, you know. So it's kind of this balance of, like, you know, taking care of her, teaching her to have a good relationship with food, but also, like, feeding the masses here. So yeah,

Scott Benner 24:10
oh yeah, you, I mean, you really are. I've seen people before say, Look, we all just changed, like we ate a little differently, and it was actually, I've heard people say it was good for our family, like we ate healthier or whatever. But I don't know how you pivot eight people and their eating habits and their eating styles on a dime without making them look at your daughter like she's the reason I don't blah, blah, blah. You know what I mean, exactly,

Jocelyn 24:34
exactly, and then, yeah, so I think it's just been more about like, making changes. You know, I'm like, a growth mindset kind of person, like I, you know, I don't rest very much. I just always want to be changing. Like I walk away from each shift. What could I do differently? What could I have done a little better to make that birth, or that, you know, that experience, a little better? So I, I really feel like I kind of bring the same thing to Diabetes Care and just kind of like, re evaluate every once in a while, or. I get a little frustrated, like, okay, what can I do differently? What's the problem here? And we've definitely made some good changes. Like, one of my older kids gripes about, you know, our food is that I cut out cereal a number of years ago because it's basically like eating ice cream for breakfast, and I that's judgy, but I can't get it right. No matter what I do,

Scott Benner 25:21
I just gave it up. It's hard to Bolus for, isn't it, it is, and I

Jocelyn 25:25
maybe people are better at it than me, but I have tried a lot of different kinds. And then we tried the low carb cereals, and no one likes them, and they're expensive, so it was like one of those things that was just easier for me to not do. And I guess one thing about diabetes is it gives you a picture of, like, how our bodies handle food that other people wouldn't have. And so you kind of go, Hmm, maybe that's not good to eat for breakfast.

Scott Benner 25:51
So, yeah, I want to be clear, if you have diabetes or not, there's nothing valuable about like, a box of cereal. I'm not saying that I haven't been like, oh, frosted flakes in my life. You know what? I mean, there's something like that, like, that. Like, I probably just picked the most boring cereal to for everybody, but, yeah, at the same time, like, it's hard to Bolus for. I mean, it's a huge kick of sugar, right? Often, you know, accompanied by milk, which has fat in it, and, you know, will help keep your blood sugar up later. A lot of people struggle in the morning with foot on the floor, or, you know, having lower basal overnight to try to, like, stop lows or whatever. Then they're a little void of insulin in the morning, and then they jump this on top. It's, it's really difficult, but in the end, not eating cereal is good for everybody. It's not just a diabetes thing,

Jocelyn 26:35
right? But I think it's just funny that that's one of my kids, like, frequent like, oh, remember when we used to eat cereal? It's just, it's a treat, I guess, you know, like, if we're in a hotel or something, or, you know, like it's not an everyday thing. It's just something that sometimes they get as a treat. I

Scott Benner 26:52
wonder if it's ease of use.

Jocelyn 26:54
I think that's it. Yeah, have

Scott Benner 26:56
you ever portable cereal and while you're eating it? Thought, I don't want this, but Well, and, you know, I didn't have to crack an egg, and I'm not cleaning a pan, and this is kind of like, yeah. I mean, yeah, no.

Jocelyn 27:07
I mean, I used to, and this is, this is terrible, but, like, I'm a night shift nurse, and when I got home from work for a number of years, like, go to meal before I lay down, was a beer and about three bowls of cereal, and I would just keep pouring cereal until the milk ran out. And just like, that was like, and I think about it now, I'm like, Man, how many carbs was in that before I went to sleep. And, like, it

Scott Benner 27:30
just sat you overnight. Yeah, right. Explain that though, like, 12 hour shift. Are you super hungry? Is your brain tired? Is it like a whole, like, mix of things? Yeah, I

Jocelyn 27:39
mean, and and it's a whole mix of things. I think it's just a relaxation thing. It's just like knowing that you're going to bed, like you're already kind of asking your body to sleep during the day, when most people are awake and the lights are on and, you know, so it's like just kind of that comfort, you know, probably a sugar like, just, you know, like that after Thanksgiving, feeling,

Scott Benner 27:59
I'll put myself into a food coma, and then I'll sleep pretty much. Hey, it worked, so I don't do it anymore. Did you ever pour the beer into the cereal? Just skip the step?

Jocelyn 28:08
No. But, I mean, you do definitely feel like an alcoholic when you know like someone knocks on the door and you're like, all you know, bleary eyed with a beer in your hand at 830 in the morning. So

Scott Benner 28:18
good morning. America's on. You're like, Hey, what's up? Just put that package over there. Thank you. Yeah, you want one mom has had a tough night. Go back a little bit to something you said a few minutes ago about your propensity to think over things and try to make them better. Where does that come from? Do you think? I

Jocelyn 28:40
honestly think that comes from my dad. I think he growing up like, one of his biggest words was initiative. And, you know, just like I have always loved setting a goal, maybe I don't need it, but I end up like, better than where I started. I think that's what helped me get through nursing school. Was like, I can do anything for a short time, you know, like labor, you know, like I can do anything for, you know, this long, yeah. So I kind of try to take that approach with diabetes, because I feel like sometimes it can be really, like daunting, you know, like, I remember that being one of the emotions that really struck me when I first, when Abby was first diagnosed, was thinking, this is forever. This is not, you know, like, this isn't an illness where she's going to get better or she'll just have to take a pill a day. This constant level of thinking is forever, you know.

Scott Benner 29:35
So not just like we just have to get through this, or it's just three years, or it's just six months, but it's right, yeah, it's forever and ever. No, I know, yeah, it sucks, doesn't it? No, it

Jocelyn 29:45
does. And then, you know, every year, like, we're definitely, like, in the throes of pre puberty, like with the huge insulin needs and the huge growth that she's done over the last couple of years, that's like, every couple of months, there's some new variable to. Get over. We'll figure out how to meet. Oh,

Scott Benner 30:02
yeah, that's not gonna stop for a while. I mean, I'll let you know when it stops. Like somebody said to me the other day, like, when does it get easier being a parent? I was like, I don't know. I'll let you know when it happens. Yeah, really, I have no idea diabetes is gonna be, from your perspective, I don't think it's ever that's not gonna stop, right? And for her, who knows, right? Like, her stuff's gonna change and change and change. She's gonna either go away to school or get a job, and then it's gonna change again. And I don't know that people don't settle into their life with diabetes when they're diagnosed younger, any differently than they settle into their real life. Like, 2627 28 like, in that age when people start to, like, you know what I mean, like, political Not you. You were obviously an adult when you were 15. You know, for most people like you don't really settle into yourself until you're mid to late 20s. I think,

Jocelyn 30:49
no, I agree. And I think, you know, even though we were, like, married and had kids like, I still feel like we were growing up for a long time after we were married. Oh, sure.

Scott Benner 30:58
Do you guys make up a lot of your differences, or are you very similar, your husband and yourself? No,

Jocelyn 31:04
we're very different. But you know how it is when you've been with someone for a really long time, like you kind of meet in the middle, like, whether that's spending habits or just the way that you like approach different situations, we are very much opposite. Opposites attract. And then, you know, there's that whole oldest, youngest thing. He's the youngest. I'm the oldest, you know, that kind

Scott Benner 31:22
of thing, yeah, yeah. I'm dying to know, because of the example you reach for, what did he buy that? You were like, Oh, God, what happened?

Jocelyn 31:28
Oh, well, yeah, he's, he always been big into buying cars. And, you know, we'd have a lot of discussions when we were first married about, like, oh, you know, like, we don't have a lot of money. He's gonna buy this car, but it's gonna be great, and then he can re sell it, you know, like, so done that a lot, and it got to the point where, I don't know, maybe seven or eight years ago, he just came home with a new truck, and he's like, I just skipped the fighting and bought the truck. And I was like, all right. And I was like, okay, that's where we are, all right.

Scott Benner 31:59
So you know how to be happy

Jocelyn 32:02
skip the middle.

Scott Benner 32:05
I've said that to my wife before, not about a vehicle, but I've been like, can we just skip this part and go back to the part where it's not going to be like this anymore, because it's going to happen. You know what? I mean? Yeah.

Jocelyn 32:16
Well, sometimes the fights are so predictable. You're like, Okay, I know I feel like this, and you feel like this. And so he's just, like, I just skipped it. I just bought the truck. Yep, yeah, my

Scott Benner 32:27
wife's the opposite with cars. She'll be very supportive of getting a car, and then later, like, hold it over my head. Later, like, it a little bit because, like, I own a car. Like, I don't have more than one car, but, yeah, I do switch cars probably more frequently than some people do not, like, you know, yearly, or anything like that. But I probably don't have a car more than, like, five years. And then I'll be like, Hey, I was really thinking about this. And I'm like, you know, I have some equity in my car. And I'm like, if I can, I can sell it and make some money. And, like, it'll offset the next thing. And, you know, blah, blah, blah. And she's always like, Oh yeah, you know, you work really hard. You should be like, she says all the things. Like, it's like a hallmark show, but kindness she gives me when I say this. And then, like, six months later, I don't know what happened, it'll be like, the most banal thing, like, you don't even I'll be like, Hey, how come we have all these, like, I don't know, loaves of bread. Do we really need all these? And she'll be like, did you really did you really need that car? And I'm like, Whoa, how long you've been

Jocelyn 33:28
sitting on that? No, it's, yeah, it's true. I'm not like, I guess I appreciate that. He just like, anticipated what would happen. And like, you know, I was so busy at the time. It was like, All right, well, whatever you you do, you, you pay for it. You know, like, Jocelyn,

Scott Benner 33:42
I have a, I mean, you've been married, I think the length of time, 20 years, right? More than 20 years. I think you come to the conclusion, like, if neither of us is have left yet, we're not going to, unless one of us, like, literally does something like, reprehensible, or I come home one day and I'm like, is that you on the news? Like, you know what I mean? Like, unless it's something like that, you're like, This is fine. I'm good with this. Yeah, yeah.

Jocelyn 34:05
No, I would, I would have found out about it by now. Like, if we don't like each other by now, you know, I think it is, you know, but we are at the point in our lives where, you know, most of our friends got married young, and then, you know, some of them we've lost track with. When you haven't heard from a couple for a while, it's 5050, on whether or not they're divorced at this point. You know, like, yeah, that's where, like, I think, I think you appreciate it's just kind of thankful for still liking each other.

Scott Benner 34:35
Listen, as we were younger and growing up, and people would get divorced, I'd be like, yeah, yeah. Kelly, be like, are you? Are you happy? They got worse? I'm like, No, not at all. I was like, but yeah, statistically speaking, we're not all going to get divorced, so the more of them that it happens, it's

Jocelyn 34:49
like, the more probability down for you. Our numbers get better. We made it. We're still here. Yeah,

Scott Benner 34:59
I think my. Wife's too stubborn, or she would have left. She she would have been like, 1015 years ago. She would have been like, you know what? That's enough of this. But instead, she's like, I'm not losing this. I think she's in a fight with me right now to see who can live longer. That's what I

Jocelyn 35:12
think is happening at the moment. Yeah, statistically, women do live longer than Oh no,

Scott Benner 35:16
I know. Yeah. If I'm 87 and she's 82 and I dropped dead, and she only lives another year. It'll be the happiest year of her life. She'll be like, I outlasted that son of a bitch.

Jocelyn 35:26
She's like, right? She's like, he did well. He had a good run, by the way. Anyway, the way

Scott Benner 35:30
you use the purchase example, I use the bread example. My bread example is absolutely real. My wife, for some reason, needs so many bread options, but then really doesn't use them. Like, I don't understand. She likes to have like, three different bread options in the house, and then a week and a half later, I'm like, all the time. I'm like, Yeah, I'm like, this breads all moldy. And she's like, Yeah, I know. Like, it's like, her one, like, weird thing. So funny. Some people have a bread drawer. We have a bread room. So what's the most challenging thing, raising six kids? Everything

Jocelyn 36:04
was pretty much just diapers and, like, homeschooling, and, you know, like I was just home with them for 10 years, and that was kind of like, I really, like, cherish that 10 years, because I've been working since then. And I love my job, I love what I do, but, you know, I think so there was that decade of like that was challenging. Just everybody was healthy, but there was just so many diapers, so many, you know, babies, and like, just the time constraints and the sleep deprivation. And then this past 10 years has been a decade of like, health struggles and mental health struggles for teenagers, and then, you know, for Abby's diagnosis, and then right after Abby's diagnosis, our oldest son had open heart surgery at the age of 15, so that was really something unexpected and just kind of meeting that need. So I think sometimes I feel like being an ambitious an ambitious person. I feel limited by like, oh, I would, you know, I would work that extra shift. I would get that, you know, like, different job that I would really love to do. And I don't want to say that I'm, like, I guess, limited by my family, but just trying to fit in all these good things and and not let you know, obviously, my first role is as a mom, and that's, like, the most important thing, but just trying to, like, feel personally fulfilled and also take care of all these kids with all their different things that they need. Do you think

Scott Benner 37:29
if there were fewer kids, would it have felt the same? Or is it not about the amount of them? It's about the responsibility? I

Jocelyn 37:37
think it's the length of time that we've been parenting that's feeling like, I mean, I think it gives us understanding, you know, like we're much different parents to our youngest kids than we were to our oldest kids, because we've learned so much and been broken by different experiences and kind of had to overcome and then would never parent the same way Again going forward. I mean, the number is definitely challenging, but as they get older and they move on, it's more like the sounds cheesy, but like being a mom is like watching your heart just walk around on the earth like and you're just kind of watching it get broken, and, you know, wanting to protect it. And they need to learn these lessons. And I almost think, and I tell my patients this, like, the babies are are really the easy part, and the teenagers are the challenge. So

Scott Benner 38:28
I can't tell you, like, I just interviewed a woman the other day who had a 16 month old, and I felt bad, but I said to her, I'm like, You know what I've learned about being a parent, you actually can never do the right thing, because no matter what you do, someone else sees it differently totally. And so you can, you know, make the best decision that you can dream up and do these things in the way that you think are, you know, the most supportive and wonderful and everything. And I think people would generally agree that, like, I'm a thoughtful parent, and yet, like, it doesn't really matter, because when you're done, it turns out one person in the group is like, I did that's not how it made me feel. And you're like, what or like, I noticed too. Sometimes, like, when you have to make difficult decisions as a parent, when you look at it retrospectively years later, sometimes the reasons you had to make the decision are forgotten, and then it's just like, Well, you did this. I'm like, No, I didn't do that. Like, I had to do that because this happened, and, like, I don't remember that part. And you're like, Oh, come on,

Jocelyn 39:27
right, well, and then we lose perspective, you know, like, well, two things are our kids, you know, are all we're raised in the same house, all, some of them are, like, a year apart, and they all remember things differently, or they don't remember things that the other one does, or they just have a completely different reaction to the same kind of parenting. Can't parent them all the same. Like, they're all such different temperaments, like six combination of the same people, they're all so different. And I love that about them, but it's definitely like, I think maybe that's what makes having six versus two or three different as I've got to figure. Out how all of them are going to handle the challenges that they're presented with. You know, also, just that a lot of parenting is just reactions, right? You know, like, you're like, okay, they did this, and now what are you going to do with this? Now, you know, like, I think, you know, think about that with, like, just having a new baby in the hospital, you know, like, okay, the baby's crying. You got to figure out what's wrong with it. You gotta, like, okay, are they hungry? Do they need to be swaddled? Are they, you know, like meeting these needs? That's your first experience with your first kid. Of like, okay, they're doing this now. What do I do? Yeah, you know. And as they get to be teenagers, it gets so much more complicated, because the needs aren't simple, and they're not physical. They're like, your presence, and then also, like, you're, well, you're gonna have to have to deal with that consequence, and so I have found that very challenging to grow into as a mom, for sure.

Scott Benner 40:47
The reason I asked is because I want to know about the impact of diabetes on the other five kids. Because I would have told you, the entire time Arden was growing up, the entire time my kids were growing up, the coal really doesn't seem that impacted by Arden's diabetes, and we spend a ton of time together, like, and Cole and I really did, like, spend a ton of time together, right? But now in present day, when we sit and talk about it, he felt like she was more important. And he's even thoughtful enough to separate the diabetes from it. Like, if he talks about it now, he'll, he'll he'll say, right to art and like, I don't mean you. I mean like, we stopped a lot for diabetes, or we did things for diabetes or whatever. And Arden will be like, Well, that wasn't my decision. And he said it's no, like, I'm not, like, I'm not blaming you for it. That's how it felt to me when I was a kid. And I would say, but Cole, like you and I would be at baseball practice, like, multiple nights a week and on the weekends, and we'd go on trips. I'm like, you and I have spent more time together than most fathers and sons spend together. But that's not the part you remember. Like, he doesn't not remember that. I want to be clear, but like, yeah, what? When you ask him about diabetes, he doesn't say, oh, you know what? It was a lot, but it was offset lovely by the time we spent together. Like, it doesn't, it doesn't feel like that. You know what I mean. So while you're as a parent, right? No, no, it's okay, because we're doing all these offsetting things, it doesn't actually get offset. Yeah, you know what I mean. So I think no matter what you do and how well intended and even how well you execute your plan, it's not gonna cover for that feeling of one of them got more attention from my parents than the other well,

Jocelyn 42:23
and then, you know, I mean, with Arden two buck, compounded by the fact that she's the baby, you know, and I definitely have that, like, oh my little, you know, like, I, I'm not gonna have any more babies. This is my, you know, like, kind of, and just coming at it with a different, like, more relaxed level than, like, you know, the things that would have really freaked me out, or I would have, like, done a lot of, like, you know, timeouts for with my first I'm like, Yeah, whatever. She'll figure it out, you know, because she's my youngest, and I realized that it's just, like, with the car purchase with my husband, like, it's not worth the struggle in the middle, I got to pick my battles, you know. Yeah,

Scott Benner 42:55
it takes you a while to figure out the juice isn't worth the squeeze. Yeah,

Jocelyn 42:59
exactly. And so, you know, Abby has the benefit of, like, being the at the bottom of that. But I think, you know, in general, like my oldest actually was huge with helping when Abby was first diagnosed. I mean, I, you know, having just moved and just to get health insurance, had to go to work the first week that Abby was home from the hospital and diagnosed. And so we would FaceTime insulin doses when the meal would come up, and I was in orientation, and we just, you know, and she's, she was 15 at the time, and, you know, like, we had, our family had no medical experience at all. So this was like, I mean, she just took it on. And she's, you know, I was so thankful for her. I think it put a lot on her, which I kind of now look back and think, I, you know, but you that's the thing. What could you have done differently, though? No, and that's the thing. Like my husband, I talk about this a lot, like, you lose perspective in the rear view mirror of the difficulties of what it was like at that time, like, you know. So we made the best with what we had. We didn't have anybody else that was gonna, like, come over the house and give her, you know, insulin. And she was, you know, she didn't have a Dexcom at that point, so we were, you know, finger pokes and guesstimating and figuring things out and and the other kids have done amazing too. I mean, I will say, like, as far as you know, if we're gonna leave her at the house with our bigger kids, they're not gonna watch her sugars. So we're really still always on duty, but we can call them and say, Can you give her a juice? Can you tell her to Bolus for two more units because she's trending high or, you know, so they're, they're good for that, but they're on call. They're not, like, actively managing,

Scott Benner 44:32
you know, it's funny, the way you put that, regarding hindsight, it almost made me feel the way I feel listening to the to social media around the fires right now in California, right where, like, there's people are like, You know what they should have done? And you know, why did they do? I'm like, you first of all, you don't know what you're talking about, right, right? But I'm certain you don't know what you're talking about, yeah. But you know, at the same time, like, it's easy to step out of a situation, see it more big picture, you're not actually feeling it. You're not having. To live through it. It's not on your ass if it goes wrong. And to say, Oh, this should have went there, and that should have went there, and you should have done this like this, and don't say that. Say this. It's super easy in hindsight, really, in the middle of it, you're doing your best, but making it up as you go along. We just shared, I mean, I'm old. I'm like, I'm gonna be 54 this summer. Oh, that's not all. Oh, well, you get to 54 and you tell me and my wife's birthday is tomorrow. Like, you know what I mean? Like, my son's gonna be 25 soon. Arden is gonna be 21 soon. And we still found ourselves telling them the other day, like, listen, we don't know what we're doing. I need you to understand. Like, I am just a well intended, reasonably intelligent person who loves you, who is getting thrown into situations every 15 minutes. And I am saying the best thing that comes to my mind. You know what I mean? Like, there's no book somewhere, and I didn't read out of it correctly. In case you're wondering, no

Jocelyn 45:56
but where your like gut reaction came from, was your experience? Was that your life taught you. So that's what I'm saying. Like with diabetes and with parenting, is like, you know, we do what we know. Like, you know, you work with, you try to do your best with what you know, and then when you know better, you do better. And that's the whole thing. Is like, Okay, the last time she ate that, you know, that sandwich, this happened, and now I'm gonna, you know, I'm gonna Bolus more for it like that came from my experience. So you grow every year with diabetes and every year as a parent, and you don't get it right. And I'm sure I'm doing things wrong with Abby that I will later look back on and be like, Man, I really was kind of lazy with that, and now she's doing this, and I should have been more like I was for my first kid. And it's all perspective. Of

Scott Benner 46:37
course, it's super interesting. Everybody who gets thrown into a situation they don't understand, which is everybody would tell you later, hey, look, I did my best, you know, and I'm gonna try to, you know, I'll refocus, I'll take what I learned and I moved on. But when you judge another person, you're always like, Hey, why didn't you do it like this? You're like, Oh my God. And especially with kids, because they really do have an expectation that you know what you're doing,

Jocelyn 47:00
yeah, and you have to, I mean, that's, it's the same thing with, like, you know, being a nurse or bringing in doctors, like, you know, I think we know a lot no longer been practicing, you know, hopefully you're learning from all your different patients, and you have this, like, safe level of knowledge. But like, I don't know what's gonna happen, yeah, I don't know if, like, your baby could be born in five minutes and come out, you know, the old fashioned way, or it could, you know, come out like tomorrow or the next day, because that's how it works. You know, it's I have some expectations from my experience, but I don't know when that's gonna happen.

Scott Benner 47:29
It sounds very true, which is three, really, is, see, do you think your other kids are harboring those feelings or will talk about them later in life like they have to, right? I mean, I don't think you can mitigate them, but that's troubling just to me, because people ask me all the time, like, how can I do this thing with diabetes and not make it fall on my other kids? And I have to tell you, from my perspective, everything that happens to you changes you. Yeah, and it changes your course. You don't have to like it. You didn't have to want it, but it's here now, right? Justin, if you bought a round instead of a rectangular dining room table, like, some weird way, your life would be different. Like, do you know what I mean? Yeah, like, you know, somebody would, you know, walk into the corner of the table and hit their hip and it would be bruised for three days. Like, that would or wouldn't happen. Like, every little thing you do changes your course, and diabetes changes your course, and it does it for everybody. There's just nothing you can do about it. It changed my dog's life. Like, no kidding, like we used to be. We were back then, more attentive dog owners than we were when Arden got diagnosed. Like, that dog was probably like, hey, where the hell did those people go? Right?

Jocelyn 48:36
Yeah. Am I ever gonna get walked? Yeah, no kidding. You know what? I mean? Yeah, yeah. No. It definitely changes. I think, I think my girls, would I expect that they would have more of an effect from it, just because of, like, birth order, like my oldest kind of taking on that role, right? That she really did really well with, but just kind of having that extra burden of, like, I'm not just a teenager, but I'm also, like, caring about my little sister and managing those decisions that most kids don't have to think about, especially for another person. And then also, my fifth is a is a girl, and she is 13, and so like, the closest in age to Abby and feels, I think, more than the boys, who are kind of like independent sports and doing their own thing, more of the like, Hey, we're going to, you know, the store. Can we stop at Starbucks? And I don't say it, but I'm thinking, you know, where's our sugar at? Is this a good idea? Can Do I have time to Bolus for it, and then I'm, you know, rushing home after and more things than that, like, she, she's obviously, the lack of cereal is a huge issue.

Scott Benner 49:37
That's the whole problem in your house. It's a whole thing.

Jocelyn 49:40
It's really desperate here. Yeah. So I think she will probably say that that affected her more than anyone. Just being the closest in birth order and in the house the longest with her, do they treat her any differently? I think so. I think they're, they're all like, pretty good older siblings, like the right amount of like sibling. Bullying and messing around, and also like, hey, yeah, you know, why are you so grumpy, that kind of thing. I don't think they treat her any differently. I think there's just an extra consideration for, like, with anybody that's diabetic, like, you know what's going on with that? But no, they're, they're great siblings to her. She's very lucky on

Scott Benner 50:16
the parenting front. Do you share my like, one of my like, last parenting concerns is that I want my kids to be friendly as adults. Yeah, I don't know if I need them. Like, I mean, it would be lovely. I don't know if I need them at each other's house on Christmas morning or not. Like, you know what I mean? Like, I'm not sure. Like, but I don't I want them to be, like, friendly and talking and connected and stuff like that. Yeah,

Jocelyn 50:39
totally. Because I, I feel like on a different level, both me, my husband, siblings are not always like that. You know, for myself, my siblings and I are separated by distance. We all live across the country. We very much enjoy being together, but, you know, we just are separated by, you know, lives and we just can't get together that often. Then my husband siblings are very much separated by like difficulties in the past, and like things that happened and things people said, and now they don't talk to each other, and I think that would break my heart. Yeah, I can't make that not happen. I mean, I tried to, like, foster some togetherness and like being close and friendly, but I think that's kind of like, once they're adults, it's outside of your control, really. I know.

Scott Benner 51:20
See, your kids are still some of them are still young. Still young, but of all the things that I miss, like, a parenting tool, that I miss is when they were younger, and you could just, like, sort of, if you needed to dominate the conversation, just go, look, listen, I know you don't know why, but it doesn't matter. We're doing this. This is why. Like, it'll help. Like, and then they do it, and things get better. And you're like, I wish I got, like, one of those a year now that they're older, like, where I could just go, no one's allowed to have their own thoughts. Just

Jocelyn 51:47
listen to me for a minute, pretend like you're listening. Yeah, I think. And that's the part about like, the babies versus teenagers and young adults and having adult kids, is that, like, that challenge of like, I can't just put you in in the crib, and make you sit still for a minute, or put you in timeout. You know, I have to, like, kind of like, tell you what I think you should do, yeah, and then these are the consequences. And then this is the big experiment. What are you going to do, and what's going to happen to you after? And it's, oh, it's a daunting task, watching it.

Scott Benner 52:15
The one thing that stuns me, I mean, I understand it, but it still throws me off is that when your parent has some level of proficiency with something and you still ignore them on that thing, like, it would be like, if you had, like, an opinion about a medical thing, and your kids are like, she doesn't know what she's talking about, you'd be like, I'm a nurse. My wife is really matter what she does, but my wife is extraordinary at what she does, right? And when something comes up in the house that literally leans into her professional strength, people are like, I don't know if she knows. And I'm like, she runs a fairly large organization. I was like, I'm like, I think she really does know, yeah. Or even sometimes I say something like, you're an idiot. I'm like, you know, a lot of people on the internet don't think that yeah, because that's not like, you know, helpful to anybody. Nobody gives a shit. You know, right, right? Yeah,

Jocelyn 53:03
yeah. It's cool to see people in their element. Like, when you're just with home, at home with them all the time, and you kind of like, see them doing something, you're like, wow, they really are good at that. Anyone

Scott Benner 53:13
who's ever said to me, I bet Arden feels so lucky that you're her dad around diabetes, I think, Oh, you don't have kids. Like, there's no there's no way anyone who's ever said that to me has children and knows that feeling. I think it's usually the people who say that are usually adults whose parents weren't very involved, yeah, because their perspective is different. They're like, God, I would have done anything to have used my parent like around my diabetes. And I, if I was being honest, if I had time, I'd respond back and go, You say that now, but you always want the thing you don't have. So, right? Yeah, that's not how it works. You don't go, Oh, I'm so lucky I had this thing. You go, oh, you know what I didn't have? And, you know, right? You

Jocelyn 53:55
always want something different. And that's where, like, we parent differently because of our experiences, you know, like, Okay, I didn't grow up with, like, a warm household, so I really want, like, you know, hella kids up in here and just kind of, really have a warm, crazy, chaotic household,

Scott Benner 54:10
yeah, well, you got it good for you, yeah, any of those kids grown to the size of your husband? No,

Jocelyn 54:15
no, I thought the boys would be bigger. They, I mean, they're all, you know, about six feet. They're all, all the boys are three, about three years apart, like, total, like, they're all there came really quickly. They're all about six feet, but not like the massive like, I can carry you to safety.

Scott Benner 54:32
Yes, for people listening who don't know what your husband looks like, imagine she just described her sons as not big. They're only six feet tall.

Jocelyn 54:40
Well, coming from where I'm coming from, and I am very quickly becoming the shortest person in this house, like all my girls are probably going to be about five seven. I mean, Abby is at 10 years old. Is five, five. Wow. So she is my girls have, and so that's another thing, like with managing diabetes, is, I know. Experience with my older girls who didn't have diabetes, that they will get to be their adult size by the time they're about 11, and then they're done. So they're, you know, the tallest kid in the class, and everybody's like, she's only that age. And you're like, yep, yep, yep, you know. And she's still in her mind, and the way she's developing is still a very normal, like, 10 year old. She's playing with dolls, she's playing with Barbie she's doing very age appropriate things, but she's my size,

Scott Benner 55:24
yeah. So do you find people treat them like they're older when that happens? Absolutely all that happened to my niece, who got tall, really young, and then everybody wanted to, like, talk to her like she was 18, yeah.

Jocelyn 55:35
And it's kind of like I even have to take a step back, or I have to remind myself that, like people who have normal sized children, or like small children. I'm like, look at that little baby just talking like that, you know? Because I am used to having really big kids. Jocelyn

Scott Benner 55:49
is like, looking at a nine year old going like, that sweet child. I can't believe it can talk.

Jocelyn 55:56
I know it's so much shorter than I am. Oh, my

Scott Benner 55:59
god, yeah. What are we not talking about that we should have, by the way, we missed anything? Yeah, I

Jocelyn 56:05
think I wanted to talk a little bit about the perspective of, like, I know when you did your I can't remember what it was called off the top of my head, but like, talking to healthcare professionals and

Scott Benner 56:15
the Grand Rounds, yeah, no, the voices were disguised. Oh, cold wind, yeah,

Jocelyn 56:22
cold wind, I was going with, like, dark horse. I don't know cold wind, so I think, I guess I just wanted to kind of, like, be some middle ground. I just was talking about, like that diabetes is so and we know this. I know we know this, but, like, diabetes is so completely different from anything else that a nurse on a floor in the emergency room comes into contact with that, I think there's this misunderstanding, and just kind of like huge knowledge gap with how diabetes manage their blood sugars, how type ones manage their blood sugars on a day to day basis, where I try to give perspective in my role and In the ways that I'm able to teach people of when someone comes in, I don't like the wording, poorly controlled or poorly managed, or especially in the context of, like, pregnant women coming in with huge insulin needs and insulin resistance at the end of pregnancy, you know, it just kind of creates this like, well, you're not doing a good job of this, because your blood sugar is such and such, we're just going to take it over from here, like, on labor and delivery. If you have two blood sugars over 140 as a type one, their policy is usually to, like, we're just going to take you off your pump and we're going to put you on an insulin drip. And it's not often, but just kind of, like trying to bridge the gap and create some understanding with, like, what a type one has to do to, like, maintain a healthy pregnancy, the level of knowledge that they've had to amass to take care of themselves, in general, in their life. And just kind of, like, coming at it from a like, hey, you've been doing a really great job. And I think, what do you think we can do to take care of you, you know, and or your baby as a team, not like, a hey, we're just gonna take over this from here. Yeah, because insulin pumps, like, you know, the systems that we have now are amazing, and I think they work so much better than an insulin drip would do. They're only checking your blood sugar every hour and then changing the dosing. So I feel like there's such a huge it's hard, you know, like I talked to a type one patient who was an adult man on a med search for the other day because I was in the room for whatever. And, you know, he was talking about how he, you know, felt like he couldn't refuse something when he came in, you know, like they wanted to put him on a different dose. And he felt like that's not right for me. I know my body, but I feel like I'm being a bad patient, or I'm, you know, refusing care. And we're just kind of talking about, like, not medical advice, but just how, like anyone should feel, like coming into completely unrelated sickness, that it's okay for you to say, I'm not going to do that. This is what works for my body. You know that I've, I've been doing this a long time. I've kind of been managing my own self. Can we work together here? Not let me just take over this for you? Right?

Scott Benner 59:08
Yeah? Because you're not going to do a good job, and then I'm going to sit here feeling bad that I let you do it and not feel well. Body wise, you're going

Jocelyn 59:18
to be scratching your heads why my blood sugar is 300 tomorrow morning, like, maybe we should change the lantern or, you know, let them do what they've been doing and work on a, you know, work on that resolution together. But I guess, also just creating an understanding for, like, how it's not that we don't want to understand as nurses and doctors. It's just like, it's not often that we come in contact with it. I agree

Scott Benner 59:43
with you. You're meeting people who you have this expectation of because of the job they have, but they don't have the expertise that they need to give you what you deserve. Honestly, like sometimes you meet people who just know what they're doing for whatever reason, right? But you run into a hospital that. The hospital place with the health people and, like, you don't expect to go in there and go, Hey, health people help me. And they go, I don't know how to do this. You're like, wait. Well, then what the hell? Right? I always think the same thing. It's like, it's like, going to get new tires, and then saying to the guy, like, you have to put the lug nuts back on. He goes, Oh, I didn't know, right? Where's your level of confidence now at this point, because that seems so obvious and elementary to the idea. And you start telling people like, I don't know, they take type ones off of, you know, off their pumps, and then they come in with a big tray of food, and they say, Okay, eat this. We'll Bolus when you're done. And they haven't checked your blood sugar for two hours. And people are like, No, you you can't do that. And then it turns into, well, that's our protocol. And then there you go, like, it's just, you're just off and running. Then they're using their type two protocol on a type one patient. You realize that's what's happening. And you go, Oh, my God, my life is in the hands of somebody who doesn't even minimally understand how I administer my insulin well.

Jocelyn 1:00:57
And that's, that's what I'm saying. It's like, I think getting to be okay with like I'm not being a bad patient. Or it's not that I'm not accepting medical care, but if I am not sitting in front of an endocrinologist who understands like my daily needs, then I have to bring that piece of the puzzle and be okay with like I'm not going to do that. Or, you know, that's not the best thing for me, and I will, you know, I will work with you, and you can give me that IV antibiotics, but I'm gonna, whatever it is, manage my sugars, you know, like, it's your body, you know, and you need to come into it with that, like, understanding of like, being okay with doing your thing. Take care of yourself, having

Scott Benner 1:01:33
said that, that series. I mean, people told stories that I was like, Oh God, really, oh for sure. Yeah, absolutely. Like, oh my God. All right. I

Jocelyn 1:01:40
think I have had really good experiences with, you know, whether you know, like school nurses and like our doctors, but you do feel like you're alone, like, and you're not alone, but you're, you're doing your thing, and you have to kind of walk into it with your own, like, little bit of the attitude, like a little chip on your shoulder, like, Okay, I have this going. I can say no, you know, like, because there's this like, power thing that happens sometimes in the hospital where patients feel like they can't say no. And I hate that. It's your body.

Scott Benner 1:02:10
Yeah, no, I agree. Yeah. I mean, imagine where you would be today if you and I wouldn't want this to happen, obviously, but if you had to go into another ER with one of your other kids, you're like, Hey, I'm here. My kid's blood sugar's 441 and if the person at the desk said, what did they eat today, I guarantee you would have react differently today than you did five years ago. Probably like, yeah,

Jocelyn 1:02:26
like, I probably would say, like, she had five ice creams. So what are you gonna do

Scott Benner 1:02:31
with that? Yeah, that's right, yeah, no, we've been eating for six days straight. We haven't stopped, right? Bowls of cereal all around. Yep, she still has type one diabetes. You know, like, your perspective has changed now. Like, back then, you were probably like, oh, that's silly. I'll just, you know, but I'll, I'll be polite, like, and I'm trying to think of those type ones in the hospital as adults that this isn't their first rodeo, and then it starts happening again, and it's just got to be so incredibly frustrating, you know, oh

Jocelyn 1:02:55
yeah, no. And I felt like that was eye opening. I think everything, like we've been talking about, like, everything changes your perspective. So like, listening to the that series and kind of hearing different people's perspectives of being in the hospital, was like, oh, man, I really want to change that. And I really do try, in my role, I'm able to help with diabetes care and education in the hospital and just come at it from like this, you know, kind of like creating understanding. Yeah,

Scott Benner 1:03:18
it's a great message, honestly, and you do have to go, I hate, see, I hate when people say you have to advocate for yourself, because I don't know what that means. You know what I mean? Like, I know I know what it means, but I don't think people know what it means until you get into the situation and recognize that what it means is a lot of people in this healthcare system might not understand what's best for me, and I have to tell them, well, and

Jocelyn 1:03:38
what other medication do we? Like, there is no other medication that you adjust daily. It's like, if your heart rate was irregular and you had to every five minutes, you're like, Okay, it's going like, 112 now that's a little high. I'm gonna give myself a little bit more medicine. Just to create, to sustain life. You had to keep managing this heart medication. Nobody has that understanding. Like, maybe the ICU, a little bit, maybe Pitocin and labor and delivery, but this like level of knowledge that you've built over your life to survive is not just handed over to someone, right?

Scott Benner 1:04:10
Yeah, no, I once said to somebody, try to imagine if you had to thoughtfully breathe in and breathe out every time. That's what diabetes feels like to me. Yeah, like, every five minutes, if I just spent my life going inhale, exhale, inhale, yeah, exhale, like, that's how it sometimes. I mean, it doesn't feel like that to me anymore, but back then it did, yeah, it definitely

Jocelyn 1:04:35
does more in the beginning, and then, you know, and then you have periods where you're really aware of it, and it creates change, and that's good. And then you kind of go back to like, Okay, this is like, in the background, and we're just gonna be in the middle of sports season. And, you know,

Scott Benner 1:04:48
I know I'm with you, trust me, I've been at this a fair amount of time now, yeah,

Jocelyn 1:04:51
you have, and we've all gained from your experience. We were gonna say something nice

Scott Benner 1:04:56
at the end. I wouldn't talk to every Hold on What was that? Yeah, because the podcast. Been helpful? Totally,

Jocelyn 1:05:01
yeah, actually, a friend that is one of our good diabetes friends now told me about it at camp, and we were dropping our girls off at camp, and we had just met, and she was like, Oh, do you listen to the Juicebox? And I was like, No, what's that? And like, I, you know, dived hard, and all the episodes initially, and then have just been, you know, like always learning something. So I actually, whenever I am blessed to go into a new, newly diagnosed child or anybody at the hospital, I'm always like, Oh, by the way, not medical advice, but please, you know, well,

Scott Benner 1:05:34
thank you. Check up with this podcast. I appreciate that, because a lot of my life is spent trying to keep the podcast being a podcast, and you guys all helping. Really, honestly, I'm probably not having much impact on it at all. Like, it's everybody out there who's really helping, keeping it going. So thank you. I really, yeah, thank you. All right, well, I'm gonna let you go. I think I'm gonna call this episode tired uterus. And,

Jocelyn 1:05:58
yeah, do you know that I have heard that before, like, when I was having my last baby, it's just taken a long time, and the nurse was like, I think your uterus is just tired. That works. You got the gist happy to assume

Scott Benner 1:06:10
that at the end of the birth it was like, I'm going to come out too, because I'm afraid she's going to do this again.

Jocelyn 1:06:15
Might as well I was done.

Scott Benner 1:06:19
When did you run out of baby names. Like, be honest. Like, what kid were you just, like, I don't know, pick one like, by the third one, the fourth one. Were you like? How does like? Did that ever happen? No, I

Jocelyn 1:06:31
really honestly think if they hadn't all started to break, I would have had like, two more, you know. But I think by the time we got to our sixth, it was like, we started kind of getting into these, like, health issues where, like, Oh, they're all breaking gotta, you know, they're all falling apart. We gotta maybe limit this a little bit and kind of figure out what to

Scott Benner 1:06:50
do with these ones. I just figured you're like, you have, like, probably great baby names. And by the fourth one, you're like, I don't know you wanna call this

Jocelyn 1:06:57
one Bob. No, I still think I still see, you know, babies all the time at work. I'm like, Oh, I love that name. I would have used that if we had another one. So

Scott Benner 1:07:04
last we actually did this thing last night where we were talking about names, and my wife was like, oh, calling Cole. Like, I wanted to call you Nicholas, and dad wanted to call you Cole. And then we started talking about other names were on the list, and she started rattling them off, and he's like, those are bad names. And I was like, I know I looked at him. I said, that's why I got him off the list for you, buddy. Don't worry about it. That's so funny, but it's interesting to hear back and people say, like, I almost called you this, or like, I really want to call I have to figure out what it is. But Kelly has this really, like, awkward, like, not awkward, just different female name that she liked as a little girl, and then she wanted to call a daughter that she didn't end up calling her, and Arden, one day, said the same name, and it hadn't been saved yet without knowing that. Yeah, yeah. It was really different. Arden

Jocelyn 1:07:53
was on my list. I love that name, so good choice. Oh,

Scott Benner 1:07:55
thank you. Before you knew my daughter's name, it was on your list. Yeah, yeah,

Jocelyn 1:07:59
all my girls are a name, so I just that was definitely on my list. I loved it. Thank

Scott Benner 1:08:03
you. I appreciate that. That's awesome. I picked that one too. Yeah, all right, I'm gonna hold on one second for me. Okay, okay, thanks.

Today's episode of The Juicebox Podcast was sponsored by the new tandem Moby system and control iq plus technology. Learn more and get started today at tandem diabetes.com/juicebox check it out. Dexcom sponsored this episode of The Juicebox Podcast. Learn more about the Dexcom g7 at my link. Dexcom.com/juicebox if you're looking for community around type one diabetes, check out the Juicebox Podcast. Private Facebook group. Juicebox Podcast, type one diabetes, but everybody is welcome. Type one, type two, gestational loved ones. It doesn't matter to me if you're impacted by diabetes and you're looking for support, comfort or community. Check out Juicebox Podcast. Type one diabetes on Facebook. Okay, well, here we are at the end of the episode. You're still with me. Thank you. I really do appreciate that. What else could you do for me? Why don't you tell a friend about the show or leave a five star review? Maybe you could make sure you're following or subscribed in your podcast app. Go to YouTube and follow me, or Instagram, Tiktok. Oh gosh, here's one. Make sure you're following the podcast in the private Facebook group, as well as the public Facebook page. You don't want to miss, please. You not know about the private group. You have to join the private group. As of this recording, it has 51,000 members in it. They're active, talking about diabetes, whatever you need to know. There's a conversation happening in there right now, and I'm there all the time. Tag me. I'll say, hi, hey. What's up everybody? If you've noticed that the podcast sounds better, and you're thinking like, how does that happen? What you're hearing is wrong. Bob at wrong way. Recording, doing his magic to these files. So if you want him to do his magic to you, wrong way. Recording.com, you got a podcast. You want somebody to edit it. You want rob you.

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